Glam & fab part 7 - from strength to strength

[UC]

Thought I'd start this one off on a positive spin? Hope you all find it..

men - emotional affair (snort) - probably being hideously sexist here but the only thing which would stop it being sexual is the fear of losing what they already have. I once had this conversation with my ex "why wouldnt you cheat on me"...."well I wouldnt want to lose you?"....not I feel its morally wrong because i'm committed to you.

Of course we all look (dont we?), we would all love to shg the handsome aquaintance just for something different but we know* its wrong and we would hurt our partner and children - you just have to know where the boundaries are.

I think that is part of it -when you knew you knew iyswim.

I fear that i wont believe myself again if things get that bad - at the moment h is great at the reasuarnce thing - but for so long i had 'asked' him if anything was going on - and believed him i am just not sure what to do anymore. I sort of feel as if i dont remember what 'normal' feels like.

I am not on tenderhooks or actually think anything is going on i suppose i just dont trust myself yet.

Good point WW

Thats exactally what my h says would stop him doing it again - the fear of losing me.

Now i think about it that is not enough is it - i should be demanding it is because he wants only me and values that more than the fear of not being able to have me.
I am not scared of losing him now - but i also dont have a desire to shag around either.

I still think it is something childish and selfish in men that make them justify it to themselves - the fear of 'missing out' is greater than the fear of losing everything - and they think they are so clever so as not to get caught. They know it is wrong but dont believe it will mean the end of anything either. whereas if they say no - they have lost that chance.

So maybe men just see the loss as oppossed to the gain?

Maybe we have to just accept it then.

otherwise we would all be fighting over the few moral men who were not afraid to show it. .

I guess it's a good thing if they never do it again, whatever the reasons behind it, although the fact that it is morally wrong and causes hurt to the people they love most is a no brainer in my book!!!
Ex is swearing blind that he is going to give up drinking now, going to get help bla bla bla (. When I ask him why he says "because I don't want to lose you and the dc" or "because I love you!"... but the real reason I think is "because I don't want you to meet someone else and move on!"
Either way it will never work because the right answer would be "for myself!"
Unfortunately he's not reached that point yet

PP - Glad you are enjoying your free time. I know what you mean about a break from the responsibility. I didn't feel much like going out on Sunday night but because the dc were away I forced myself to. but I'd have been happier at home in front of the telly.
But it feels such a waste to stay in when they are not there!!!
Now they are back I'm wondering when my next opportunity will be

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Happy anne=iversary dior - 9 isnt that cream teas?????? or something equally naughty but nice?

Just back from counselling and the counsellor thinks I seem much more positive nad stronger than last week and indeed for a long time.

I think that this is because I have gained strength from not speaking to DH and by changing MY behviour.

DH has started to change the way in which he behaves towards me in response to my changed behaviour....still so difficutl to do as I am having to change but I can see the positives in doing so.

Off out now with a few friends then DH has DD for a coupl eof hours this evening.

Dior - Happy Anniversary!

HW - agree that men - especially my DH are so scared of missing out (something he admits to) that this clouds their judgement and they loose sight of what they may loose, which from reading threads onhere is always more than they realise until it too late/almost too late.

Hopefully by continuing to be strong and change my behaviour DH will relaise what he has lost/stands to loose and will stand up to the mark adn take responsibilty and become the man and father I and DD need. However if he can't then I am getting stronger by the day and realising that i don't NEED him to be happy.

MHIS Glad things are looking up - its surprising how many times people come on here and say they feel stronger when they havent seen the man at the centre of their problems.

Pre-children I lived alone and was single for about 10 years and I can tell you that whilst it is ideal and preferable to bring your child up with both parents and certainly makes life financially easier - you can survive without them (it is a case of wanting someone in your life rather than needing one)

He can only continue treating you badly if you let him - if you dont live together you can walk out of a conversation with him any time you want if he is being unreasonable Im not saying walk out of every contentious conversation with him as that obvously would not be terribly constructive.

Hallo everyone, I'm still here. Tried posting last night but my computer lost it all and I gave up and went home.

Baffy, how are you? I was so shocked by H's complete duplicity. But remember, YOU are not pathetic - HE is. You have been strong and brave and fought hard and long for your relationship and given him more chances than anyone deserves, because you love him. He has been weak and swayed towards whoever he is nearest at the time, and whatever love he has for you, his character is not anything like as strong as yours and he does not deserve you and DS. At least you know that now. You WILL look at this one day and realise how lucky you have been to get out of this sick, sick foursome. I hope the OM does the same - one feels some sympathy for him, though he knows what he's taken on. I do hope you are ok. I'm sure H will be pleading with you again, but really, whatever he really wants - if he even knows what that is - he is not strong enough to stand in one place, with one woman, long enough to get it.

Baffy, I'm sure that there is a man out there, somewhere, who you will meet in time and will be everything you want and deserve. H was the love of your early life, but someone else will be the splendour of your best years .

Hi Everyone else, and HAPPY ANNIVERSARY DIOR . Have you plans for tonight?

Paddle, at your neighbours - if I were your councillor, I'd be contacting ASBAT on your behalf .

I've found out there are two other prospective candidates, so I might not be selected. Not sure how i feel about that - some relief, but also disappointment, since they asked me months ago if I'd be interested. I used to say I'd rather stick needles in my eyes, but it could be time to take on a new life challenge - and I won't deny the money would be a huge help. It's been nice having our Japanese student, but DD and I are looking forward to having the house to ourselves again next week and we haven't been offered any more students yet.

Got a call from Relate this morning and they've offered us a course starting week after next. I hope it'll fit with DP's work - he's going back to the library but doesn't know his hours yet. Otherwise we'll have to go on the waiting list again. I think it'll be good to start Relate soon after he comes home - the tour ends on Saturday - as he's bound to have his usual problems adjusting to being home again, and it would be great to be able to talk them through as they occur, without them building up in silence as before.

MHIS - hi - welcome to the best thread on MN. We don't insult each other (Wily, sometimes I read other threads and feel I've wandered onto the Jeremy Kyle show!) and we're very supportive even though we've all had different experiences. Mine was that I was the one who had the affair. My only excuse is that DP and I dated 20 years ago, I knew he was the love of my life but he didn't reciprocate! We split up, I married on the rebound, marriage went pear-shaped after some years, though he was a kind man, I slipped into a relationship with DP that neither of us expected to go anywhere, exH left when he found out and realised that I could not drop DP. DP and I got together as a bone fide couple six years ago and bought a house together two years back. Our problems now are that he never really lived with anyone before, and lived on very little. He now finds himself in his early 50s with responsibilities and pressures that he had not really anticipated and is finding it hard to adjust to sharing space with me and my DD. Hence going to Relate. We had a crisis early in the summer when he wanted to sell up and separate, feeling that was the only way to maintain his sanity and our relationship. I disagreed and got us a Relate appointment, which helped him open up a bit - and though he still feels unhappy in the house, he's prepared to have more sessions and work at it. He's an actor & works away a lot, so has not really had a period in the house when he's been in work and happy. While he's been at home, he's been unemployed and so associates the house with financial stress and negativity.

Anyway, that's the summary of my story, to save you having to read through too much!

Happy Anniversary Dior . Congratulations - you've really come a long way. Hope he makes a big fuss of you considering how close he came to losing you.
Tannee - You are lucky to get a Relate appointment so soon - I'm still waiting for our to come through, although that will be a bit like shutting the stable door after the horse has gone now
MHIS - Quick summary on me - my (now ex) partner is an alcoholic. It's like he has another woman, but one who I can never compete with or win against . We had a horrific holiday in July which finally spelt the end of our relationship. I have 2 dss and he has a teenage dd but no dc together. He still wants to try and make it work and is being very charming and lovely (in between binges of course), but until he admits he has a problem and gets help for it there is no future for us. That's not to say I don't love him, I do, but I have to protect my dc from his drinking as I grew up with an alcoholic father and it has screwed me up in so many ways.
Phew - hope you are still awake after all that!!!!

Hi MHIS - welcome I did post on your thread. Basically my story is h and I have been together for 18 years, married for 8. He started an affair last year with a work colleague and it went on for about a year. I found out in February (discovered an email). Also found out he had been using porn for about 2 years. We've had counselling and he still goes. We have a 4 yr old ds. We are trying to work things out. A lot of the time it feels like he is working harder at it than me, but I think that is because it takes nearly all my effort to still be here. The deceit is the worst thing imo. I'm sure you probably feel the same, especially knowing that he was having an affair whilst your lo was in special care in hospital. My h continued his affair whilst I was pregnant.

Tannee - your dd did very well, you must be very proud. Exciting re. nominations Must be terrifying too.

Ginnny - yes you are right, he doesn't want it for himself

Dior - a few lapses won't hurt. Well done with the walking

Hw - yes emotional affairs my arse. What a load of old cobblers. They are invariably trying to get into some woman's knickers.

Lilyloo - hello

Paddle - glad you are enjoying some time to yourself. In your shoes I would sell up as tbh I can't tolerate awful neighbours (have had too many in my lifetime) and the school is important. Most important of all......BABYSITTERS

Baffy - how are you? I have facebook but don't know how to find you. Hope someone can update us on how you are soon xxx

Dior - sorry, Happy Anniversary

hi everyone - I popped in 3 weeks ago to say 'hello', then all the holiday preps went tits up and I didn't have a chance to come back with an update.

So, as you maybe remember, we moved from Switzerland to Germany (Munich) in May, had baby (girl! ) in June. Baby is wonderful. Dh is being better than he ever has. But (sorry, has to be one) despite all that, feeling pretty crap. I had decided last year in the aftermath that I needed to return to work for many many reasons, then we promptly moved country and had another baby, so feel trapped again as sahm ( 9 years exactly now - ds1 was 9 last week!) and also haven't made any friends or even acquaintances here so very lonely, esp now ds1 & 2 at school & ds3 starting KG next week. Endless days not seeing or speaking to a single person. Don't even see my boys, as they get in at 5, do HW, play, eat, bed. But dd is of course very lovely. Try to put up recentish picture.

But anyway, things going much better with dh. I take a lot less nonsense than I used to - just wish I could've learnt what I know now without all that pain.

But still, not a day goes by where the pain of the affair doesn't stab me in the heart. That ski weekend and the zoo visit just play back in my head. Is it normal to still think about it?

Sorry for waffling. Dior, happy anniversary

Baffy, I think I've got the gist of recent events. So sorry you got caught up in that nightmare. Really hope you soon find the happiness you really deserve. How much does your ds see his dad?

And HW, hope you're OK, I'll try to catch up on everybody.

Hope you're all well. Lovely to 'see' you all again.

hello everyone, I'm still here, but been in the office last couple of days.

Baffy, I am thinking of you a lot.

Welcome MHIS. I think I've spoken to you before as well. My story briefly - H announced a 5 week affair in March, left that night. Still seeing her, we've worked out access for the children (2 under 5), and trying to start working out finances and removal of his crap belongings. I have found this thread on MN so so so supportive, and along with emails from TFM (who I think is lurking at the mo), have become stronger. So much so that I'm not sure I even want him back now.

I haven't got much time, so will catch up with everyone later and post more.

xx to all.

MHIS - I read your thread again last night, I did post on it quite a while back but couldnt remember the specifics. I think you are doing so well and being very strong in the circumstances.

Im not going through the same as anyone else - happily married (touch wood). I had an unfaithful parther many years ago, I left him and never saw him again - I have heard through the grapevine that he left his wife and children for someone old enough to be his mum and im fairly sure that will not have been the first time he was unfaithful.

I got involved ages ago when Baffy had first found out her hubby had another woman, she just came across as such a nice person, even thinking about the OW (or should I say womanchilds!)feelings that I had to post...met the rest of the rabble through her. This is a non bitching (at each other) zone, we try to be as supportive as possible.

I am getting worried we have upset TFM (heloooooo) Im hoping she has such a great life she doesnt have time for us

Hello everyone

This is just a quick catch up to say hi and I will get on over the weekend for a proper update.

Ernest ? great to see you

MHIS welcome too

I think the last I posted was Monday when H turned up at some stupid hour of the night. Upshot of that was some weak a feeble excuses as to his behaviour, and to explain to me that OW wanted all 3 of us to meet up?

Haven?t we been here before

Anyway, after lots of thought I decided to meet up with them. This was on Tuesday night. (I didn?t come on and tell you as I knew you?d all tell me I was a nutter and to stay well away! )

Anyway, we got to the bottom of everything. And she put H through hell while I sat and took it all in.

In a nutshell, he had stopped seeing her back in May when we started getting close again. All his efforts, the majority of his time etc, was with me.

But in the background, miss no knickers would randomly turn up at his, or turn up on nights out? and oh it was just oh so difficult for him to say NO to her that they just ?ended up? in bed together

Hence him not being able to tell her the truth about us.

For him it was fun. For her she thought it was the promise of a future as a family.

I have to say I actually felt sorry for OW in a lot of ways. When I bumped into her on Saturday the angle was very much that they had planned this child, were meeting up on her fertile days, legs up against the wall etc etc as though they really did try hard to conceive. That?s what I was so mad about. Why H, a grown man, would do that with a girl he doesn?t love, with no home and no means to support them all.

Turns out that that was very much a fabrication and whilst the planning, folic acid, ovulation kits etc were a very major part of the lead up to the pregnancy, H had no idea. And she did have to admit that.

At that stage I saw a young pathetic child who did anything and everything to keep the man she thinks she loves. She admitted she believed a child would be the thing that made him finally divorce me and start to love her.
How sad

She?s 20 years of age and has changed the course of her whole future for this man. A man, who on Tuesday, I saw as nothing but a selfish and weak excuse for a person.

They discussed their relationship and had a few outbursts to each other and I felt very uncomfortable to be witnessing that. But also strangely comforted that the woman I thought was some beautiful sex goddess, and this amazing care free relationship that I thought they had ? was nothing of the sort.

I took it all in and felt an overwhelming sense of relief at finally understanding it all and knowing the truth.

(Not that I?ll ever understand how he could do this to me and ds, that?s a different story!)

OW was very distraught. Scared about the pregnancy. Worried for her future. And I did end up comforting her and giving her some advice on how it would be.

This is a very sad, lonely young girl who I believe, has been caught up (used?) in my husband?s early mid life crisis, and will have a high price to pay for that until the day she dies.

In front of us both, H said that he cared for her, but never did love her and does not want a future with her. What he wants is the chance to save his marriage.

You all have some idea of the anger and hatred I have for what OW put me through. She did some very cruel things. (Aside from deliberately setting out to sleep with a married man!) But OMG, to sit and watch a young pregnant girl?s whole world crumble around her, while the man she thought was her future said that she?d been pretty much nothing but a distraction and bit of fun, and his beautiful wife sitting in the room was where his future lay? there are no words to describe it
It felt sick. Wrong. Horrendous.

That was my cue to speak really and I made it clear that H had his chance, and this was very much too little too late. I suggested that they both rent together and try for a life as a family.
H looked pretty much like this His face was just green. No colour at all. This really wasn't the outcome he wanted/expected. And he started to say that.

At that point I really did have to put a stop to the whole thing and make it clear that I?m no longer willing to be part of this sick twisted triangle. I explained that I would never have got close to him again if I hadn?t believed with all my heart that he was giving me 100% and meaning the promises. Now I know he wasn?t, there?s nothing left. That was his last chance. He blew it. For her. So I think he should be with her.

Obviously lots more was said that evening. But that's the upshot of it. And the one thing I now know for sure ? is that I can move on and be happy, and he, never ever will be. Neither of them will. Together or not, they have made their beds, and I wouldn?t trade places with either of them for the world!

Hurts like hell. No idea whether he'll go with his second choice or find the strength to be a man and move on properly on his own. But it doesn't matter any more. This pain will get better over time. I doubt his guilt or her heartache (knowing his heart isn't truly with her), ever will.

(Will catch up with all your stories soon )

Thanks so much for all the support xx

Fantastic Baffy - i feel so proud of you - and actually a little bit jealous of your new exciting life that you now have complete control over. because believe me it is hard work at times doing this.

I have had to go back to see gynae consultant today - thankfully it seems that is just a consequence of the earlier treatment but it means i will have to have a bit more - and that means another few weeks without sex.

Just as ernest says - there are few days when i dont have some heartache because of h's actions.
I dont want to continually beat him up about it but i do still need to acknowlege it and deal with it - either with or without him. I think actually that he is having a hard time too.
Work is slow and boring at the moment and he is desperate to start afresh - hopefully he can understand the feelings i sometimes have about feeling stuck. But he is still being fantastic - i think i am just worried that this is a bit false and he is finding it such hard work that he will get bored of putting in the effort and revert back to getting his thrills elsewhere.

Ernest - glad the baby is lovely - totally understand about the feeling trapped as a sahm (although my 4th starts school on weds). H was offered a job abroad last year (so present firm could keep him). In the past i would have said go for it - it was a good package and could have meant more job security ect. but i was not willing to put myself in such a vunerable position ever again - and that has given me such strengh too. I do hope you find the happiness you so deserve - do make sure you are not sacrificing your needs for everyone else.

Hi to everyone else.

And once again - well done baffy - set yourself some new boundaries and feel good that you will be able to stick to them.

thank you both

Hi Baffy - good to hear you are still in one piece. A real shame it had to come to this...I used to be of the "an affair is definately the end of things" school of thought, tbh I still think it would be for me but I can see that sometimes there are reasons why they do these things and if they appreciate just how wrong it is and are committed to putting it right then you can get over it. You have given him so many chances though havent you, at the start we hoped it was just a crisis because you had been together since you were young but it still doesnt sound as though he gets it does it?

Damn it was a long time ago for me...I was with him for nowhere near as long as you guys and we had no children but I still remember really clearly how it felt to admit it was over - trust me it does get better and when you are ready you will find a better life for yourself without this drama

bloody hell, you are BRAVE!

well done
x

Yeah I thought brave too. We will have to start a feisty chicks club - I see MHIS is standing her ground too!