Advice needed over dp's ex!!

[fifisboys]

To cut a long story short..

I live with my dp and we are engaged to be married next year. He has a 2 year old dd with his ex and she is refusing to let him bring her to meet me.
There is no reason behind it at all, she has even said she has no reason for it, other than she doesn't want her dd to be with me.

I was just wondering if, legally she can dictate who dp can introduce her dd to, and how we go about fighting this.

This is interesting.

I can see both sides of the argument here...particuarly with regards to those posters who feel it innappropiate for partners to 'move on ' as it were within an unacceptable time frame.

My partner left me and my 7wk old DD when she was seven weeks for another woman - a fact which he vehemently denies (presumably because he is embarrased? he prefers instead to claim they were friends, and that they got together after he left us).

He was taking my child to her sleep in her house when she was 3 months old, during his access vists. Her suggestion.

They bought a house together when our child was 10 months old.

They got married when our child was 22 months old, and the ow 'walked' down the aisle holding my DD.

One poster (maggieB, I think) said that she would be embarrased to be the partner of a man with such a small child. I have to agree with this sentiment, as I believe I would be also. However, was my exp's ow embarrassed? On the contrary, she has never, not even once, shown the slightest hint of sheepishness at the entire situation. In fact, she seems to have gloried in it - encouraging exp to harass me over various parenting issues, showing up at my DD's first birthday party and standing confidently before my friends and family.
I may be in danger of leading you to believe this woman to be a brash/loud/intellectually challenged harem of the first water. Quite the opposite; she is medical consultant in a hospital, quiet, demure, financially solvent.
She is also a parent herslf. This however, did not implore her to show me a shred of compassion.

As it stands, on an emotional level at least I have recovered greatly, and so the pain of seeing my daughter taken from in those early days and knowing where she going has somewhat faded. However, despite the outrage of my family and friends at the time, I will anever regret allowing my DD to go, because it has paid dividends in my child's relationship with her father. He is the one who will have to explain to our child that he was married to another woman by the time she was 22 months old, and s consequently, he can no longer deny that he was unfaithful. I have taken the proverbial high ground, however devasating it was for me at the time, and it was the right thing to do.

So, to conclude OP, yes, the child has a right to a relationship with her father - but please be realistic about the timeframe in which their family setup has dissolved, and the inevitable distress that this will have caused all parties.

You are not in a hurry.

Pinguthepenguin and everyone else....I just cannot see how a man who does this to his child's mother can turn around and say that he loves his child and is a devoted father. To me a person who does this is showing a lack of love towards the child. Big time.

A devoted father who loved his child would not disrespect the child's mother by having such a serious relationship with someone else so quickly. A person cannot behave so selfishly and then declare their undying love for the child and make demands.

I rarely post here but this has really wound me up. The sanctimony and antiquated attitudes are outrageous.

The man wants to see his child. The mother is being obstructive for reasons of her own with have nothing to do with the child's welfare, safety or happiness.

I fail to see why anyone is saying that her feelings need to be taken into account. The needs of the child are all that are important.

As others have said, if the man was not seeing, or trying to be with, his child he would be roundly and rightly critised.

If I were him I would be consulting a solicitor and having access agreed with the backup of the courts.

When my partner left us I threw up every single barrier and obstacle possible to prevent him seeing our child. Not because it was good for my child but because I hated him so much and was so angry that I wanted him to suffer and feel pain and the way I could do this was to stop him seeing the child he loves. I'm not proud of it but at the time I wasn't really thinking straight.

This mother sounds like the angry me and I fail to see why people would defend her. She is petty, vindictive and selfish. The earlier the child is integrated into the father's new family and domestic situation the happier s/he will be.

Waspie, if your h loved his child would he really have made you hurt like that?

The OP said that the mother didn't want the child to see her (the new gf). If she thinks that the gf is a bad influence than that his her right.

She made no statement about the child not seeing the father. If he loves his child so much why can't he see the child and make time for his dd away from the new gf? Can't do it can he. Because he doesn't love his dd enough.

pramspotter. I don't believe that the love a father has for his child is the same as the love he has for the child's mother. They are exclusive.

In my particular situation, and this really is my personal opinion- I believe that because my child's father left when she was so young, he had not formed a bond strong enough to make him consider his actions sufficiently. He literally met this woman and had pulled us apart within 3 weeks.
What followed, is that he went completely the other way when the 'dust' had settled, and was very over-zealous about his contact with DD, and was constantly making demands about how she should be parented. I knew from his tone that they were not his words- but hers. I could see very clearly, even in my abject agoncy, that both exp and ow were 'acting out' as it were, being zealous about DD in an attempt to prove that they weren't complete bastards after all.
They are still quite bad,two years on - will undermine me quite frequently, and it is a burden I have to bear, because I genuninely, and wholeheartedly believe their behaviour to be born out of how they feel about themselves.

As it stands my lovely dd has just this week turned two and we are getting on with life.
Exp and his now wife still trouble me,although only ever really psychologically ifyswim. I always end up feeling unnerved whenever another comment is made, or a reminder that they keep a 'contact diary' incase its ever needed/ (dd has been going there, completely undisputed twice a week since 6 months old, so i dont know why they keep it, but ho hum). Howeve, on good days, like today, I can rationalise their behaviour as something they do because they feel they have to. In an ideal world, we'd all just get on with the job of parenting DD and living our lives, but the fact that they wish to make such a song and dance about it, to me, speak volumes about how their reality, i.e exp (with the help of new wife) 'sweat the small stuff over DD because they have little control over the things that really matter' .

And that, I'm afraid, was exp's choice.

"I don't believe that the love a father has for his child is the same as the love he has for the child's mother. They are exclusive"

Don't agree with that at all. Sorry. They are part of the same thing. A man who loved his family and wanted the best for his kids should be incapable of wanting another woman. Most men can't pull this off however. It's just not in them, that kind of selfless love. Tis why I have so little respect for most of them, and don't think that they are the good loving fathers that they claim to be.

Pramspotter - yes absolutely. He loves his child. Loving his child does not mean he has to love me.

Nor does the fact that I love my child mean that I have to love his father.

You can no longer have romantic love type feelings for someone but still have general love and respect. It is also possible to end a relationship responsibly.

I don't know why so many people think that they cannot end a romantic relationship without showing complete contempt for their child's family unit. It can be done. A person can end a marriage and move on without showing contempt etc for the child. People like OP's dp don't seem to be able to do this. Moving on and getting engaged so quickly shows contempt for the child. Surely, he could spend time with the child etc without involving the new gf at least for awhile.

Pramspotter - if you and your DH split up you are going to be a very sad lonely lady and your kids are going to have no idea of how you are to act in a normal loving relationship - and when they are grown up and hopefully more sensible than you and have a normal relationship with someone then they are going to move on and get a life and when they ask you why you don't have one and you tell them it is because of them I am sure their hearts will bleed with the selflessness of your actions but they will be thinking - bloody hell she should have got her with her life years ago!

The woman holding back contact should be bloody well strung up - fifi - get your DP to go tp court and get sone structured contact agreed.

"Most men can't pull this off however. It's just not in them, that kind of selfless love. Tis why I have so little respect for most of them, and don't think that they are the good loving fathers that they claim to be."

What a horrendous generalisation. So parents can only love their children if they stay together? What about accidental pregnancies that occur early on in a relationship? It is exactly this kind of attitude that makes people think they must "do the right thing" and get married, which is inevitably not the right thing in the long run, and more people end up getting hurt. A child is surely better off with two loving but separated parents, than in a household full of isolation and conflict. Children emulate the relationships they grow up around, and this would be storing up misery for their future. Two examples of healthy loving relationships, albeit with step-parents, have to be better for a child a loveless and fraught one between their parents if they stay in the same house.

I never said that people need to stay together to prove their love for their children. I just said that they need to act like grown-ups.

Madame, I didn't say that I would stay single forever, although the thought is appealing. I said that I would wait a long time, until my dc were less vulnerable, before dating again.

Jesus, you people should really read posts before responding. I never said that people should stay in an unhappy marriage if there is no way that they can improve things.

I'm sorry Pramspotter but I think you are totally and completely wrong. Of course it's possible to end a relationship amicably but I don't understand at all why this man, and any other who split with their partners (we aren't all married), are showing "contempt". He loves the child, he doesnt love the mother. That's not contempt it's just not living a lie.

He wants a relationship with the child that is currently being limited and impeded by the mother. In my opinion keeping the child away from the father is detrimental to the child.

I agree with IveGotHamButImNotAHam (glad I don't have to type that often ).

Pramspotter you said you would stay single until your Dc went to university - thats a long time - I will be 54 when my youngest goes to uni

That would be my own personal choice. I will be a lot younger than you. I wouldn't expect anyone else to wait that long, just to show a little respect. I think 2 years is too soon to be married again. It's a bit of a slap in the face.

I love my dh and everything but if anything happened to him I really do think I would prefer the single life. I don't have a very good opinion of men in general.

Ah well think we shall agree to disagree ok??
Not entirely sure how you would read my situation though
Xh and I split up 3 years ago this week ! He then spent the next 6 months or so playing me and OW to and fro !!
We then tried to "date" and see if we could make a go of it - and I got pregnant (unplanned) about 2 and half yrs ago! DD2 is 19 months!
We slept together on the odd occasion until about a year ago and I got together with new DP about 6 months ago!
Too fast ??

My ex met his partner 2 months after he moved out, they have been together for 12 years now

I had no problem with it at all. They waited about 6 months before introducing her to the children. It does children good to see a happy relationship, even if it isn't their parents. Otherwise, they will grow up without experience of relationships

Pramspotter, I think you would act very differently if you were in that position

And hasn't this childs mother now got a partner? If she has moved on, then of course thefather should be allowed to also. It doesn't mean they love the child any less

Op I am sure things will settle with you in time but not if you push it through court. I know you want to support your partner and that is admirable but this little girl isnt yours and you must step back. That said, unless your partner is a violent alchoholic, he should not be being dictated to and messed about like this - it isnt doing any good for his relationship with his little girl at all - the bond between them is crucially being formed at her age and he is being forced to miss out so I certainly think he should suggest mediation to resolve the issue over access then leave it for six months or so before really pushing the involvement of you. Ultimately however they arent together anymore and she cannot use his daughter as a ransome note to control what he does so I think that if you have been together for anything more then a year she is being unreasonable.

so MaggieBee/ Pramspotter what you are saying is that a child of two is the sole possession of the mother who is to dictate exactly whom to hand the child too, including the person who had a fifty percent say in its conception - your attitude is at best a dim reflection on the ability of our society to understand that men are as entitled to be an equal and fair influence on the raising of its child and at worst utterly terrifying and the reason parental responsibility was introduced in 2003 - I assume you have heard of it. Fathers are not second class citizens, and that sort of clingy, claustrophobic needy attitude will see a child grow up with some very distorted views on life and relationships.

P.S Mac you dirty mare - no respect you!!!!

"so MaggieBee/ Pramspotter what you are saying is that a child of two is the sole possession of the mother who is to dictate exactly whom to hand the child too, including the person who had a fifty percent say in its conception - your attitude is at best a dim reflection on the ability of our society to understand that men are as entitled to be an equal and fair influence on the raising of its child"

....hmmmm Can't speak for Maggie but I am not so sure that men really have the ability to love their kids more than they love their dicks. It's something that needs to be taken into consideration when we try and do what is best for the children. Sooner that society can admit this the better, even if it is painful.

Macdoodle, I don't really care what you do. At the end of the day you know what is best for you and your kids.

Wow Pram. I am very, very sorry for you. You must have had some rotten experiences to have formed such a devestatingly low opinion of 50% of the world's population.

Rindercella, it's true. People don't want to admit it because it's not politically correct etc.

Pram, just because you say it's true does not make it so.

I think it's really sad that your experiences have led you to think so little of men, pramspotter. There some really good men out there you know.

What happens if the man has no choice in the break-up? Should he be incapable of loving another woman then? What if he never loved the mother of his child in the first place or vice versa? And should a woman who loves her children be incapable of loving another man? Sorry, but I am really struggling to understand your thinking pramspotter. IMO the love for your partner and for your child are separate things.

There are so many different scenarios and dynamics for something like this to be a one size fits all. You just have to work out what is best in your own situation and for your own children.

Pramspotter I actualy feel very for you what a sad sorry bitter existence you must lead!
I honestly dont give a flying f* what you think, my story was to demonstrate that actually their may be far more behind the apprant outside than anyone realises! I wasnt actually asking if you approve
And yes you have tried to tell people on this thread what is right and wrong accroding to your very patronising bizarre views and moral code!