Emotional Abuse - can we talk abou t it and what it entails?

[Janos]

If we already have a thread on this then I apologise for bringing it all up again. Perhaps someone can let me know and if so I'll let the thread die quietly!

I just thought it would be helpful to talk about it, and what constitutes it so people who are in an emotionally abusive relationship could recognise what is going on as it can be so insidious and nasty, and more difficult to identify.

This is not for one moment to denigrate or draw attention away from physical or sexual abuse btw.

ditzzy
Is the way he makes you feel what you want the rest of your ife to be like?
You deserve proper love, and that means respect
Is this the reationship you woud want a friend to be in?

Just ooked at ex's phone records (does that make me abusive? They are in my name) and called a number he rang a ot on a night he cashed a £600 cheque (and didn't give us a penny) - it was a number where they send out prostitutes. I don't have sex with him any more,so fine if he wants sex elsewhere though shows how hypocritical he is re his love yous etc, but feel he shouldn't be paying for it when we need the money.

I got fed up of having sex with someone who just wanted to look over my shoulder at porn, and felt totally used

Macdoodle, you just made me laugh out loud. I've had the elephant comment so many times (not just for the stairs - he also asked if he could hear an elephant trumpeting in the bathroom with me ) He used to call me BFD as a nickname in front of all my friends - they didn't know it stood for 'big fat ditzzy' (appropriate initial changed obviously!)

Thats something I need to remember from when I moved out - how nice it was to egt in from work and not have to hurtle round trying to get everything done efficiently. It took me weeks to learn that; I would get in, and start mentally working out what order to do everything in, and then realise I didn't actually have to do any of it at all... there was noone to tell me off for not hanging my coat up, or dinner not being ready, or the kitchen being in a mess.

I do know I want more. I do know I can have more. I just need reminding sometimes. I don't know how I could ever be with anyone else though! I just want to be on my own, and not let anyone anywhere near.

don't worry, waver over. (for now)

ditzzy I dont know how I could ever be with anyone else either, but its nice not to care and enjoy my own headspace

Good looking old flame and I have a day out planned with his DS and my DD. Do not want to be back with him, just enjoying the company.

Well I finally got throught to WA today and they have given me two numbers for local groups so will be trying them. They also mentioned that housing benefit is available if you have to leave your home if you are in situation of domestic abuse so that was encouraging to know.
Walking on eggshells this morning as h bombarded me with his latest theories on society and that we will all shortly be living under military rule. If I'd thought of it at the time I could have said that I already feel like I'm living under military rule anyway. Noticed he had a sort of nervous tick going on in his cheek at the time which was a little scary.
Sad thing was I had a couple of hours after work and before collecting kids and I actually found myself wondering around the supermarket rather than going home to face more of that crap.
Not good.
But I then got through to WA and am definitely feeling that I am starting to do something positive. Reading all your stories those of you who have moved on is so encouraging.

Just a general waffle , my brains way of making sense of the things ive learned.

After hours and hours of counselling and reading stacks of books i think im finally able to understand whats happened.

Ex turd has a free pass. Its not real, it exists only in his warped brain .
On his free pass is a special certificate entitling him to treat me any way he likes,,, because im his wife.
. Id known him a long time before we dated, id never seen any evidence of his free pass, but thats because its strictly for use with partners only.

Had i been his colleague, his neighbour, i wouldve been treated with respect and decency , as his wife we all know its a differant story.

His free pass card is double sided, on one side it clearly states he is entitled to abuse me , his pass gives him permission, on the other side there is a list of all the unrealistic things i should do for him, meet all his needs endlessly without question.

As his expectations are so ridiculous he constantly feels disapointed and angry,, and flips his free pass over and waves the " im entitled to abuse you because your my wife " side at me.

It was impossible to have any real relationship due to his pass , it IS real, its so deeply imbedded it probably cant be removed,, and although he cant use it with me anymore, it will lie dormant until his next partner comes along, where he will whip it out and wave it around again.
His pass will go everywhere with him , it cant be fixed or cured or loved away.

Im told that women with healthy boundarys will reject his free pass early on,,but eventually, if hes lucky, he might meet someone who has the equivelant of his free pass, a special excuse card her beleifs are written on, entitling her partner to abuse her, with a list of reasons and excuses for him all ready made.Like me.

Ive only just stopped beating myself up about the massive screw up i made. I didnt know he had a free pass , and i didnt know that i was walking around with a matching excuse card , eager to excuse and minimixe his behaviour. I though he was the best i could do.

I dont think mines fully removed yet, but i know its there now, i think its half way out.

this makes a lot of sense to me...

It's a week now since I left and then came back and already the minimisation has begun. As I've been quieter than usual since coming back, he asked me what was wrong. I asked him if he wanted me to speak to our GP about counselling, or did he want to do it himself. Then began the tirade about how what I did was disgraceful, disgusting etc, what was I goinjg to do to address my part in all this, what counselling was I having to address my issues that are resposible for his behaviour, he hadn;t been that bad to the kids (telling his 6 month old son to "Fing shut up, you fing little S", several times, yelling at our 2yr old DD "F you already" and telling her that I had a hidden agenda and was accusing Daddy of doing things he hadn't done - she came up to me the other day and said "Mummy, stop hurting Daddy")and that he hadn't actually hit me, just tapped me on the side of the head. My HV is coming over next week and I plan to talk to her about it as well, and see what she says. Why do I still feel like I need a more 'valid' reason to leave him? Even though I know he is abusive, I still feel as though I don't have enough of a reason to leave - I know that sounds quite weak, and that WA suggested that I leave because the way he sometimes talks to the kids is child abuse, and that he could be potentially violent again, but I just feel so confused. I feel like I just need someone to say "It's okay, this is really bad". I keep rem,embering when he said to me "I'm going to kill myself but I'm going to kill you first, becuase you are worthless" and how he minimised it afterwards as just because he was tired and was just 'joking'. I feel as though I don't have the right to complain about it as it was 9 months ago. Sorry everyone, but my brain has just been going round in circles this last week - I think in a way, leaving and then coming back has made things worse for me and even more confusing!

Cloudbase, this IS really bad.
Get as much support as you can , feeling you have no right to complain is a result of the abuse your suffering. If you feel you can perhaps aproach your gp regarding counselling and your local domestic violence team , theres loads of support out there.

Sadly i had no support , i didnt seek any as i really didnt beleive i was being abused, its only since hes gone that i realise how bad it was. Hows that for self denial!

Personally , i think that accepting your being abused by someone you love is the hardest part of all this.

Blimey HopefullandFree, that analogy is absolutely brilliant. I hope you don't mind, I am going to copy and paste this and amend it a bit. It is just what I need to help me to explain to DS (aged 18) who is still living with DH and experiencing abuse, what is going on and it is not his fault.

I left H 6 weeks ago and have a rented cottage with lovely room for DS but he seems to be too afraid to spend much time with me. He knows H is abusive and that he's being bullied which is the worst hurdle over, but I believe he is in the grip of Traumatic Bonding and cannot leave.

This will be a great help. Have you considered writing a book?

Hopefullandfree - fantastic analogy - I hope you don't mind but I'm going to borrow it

Is very difficult to describe , or to put into words what it is that happens with these men. Thats the only way i can make sense of it, it leaves no room for why hes done this or that , the endless questions we ask ourselves.

I can tell my excuse card is nearly gone, ive realised that ex turd is not the only person in my life that has this free pass, and ive taken steps to remove him, and anyone else who has such a pass, out of my life.
Bollocks to feeling sorry for them and bollocks to making excuses for them.I deserve better, and so does everyone.

Am Thinking about returning to uni , something my ex turd would have laughed at , and something i wouldnt have had the confidence to consider if he was here.

Have promised myself from now on im going to be my own best freind. Removing my excuse card has been like brain surgery and the most difficult thing ive ever done.

In truth, nearly all the people in my life, parents, family, have had a free pass so completeley normal for me.
Ex turd often gloated how he only did these things to me, not any more he doesnt!
Hes now sat by himself smelling his own farts and feeling outraged i dared to come away!

More waffling, sorry.
Ive also realised that the free pass does not expire when you kick their fat arses out.
In my case turd seems to have written himself some new entitlements on it ,and therefore feels even more entitled to be abusive than ever now !
He is enraged, his little wife wont take his crap no more.

I assume this pass will expire once hes using it with someone else, maybe it can only be used with one person at a time !?

Anyway, in my mind, hes now a fat little man, squeezing his enormous bulk onto an invisable throne, crown tilted on his head , bellowing to his aids to come and tend to his whims, getting more and more angry because no one comes running anymore.
Everyones gone now, and even the jester is laughing at him.

I envisage him occasionally pausing from his bellowing to feel sorry for himself and to sniff his own farts.
Strange , i know, but it works for me !

Once you realise youve got an excuse card, once you start to rewrite the things that are written on it, it really does get easier.

Oh dear, sorry, ive just re read and realised that i keep making referances to his farts.
Its because it was disgusting and a symbol of the disrespect he had for me,, he would do massive stinky farts then expect sex, and honestly thought that as he was all important king i should be grateful for having the opportunity to smell them.

Perhaps this fart obsession is something i need to speak to my counseller about !

hopefull, not at all, you are just venting are you not?
And he was obsessed with farts, not you, so dont worry!

Also think the free pass is a fantastic analogy. I have rewritten mine so no one is allowed to disrespect me any more.
Thing is I no longer know what to say to ex - once again he has asked when he can see DD. I am not sure so have texted saying "Dont know"

Digitalis hope the analogy works for your DS.

Cloudbase it IS inexcusable what he is doing to you. Please dont hesitate to tell HV and anyone else what is going on. Mine was fantastically supportive and I owe her a lot.

"then began the tirade about how what I did was disgraceful, disgusting etc, what was I goinjg to do to address my part in all this, what counselling was I having to address my issues that are resposible for his behaviour"

What a surprise His abusing you is your fault. He isn't responsible for his behaviour. Funny how they always use the same lines. Funny how nothing they do is their fault. Funny how responsibility is for other people.

You are not responsible for his abuse. He is. I'm sure that on some level you know that, but I wanted to reinforce it from an outside perspective.

"telling his 6 month old son to "Fing shut up, you fing little S", several times, yelling at our 2yr old DD "F you already" and telling her that I had a hidden agenda and was accusing Daddy of doing things he hadn't done - she came up to me the other day and said "Mummy, stop hurting Daddy"

Oh my god. This is so bad, so awful. Your children are being abused. WA were absolutely right. I'm so sad for your kids, and you.

"I keep rem,embering when he said to me "I'm going to kill myself but I'm going to kill you first, becuase you are worthless" and how he minimised it afterwards as just because he was tired and was just 'joking'."

This is as serious as a heart attack. It's no goddamned joke. You do not have to live with this abuse and these terrifying threats.

IT'S OK THIS IS REALLY BAD

Oh, and this-

"I asked him if he wanted me to speak to our GP about counselling"

You cannot change him. You are not in the position of control.Forget counselling. He's past counselling. He's an abuser. Studies have shown that counselling isn't effective at stopping abusers abusing, and it can sometimes make them far worse.

You can only leave.

Stark and difficult, but true.

Second what dizietsma said.
When they call us worthless, that is revealing EXACTLY why they abuse us. Because they truly believe that we deserve nothing better.
Mine called me a "selfish worthless b*tch"

The times when they are supposedly "nice" count for absolutely nothing. They do not make the abuse any more tolerable or excusable. Decent people would treat you with respect and consideration and respect consistently, not when they feel like it.

There is a vital shift in your mindset which occurs when you dont just understand that they are abusive, but also that you can make a choice to walk away, because you are better than them, and that they will never change, and have always been abusive, and you look back on the relationship with fresh perspective and see exactly how they hooked you and minimised/excused/blamed.

If only I had read "Living With the Dominator" before I met ex! Her early warning signs for "The Liar" are spot on:

Early ?Liar?. This Liar may tell us he has a failed relationship. He will have a sob story about a horrible woman who took all his money and now will not let him see his children. ... He will accept no responsibility for any of this and will blame his former partner for giving him a bad time... He may tell us he is the victim of domestic violence.

That describes my ex EXACTLY.

If you want to read more warning signs they are here

Hopefulandfree your analogy is fab, sums up everything so well.

Cloudbase - I know how easy it is to sit there thinking maybe it's not that bad, I've done it myself. Before contacting WA I was wondering what I'd say, because when it came to it,it felt like there wasn't really anything that bad happening. And like you, some things are a while ago.
But it IS bad. It IS unacceptable. If nothing else,please focus on the threat he made to your life... these things really do happen. Please get help and support so you can leave, and this time stay away.

I've told him I know he spent money we needed on a prostitute. Funnily enough he wasn't keen to discuss it. He tells me he plans to stay here tomorrow night - what I want is insignificant of course.If it suits him,that's what should happen. I've told him not to expect me to help himout, or do things he wants me to do any more- i have told him that I will use the mantra "this man sleeps with prostitutes" to remind me of exactly why I have no responsibility towards him.If he would pay for sex and risk his kids losing their home, he is unutterably despicable. I just need to hold that in my head, instead of the image of the reasonable, pleasant man he is presenting to me at the moment.

"i have told him that I will use the mantra "this man sleeps with prostitutes" to remind me of exactly why I have no responsibility towards him.If he would pay for sex and risk his kids losing their home, he is unutterably despicable. I just need to hold that in my head, instead of the image of the reasonable, pleasant man he is presenting to me at the moment."

Sounds like a good mantra.

Thank goodness you are no longer having sex with him! I would consider testing anyway though. If he's using prostitues now, there's no telling if he used them in the past when you were sexualy active with him.

Stay strong.

Just wanted to say to anyone hesitating ringing WA to give them a try. I finally got through yesterday and they are so helpful. I've now got local numbers to ring.

My h is currently on best behaviour and normally it is so easy to crumble and think maybe things aren't so bad but now that I've started to talk to people it's making it easier to keep going with my ultimate plan to leave him (or preferably get him to leave).

Cloudbase - reckon your h and mine went to the same school they cerainly learnt the same lines...'addressing my part in all of it' and 'hidden agendas' are straight out of his mouth too!

He once told me that when I do nice things for him he has to examine them to check the 'hidden agenda' that I must have..

Onelife, is there any way you can prevent him staying?Does he still have keys?
I liked the old "well you can come round if you like, but I won't be in" line.
Yes, please stay strong. That reasonable man is just a facade hiding the despicable creep who thinks nothing of wasting money that should be feeding and clothing his children, on prostitutes.
I am sure you are also aware that the use of the prostitute had verylittle to do with sex and was probably more about control and punishing you the most hurtful and extreme way he could think of. It's withholding money taken to the next level.

NK1 I am so glad you got through to WA - they are fantastic aren't they
LOL at hidden agenda - talk about projection!!

Does anyone remember what I said a week ago? How I had spoken to H, and he was very reasonable and accepted that we have to split up and how he said he was going to try and work some miracle to 'win me back'... well, this morning he's just acted completely shocked because I want to start telling friends and going to things (well a wedding in the summer specifically) on my own!! Apparently he didn't really think I meant what I said last week and he thought that if he did everything I wanted him to do (he has been on charm offensive all week) then we would be ok again.

Well, at least thats made me remember that I don't want to be with someone who can't take a single opinion I have seriously.

Ditzzy thats so typical isnt it.
Mine was told frequently to quit or id divorce him.
He didnt so i did.
Now, he actually screams that " from june to july i didnt abuse you once, and still it made no differance , it wasnt enough for you!".
Yes, because keeping his nasty mouth shut for a couple of weeks didnt cancel out years of abuse.

When i have pointed out the very serious things he has done, he,ll say " what about all the nice things i did for you " as though that should cancel it all out .

More disturbingly, he can actually name all the times , things he has done for me, referring to them almost as acts of sainthood or something, when in fact, they are just normal things that people do for each other.
His veiws are so distorted that he actually expected massive credit for treating me normally.

Mine got worse and worse each year, i assume as the years went by he wrote more and more entitlements on his free pass.Some of the entitlements he felt he had 2 years ago, he didnt have say 5 years ago.
If someone was to remove it from his brain, i imagine it being like one of those joke lists that comedians have thats metres and metres long.

Ive found it helpfull to make a list of my own entitlements and rights , and compare it to his .
Mines this simple, i have the right to be treated with respect and decency.

I left an EA years ago, so relieved I did.
We were only together a year, but that was long enough.

I have had 2 friends who married EAs, who left and went on to much better things (one of them was not allowed to pick up her baby after 6pm "because you should be paying attention to me now").
Sadly, I have lost contact with another who married an EA as I was not considered to be a "suitable" friend for her. He had her cat put down while she was at work because "animals should know their place". I did try to get her to leave him, believe me. It was gut wrenching.

To anyone who is dithering whether to leave their EA partner please bear in mind the possible future you and you children may have. A friend has an EA dad and when her mum had a stroke and was lying in hospital paralysed down one side, unable to speak with drips and tubes all over the place he stood over her bed yelling "what do you think you are doing woman? Who is going to look after me, get out of bed and come home. Here I am left with 3 useless daughters and you just lying there. Get up woman" and similar, at full volume. This was in front of all 3 daughters, nurse and friends.

The poor woman was completely immobile, but she could hear all this going on. It was so awful and I wouldn't want anyone to get that in their future.

Sadly these men do all work from the same script, and it is all about them. You can't reason with them because they are inherently unreasonable.

Well done to all those who escaped. I expect freed slaves in ancient Rome felt the same way when they were manumitted.

More pondering ( its not about farts ).
I often wonder about this free pass , and where it comes from .
I think my turds pass has been implanted by his parents, they both have a sense of entitlement and have ridiculous expectations.People frequently fall out with them as they reject their abusive behaviour, and you can honestly see them puzzled and outraged , they have done nothing wrong, ever and simply cant grasp that other people just dont have to put up with it.

Ie, had i met his parents as a casual aquaintence im sure they would have been loveley to me. As i met them as his sons girlfreind this gave them rights and immediateley they felt they could be rude and intrusive ,immediate special rights over me as i was seeing their son.

Has anyone else noticed that their turds parents / family also has a free pass ?

More rambling , i remember one night spilling all to a freind, i knew as i was about to say it that once i did, it would become real, and it did. My freind was flabbergasted and all my thoughts of " is it me, my fault ect " completeley vanished .
Repeating his nasty remarks and manipulitive comments out loud to someone else sounded utterly ridiculous and i could not beleive that i had ever considered them to be valid points.

I realised that over the years i had been so ashamed and downtrodden i had unwittingly joined him in keeping his abuse a secret , making it easier for him to convince me i was wrong, at fault, worthless ect.

I hope everyone here has people in real life they can speak to about this , i think after years of abuse our perceptions become so distorted that it can be very difficult to judge whats right or wrong.

And i didnt mention farts once !