Should I be cross if DH went to lap dancing club?

[ActingNormal]

...and spent £60 on private dances (we aren't poor and he doesn't spend money on much that is frivolous).

Other people seem to think I should be cross but I can't see it. Am I being a mug? Is it a sign of disrespect?

He got a bit of female attention outside the marriage. He was consenting. They were consenting. I knew he was going there. There doesn't seem like there is a risk of him forming a relationship with the women but if a woman behaved that way with him in a regular nightclub that seems more of a threat to me.

He came home horny as hell and seemed like he had a good break from the stress of his job.

So my final point, before I retire for the evening, is that I do not believe that men have been victims of sexual assault or rape to anything like the degree that women have.

But, crucially, what bearing does this have on the OP?

It's a familiar straw man, a distraction from the issue under discussion, which is: is it right that our culture should celebrate the men who buy women's bodies?

i havent caught up since last night but just wanted to see if PinkTulips had been back on here-
piktulips-i do want to apologise for causing you offense on this thread.i admit i got wound up and carried away with the prostition thing and my remarks on that subject were pretty ignorant.i'm sorry.

and fwiw i think your post of 18:03:58 was pretty spot-on.

oh thank god dittany. It seemed utterly ludicrous, and the only thing I could think of was that their terms were so broad that they included being winked at or something.

thank you divastrop.

i didn't exactly respond overly politely to the prostitution comments so i think we're more than fair and square anyway

Dittany: I still don't get why you think that pretending to feel sexual desire is something that everyone would find horrible. Is it because you think that all sex workers' clients are verbally or physically abusive (ie insult the sex worker or touch in ways intended to hurt or harm)? In many commercial sex transactions, the client is polite and friendly, aware that he is buying a fantasy (and buying fantasies is quite a thriving business: all those 'gifts' of Be A Star For A Day etc).

would like to point out though, it wasn't being called a prostitute that offended. it was people insisting i did a job i didn't that irritated me iyswim?

it would be like insisting on calling a nurse a doctor simply because they both work in the same industry. yes they both do something a bit similar and possibly have some of the same clientele. it doesn't make the jobs they do the same

have just googled, in ireland the stats for DV are quite odd, apparently more women than men are perpetrators of DV

here

male victims of DV are far more likely to have a knife used on them or to be threatened with a knife, hit with an object, kicked, bitten or have something thrown at them. Women are more likely to beaten up, threatened with a gun, choked, victims of drowning attempts, have their hair pulled or be pushed, grabbed or shoved.

as for the rape stats..... i'm not sure why it has to be completely equal for it to be as horrific men and women are raped every second of every day..... why is it less horrific for one sex just because it happens less to them? in fact, those men that are raped are more likely to be gang raped, beaten up and even killed than women.

there are evil men and evil women in this world. my point is you can't brand all men as potential rapists just because some are, similarily you can't say all women are potential victims without accepting that all men are too.

i don't see this as a diversion form the op, i see this issue as necessary to discuss given some of the very sexist remarks made against men on this thread.

pinktulips you are being disingenuous or dim. The figures only have to be equal because you said they were. You were challenged, and proven wrong.

This is crazy logic. The fact that men are raped (by other men) is horrific. But it has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not lapdancers are being abused or exploited by their clients. Bringing it into the discussion is like saying 'but there are some bad nurses' during a debate about poor rates of pay in the NHS. It may be true, but it's irrelevant, and it cannot stand in place of reasoned argument about the subject under discussion.

Oh OBM, I do like the way you put it.

I have to say, on a personal level, I can't imagine meeting someone who stripped for a living and instantly feeling more moral and above them. This may say more about me than them but as I have the arrogance and self esteem to believe this to be true then I don't supposed I'm bothered why I feel like that. I feel their profession adds the issue of the identity of a woman having to include how 'sexy' she is, when this is measured by breast size and body shape. The instant monetary gratification of celebrity has much to do with this, FHM and lads mags making a singers/actresses career on the basis of how good the air brushing and how much she's wearing. These women all mistakenly think that they are the ones with power???? This industry is also part of human trafficking and forced prostitution. In my city the lap dancing clubs are near brothels, we have many I regret to say. Brothels are near areas of smack head street whores and so on, just around the corner is a worse off and more vunerable woman. I personally visited a 'family' of prostitutes the youngest one was 10, the oldest was the mother's oldest sister . It must be pleasant being so blissfully ignorant that when you remove your clothes and strip for money buying into the myth that these are your terms that someone makes more money out of your body than you do and that you contribute to a dispicable and damaging industry.

Rather that I didn't feel I was more moral and above.... oops.

my point onebat is that no one knows the true figures for rape, more women perpeptrate DV and sexyal harrassment goes both ways. men aren't vicious scumbags who just need to see a lap dancer to be incited into rape and abuse.

of course some lap dancers are exploited.

some restaurant workers are exploited.

some barworkers are exploited.

some PR people are exploited.

some nurses are exploited.

NOT ALL ARE, in fact a very tiny minority are.

I think that your definition of exploitation differs from mine PinkTulips

"men aren't vicious scumbags who just need to see a lap dancer to be incited into rape and abuse."

I didn't suggest this at all. But this kind of massive oversimplification is a familiar technique for making anyone who isn't flag-waving for the sex industry seem like a moronic but nevertheless potent threat to The Free World.

What I do believe is that our society's celebration of the men who support this industry (an industry which, as Twelvelegs points out, is on a continuum of increasing and devastating exploitation) is fundamentally linked to the fact that our culture perceives women's bodies to be, in some vital way, up for grabs.

So while lapdancing doesn't cause rape, it is an expression of a culture which, for the same reason it celebrates lap-dancing, turns a blind eye to rape.

Very, very well said Twelvelegs. Lapdancing is indeed on a continuum - a continuum which does nothing for women.

OBM, continuum, now there's a word I should have used!!

'So while lapdancing doesn't cause rape, it is an expression of a culture which, for the same reason it celebrates lap-dancing, turns a blind eye to rape.'

this sums it up for me.

i dont believe that men go to lap dancing clubs,come out with a stiffy and grab the first woman who walks past,drags her into an alley and rapes her.its far more subtle than that.most rapes dont get reported,because the woman was drunk,or wearing little clothing,or was on a date with the man and agreed to go back to his place,or married to the rapist so knows theres no point in going to the police.in alot of those cases i think the man often cant see that hes done anything wrong,and i thinks thats what happens when its generally accepted that womens bodies are theere for the taking.

I have been on many hen nights where we have gone to see men strip and some of the women have had lapdances from the men. Is this a case of society seeing mens' bodies as up for grabs?

Good point Nicey. When I think about things I've done to men while drunk in pubs/clubs, pinched bottoms, slapped bottoms, put my arms round them, made suggestive comments, I don't feel I was in danger of being done for sexual assault but if a man does these things to a woman and she takes offence he is more likely to be done for sexual assault or at least harrassment. So it seems like women are more more protected by the law than men and men are more 'up for grabs'

Dittany I just googled that and apparently it was rubuked by the bar association. I was shocked to learn that the original judge was a woman.

Ok. I doubt my dad ever went to lap dancing clubs, I know my brother doesn't, I know my OH has and possibly will again if on a stag do.

Do I kick up a fuss about this? No - because I trust the fact that he wouldn't go further than just a lap dance.

Seems to be that you either hate the whole sex trade, or you are prepared to accept that some men like to visit these places. Some will do it constantly and continuously whether in a realtionship or not, some will go when the opportunity arises.

Simple fact is that some men are sleaze balls who would cheat on their partners given the opportunity. It doesn't naturally follow that all men would behave like this even if they do go to these places.

The OP seems secure in the knowledge that her OH has treated it only as a bit of titilation and fun but would never be a usual frequenter of these kinds of places, and certainly would never cross any lines.

So - I don't think the OP should be castigated for not worrying. It shows a trust and an understanding of what her OH is likely to do.

'Simple fact is that some men are sleaze balls who would cheat on their partners given the opportunity. It doesn't naturally follow that all men would behave like this even if they do go to these places.'

and some women would consider thier oh having a semi(or fully?)naked woman gyrating on them for sexual pleasure to be cheating in itself(i would have thought any woman in an exclusively monogomous relationship would have but my time on MN has shown me that many women find anything other than full penetrative sex with someone else perfectly acceptabe).

i wouldnt compare rape/sexual assault with a pinch on the bum or a suggestive comment in a nightclub myself.i dont know of any women who,having pinched a mans arse and getting told to sod off,would then get angry and try to grope the man saying he was a bastard and shouldnt have worn such tight trousers if he didnt want anyone to touch.

OK, but we are saying here that the problem with women lapdancing is that it reinforces the view that women's bodies are commodities to be bought. Presumably that is also the problem with men lapdancing?

Divastrop: the fact is, every woman has their own 'line in the sand' as to what constitutes cheating.

As I have previously said, I know women who won't let their husbands talk to another woman; I have had one woman DRAG her husband by the arm away from me at a party!! (I can assure you I was NOT behaving inappropriately with him; I'm not into midgets).

To me, kissing would be out of bounds, but a lapdance is fairly harmless. To me it is just a bit of escapism and I am not threatened by it as there is no emotional connection.

To other women, sex with other people is acceptable within the bounds of a relationship.

You just can't apply your own standards to everyone.