Do I tell DD she's not nice?

[Weeeheee]

DD (20) is due to meet the OW in person soon at XH wedding to her.

DD has chatted online with OW a few times (she lives abroad). DD said the other day that she's looking forward to meeting OW, as she seems nice.

I'm desperate to discuss with DD why she's not nice.

OW persisted in chasing XH and encouraging him to end our marriage and our family life. OW was married herself, so was also cheating on her husband. She has a young child, so also broke up their family.

I do not blame OW for XHs choices. He ended our marriage, not her.

But anyone who pushes a person to end their marriage and leave their family, and move a 10 hour flight away from their own children is not a nice person.

A woman who cheats on her husband is not a nice person.

I want to discuss with DD why she thinks she's nice when she behaved in the way she did.

I know I shouldn't, as I'll sound bitter.

I'm not bitter at all - life is the best its been without XH in it.

But OW is not a nice person, and as a now adult, DD should be mature enough to consider the bigger picture.

I'm probably going to leave it, but would you say anything to DD?

Look up the too orangey for crows ads from the eighties

That sounds awful, but I cannot think it's worse than something along the lines of, 'I'm leaving you for the woman I've been fucking for the past six months, who I love; by the way, you should get an STI check'.

Omg, that's fascinating and awful, haha. Thank you! I had no idea that drink even existed.

I don’t know, obviously, but my point is only that it was hard to imagine anyone being more grief-stricken, and this was in response to something that gets trotted out on a lot of affair threads on Mn as ‘the decent thing to do’: ‘So you meet someone you’re attracted to? Well, do the decent thing, go home, tell your spouse, get a divorce and then pursue it’. That’s literally what this friend did, and it still caused so much grief, even without any subterfuge. There’s no nice way of saying ‘I want a divorce. I don’t want you as a spouse any more.’

Another friend of mine asked his wife and the mother of his two kids for a divorce out of the blue on a family holiday! Totally blindsided. No one else on the scene, and he was single for a couple of years before getting into a new relationship. I didn’t know her well, but a mutual friend said she’d have understood it better if he was leaving her for another woman, rather than what he was saying, which was ‘I’d rather be single than be married to you.’

And it would still have been worse if he admitted he'd been sticking his cock in a random for months and was now dumping her for the random cocksucker. She would have had exactly the same reaction, plus possible diseases and months of humiliation behind her back to add to that.

People gossip, all you’ve done is humiliate your kids by sharing those videos. If they knew they would be devestated and hugely embarrassed.

You've made them collateral damage so yes you have let your feelings for your ex colour your judgement as a parent.

Regardless of your lack of understanding, it's still the wrong thing to cheat. And always the right thing not to.

HTH.

Why are you trying to argue that leaving someone because you're having an affair is less bad than breaking up with someone without first lying to them, utterly betraying them, exposing them to sexual diseases, and removing their ability to give informed consent?

I think telling a person that the relationship isn't working out is hurtful and confusing, of course, but generally much less damaging than discovering that they've been fucking someone else (and falling in love with someone else) while you were blissfully ignorant, and they're leaving you to be with that person.

While I think watching the videos with a friend is a little distasteful, the children don't know about them - and besides that, her husband and the OW humiliated the children by making those videos in the first place, not OP by watching them.

Hmm my mum was the one who had an affair and left my dad. So does that mean she " contaminated" me forever more and was dangerous to
me?

I am really pleased - sounds like you have a lovely bond.

In that case, listen to what your heart tells you and just be honest. You are usually open with each other, I assume?

So why not say to her, look DD, I was a bit hurt when you said OW "seems nice", because she played a big part in breaking up my marriage and to me that's not nice! I really want you to have a great relationship with your dad - he is your dad after all - and if that means forming a positive relationship with his new partner, I'll respect that. But please be sensitive about my feelings and accept I will find it hard to agree with you that she is "nice".

My dd's dad had an affair which broke up our relationship - again, OW pursued him - and he is still with her. My daughter is younger than yours but understands my feelings perfectly. I don't spend loads of time skating the OW to her, but she knows OW is not ever going to be my favourite person.....

Honestly, just be honest. I mean this totally respectfully, truly, but I think you are making this a bigger deal than it needs to be. Just communicate with the daughter you love, honestly, kindly and respectfully, and all will be well. It's not hard to empathise with your position on this woman - pretty much anyone could, I would think.

Well, to be fair, children of parents who have affairs are twice as likely to cheat according to studies. So...maybe?

Well I'm 55 and havEnt had an affair as yet. Doubt it be happening now. And I'm the child of ONE parent who had one affair, mum married him

And is what you said about. Children of parents being twice as likely to have affairs, well surely that means it didn't affect them badly enough to not do the same to their own kids

I'm the product of an affair! But my dad was in a violently abusive relationship (he had the scars on his body to prove it - she stabbed him!) so I don't judge him for cheating on her with my mom at all.

A story I am sharing now to illustrate the fact that every situation is different. I don't believe that all affairs are the work of the devil, and that all those who have them are evil people.

Human beings have the capacity to judge different situations on their merits - we don't need absolute black and white rules to guide our moral judgements.

Yes, that was a little tongue in cheek, sorry. Being twice as likely obviously doesn't mean you will cheat. But it does show that having a certain behaviour normalised to you by a parent makes you more likely to engage in it - so saying people 'contaminate' others might not be that silly.

It doesn't make any sense to me that a person can be too scared to leave someone because of abuse...and yet also willing to risk their ire by cheating on them. Why not just leave?

But in the Ops daughter's case the same could be said about her seeing her dad, even if the OW wasn't still on the scene

She probably just means on a surface level. I wouldn't sit her down and go through it all. But I wouldn't let it go if she mentions it again, I'd just say "well my experience of her hasn't been that nice, but you do you"

Actually that makes perfect sense because there's someone else in the picture boosting their confidence and supporting them.

Sure, it could. And as children of people who have affairs are twice as likely to cheat, there's probably some merit to that.

So why then is the OW considered a moral danger but the dad isnt.

Illogical

Absolutely, ex and OW did create a lot of damage, but OP has added to it when she didn’t need to.

She gave the info to multiple people to view, she didn’t just watch it with a close friend. People gossip and whoever she shared it with no doubt told/showed other friends. It creates more risk that the kids will eventually find out and she didn’t think of that when she put her own need for revenge above her kids.

I would never do that. Regardless of my feelings toward my ex, I love my kids enough to not choose the satisfaction of revenge over consideration of their feelings.

If they're confident enough to cheat on their violent, abusive partner and risk their reaction if discovered, then they're confident enough to leave. It sounds like a poor excuse, unless trying to shield children from the abuse was keeping them trapped in the relationship.

Personally, I'd say they both are if someone holds that perspective, but as the father is...well, her father, and I presume she loves him, it'd be rather disproportionate for the DD to cut him out of her life.

I do agree, I would never do something like that. It does heighten the risk that the children could find out. Although given the ex-husband has told the DS they used to cam on a sex website, I think that horse might've bolted.