How do I broach this delicately.

[1971girl]

I have a lovely male friend I have been friends with for a long time. He has discussed his life and I have discussed mine snd my past relationship problems with him. He has been having a bad time lately. A bereavement. He is a lovely person and I think I could possibly see a romantic aspect to us if only he would get his teeth sorted. He dresses very well. I know he has talked about this but honestly, he needs to act. If he did, I think i would be interested in pursuing our friendship to a romantic level but I just don't know how to bring this up without seeming like a superficial cow! It is life! His teeth are bad and unfortunately we are judged on our appearance. No nasty comments please. I really like him but I don't know how to bring this up in a delicate manner without hurting him and ruining the friendship we have.

It depends on exactly what the problem is. It's not clear - first you talked about him getting his teeth "sorted", which would seem to imply that he has crooked or missing teeth, and later you talked about "oral hygiene", which sounds as if he doesn’t brush his teeth.

If the problem is crooked teeth you could tell him how much better he’d look if he got them fixed, but I do think that makes you pretty shallow. If the problem is that he doesn’t brush them I don’t think I could get over that, because it shows something about his character.

‘I just want him to want to improve his looks, health and life’

So change himself entirely?

There’s a huge difference between bad oral hygiene and teeth needing fixed. I inherited bad teeth from my mum and even though I’m fastidious with brushing etc my teeth are still a mess. I’m very self conscious of them but short of spending thousands on cosmetic dentistry there’s not much I can do. Thankfully my children have got their dad’s teeth. Saying someone has bad oral hygiene just because they don’t gave “perfect” teeth is like saying all overweight people are lazy and spend all day eating.

But I think the point is, the oral hygiene is an ongoing problem. He isn’t cleaning them properly or getting them fixed in terms of underlying gum disease / decay that is causing smell and visibly poor mouth health… and that’s the reason for the OP’s post. Unless I’ve missed something 🤔

I knew a lovely guy who everyone liked but had terrible teeth. He was very ambitious ( we were graduate trainees) but wasn't getting opportunities and we were all sure his appearance was a factor. Whether people like it or not, appearance is important and if it's something that can be fixed, it's a pity. No one could discuss it with him as he was very sensitive about it, but it was a shame. I hope someone he could listen to talked to him eventually. There were no barriers to him accessing treatment, he was just never made to go to the dentist growing up.

He's having a hard time and you want to have a go about his teeth? Your timing is woeful.
If it's because of bereavement it's probably not the right time anyway.

In all fairness to the OP, he's sufficiently on top of his bad time to be wanting to shift things to a sexual relationship with OP.
The OP has clearly been extremely supportive over his bereavement, and this is a seperate and unconnected issue, about how attractive OP considers him as a sexual partner.
If she was considering mentioning his teeth in the context of a friend supporting a widower, I'd agree with you. However the context here is a man wanting a sexual relationship with her, which shifts the goal posts somewhat.

Wonky/missing teeth or hygiene? Big difference

This is tricky. As much as I don’t like poor dental hygiene you cannot mention it to him especially as he is grieving. It’s sure he is acutely aware of his teeth and there could be many issues regarding getting them done, fear and money being the most likely. He probably feels very comfortable with you regardless of how he looks and if you were to suggest the “possible” likelihood of a romantic relationship on the proviso that he gets his teeth fixed then I’m sure he will be very hurt and it could end your friendship. I’m sure that given time he will come to the decision on his own but in the meantime if you aren’t getting the butterflies can’t wait to see him feeling as he is, then I wouldn’t try to change him. Just accept the friendship for now because that is a great thing to have and he sounds like a really nice man.

You haven’t said what’s wrong with his teeth.

If they’re just uneven or wonky, I don’t think you can ask him to have cosmetic work done so that he’s good enough for you.

’Bad oral hygiene’ - if they’re broken, rotten, blackened or he doesn’t brush/floss enough, I think that’s different and in that case you would be reasonable to ask.

This

I’m torn on this one. Dp has bad teeth. A front bottom one is missing completely, they’re far from straight and badly stained from years of smoking. I can’t pretend it wasn’t the first thing I noticed when I met him for the first time. Saying that I got past it pretty quickly when I realised how much we clicked and it doesn't bother me at all.

I think if several were missing that would be another thing all together. I have sympathy though. If the rest of the UK is anything like where I am, nhs dental treatment is practically as rare as spotting a unicorn. Private dental care costs a fortune. I think a lot of people are stuck with teeth that they can’t afford to fix no matter how much they may want to.

You’re right OP . Teeth are the first thing you notice when looking at someone . A woman at work had shocking teeth and it was all anyone knew about her , whose that , oh you mean her with the black teeth . It’s human nature . Clean hygienic teeth and good oral care is not unreasonable to want in a partner .

It isn't shallow. It's not the same as 'dont like your dress sense ' 'you've got a bit of a belly' or 'dye your greys and we'll get it on!'

It's not just bad breath or kissing either. I dont need to know OPs sexual preferences but oral sex with someone with bad oral hygiene is a high infection risk. 'Bad teeth' is ambiguous obviously but I'd definitely want to know more about what happened if theyre rotting and neglected. That isn't shallow, that's being sensible.

I'm totally with you on this OP. DH is terrible with dental hygiene not helped by having too many teeth (his parents were very neglectful with anything like this, and he badly needed teeth removing and a brace). It got so bad that he ended up with an infection that ate into the soft palate and he had to have surgery (bone graft) and implants for his 4 front teeth. He hasn't learned - he drinks milky coffee all day and has really sour breath on a good day. On a bad day, I can smell it across the room..... and he hasn't learned that he needs to floss, use mouthwash and clean his teeth twice a day.

FFS he is grieving and you want to tell him to get his teeth fixed!
In the op she says it is about appearance , not decay/bad breath

What are you changing OP so he can finally start to have committed romantic feelings for you? Nose job? Saggy or too small boobs? Flabby stomach? Cellulite? Drooping skin? Jowls? Wrinkles? Come on! I’m not going on about superficial things.

Watch the Austin Powers films with him, that will give you the opening to talk about his teeth.

But this is him - therefore you’re not compatible.

If someone has to change who they are, then it’s not them that you want.

He could get his teeth sorted but without good oral hygiene, they’ll end up back again.

Good hygiene is a must for me and I could not compromise on it.

I don’t think you like him in that way.
Go and find someone you’re actually attracted to.

"Hey friend, I care about you and want you to know that mouth health affects so many other body systems. Would you be open to seeing a dentist and being more diligent with brushing your teeth? I am happy to go with you to the appointment for support.
I would like us to have many more great memories together!" - this is how I would approach it if this were a good friend, romantic interest or no, but only bring it up once and then let things go
.

Hi Dave.

Sort your teeth out and you might be in with a chance of dating me

I know I’m perfect and that your grieving but I think you would be lucky to date somebody as perfect as myself

Regards,
Maureen

f I was grieving, and a ‘friend’ chose that time to tell me they’d date me if I sorted out a physical imperfection - especially if it was something that I already felt insecure about - I’d probably never speak to them again.

Agree.

I just want him to want to improve his looks, health and life

Get over yourself.

What is actually wrong with his teeth? You mentioned bad oral hygiene which is different say from wonky teeth. If he had bad breath and plaque covered teeth then to be honest I would be turned off. Either way mentioning it during a period of bereavement is spectacularly insensitive.

Does he have the financial means to pay for extensive dental treatment? I have spent the best part of 10k in recent years (braces, crowns, regular hygienist visits, whitening) that’s just not accessible to many people.

Bad looking teeth is not the same as poor oral hygiene.

If the teeth are just a bit crooked, or a couple missing then you cant really expect him to get it sorted

However if its actual bad oral hygeine, or the teeth are rotten/bad breath then its absolutely not unreasonable to not want to date that person. Its akin to not wanting to date someone because they dont shower or wipe their arse. Why would it be superficial to not want to kiss someone with a mouth full of plaque or decay?

However realistically its not something that you can phrase tactfully