Glam & Fab Part 6 - The Summer of Discontent

[Tanee58]

Hope you all find your way onto this new one !

Your first paragraph really hit a chord TFM.

He has been very hostile and defensive up to now. At first he couldn't bear to see me at all, and hated even being in the same room. He was very angry and defensive to me, sent aggressive emails and said really nasty things. It was terrible.

What if actually he's only talking now because I have asked for that from the beginning, and he's realised he ought to? What if I end up looking like an idiot? I suppose that's a risk to take... I did wear a necklace on Thurs that I bought on honeymoon, and said to him, do you remember where I bought this? He did. He does say he still respects me - I had said that I didn't feel that he did any more. It was weird on Thurs, I did feel comfortable with him still, and the conversation really only ended because we were so tired. I think if we hadn't been fading, it could have been an all-nighter.

Funnily enough I've been here a bit before with him - when we first met, he had a girlfriend he'd been with for about 5 years. It took 9 months for him to split with her and for us to actually get together. Unlike ow now, I did not get involved with him while he had a girlfriend (not that he wouldn't have; I refused) - we had a long discussion about 4 months after we met about the fact that we clearly fancied eachother, but he stayed with her in the end at that point, and I didn't contact him/see him at all for 4 months after that. By the time we finally did get together, it was incredibly intense and moved very fast. God I'd like that again!! !!

I think he just knew he'd behaved like a complete and utter c**t. Sorry ladies for use of that word, I've never used it before, but find it just trips off the tongue right now...

Well UC, I think it's one of two things, either he still lovs you and is trying to work things out in his head and all the other stuff we have discussed OR, he is talking to you in an effort to move on with your permission so to speak, with your blessing and as your friend. I suppose it all depends on what kind of person he is. Is he the kind who doesn't like confrontation, who has a need to be liked and approved of, who doesn't like to upset people or, is he a confident man who put's his own wants and needs first and can quite hapily disregard others without giving into emotional outbursts? To be honest with you, if you really do want him back then I see no harm in giving it a go either way, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Have faith in yourself, you are not going to look like an idiot if you handle this properly, you are not going to chase him or appear needy and wanting. You are going to entice him you are going to show him that you are everything he wants, that you can be exciting, independent. You are going to show him that this isn't all about him and what he wants, that you have needs too. Gosh, the list is endless!

The thing is UC, you are never going to know if you don't try. Do you really think you can help yourself from trying cos I don't The only thing I will say is do not sleep with him. Do not get him interested to the point of wanting you but only wanting to sleep with you. If you do that then he is having his cake and eating it. You want some/ a lot of committment from him before that happens. By all means enjoy a snog or two but leave him wanting 'the other'.

What do you want to do UC? Do you want to take a risk on things and see if you can make it work or, do you want to let go, walk away and move on? Whats it to be?

Forgot to say, the aggression, the anger in the emails etc, thats all a ploy to keep you at arms length, a 'keep off my back' sort of statement. It also smacks a bit of a man who hates himself for what he has done, he doesn't want to see you cry or hear you talk about how you feel and what he has done to you, that causes him pain and shame so he just wants you to shut up! He will have felt very upset that he has caused you so much heartbreak and in order to make himself feel better he won't have wanted you to remind him of that by being upset. Funny creatures aren't they

"Is he the kind who doesn't like confrontation, who has a need to be liked and approved of, who doesn't like to upset people or, is he a confident man who put's his own wants and needs first and can quite hapily disregard others without giving into emotional outbursts?"

He is type b, definitely not someone who needs to be liked and approved of. Definitely confident, likes to argue blue is green, plays devils advocate a lot in discussions. The more angry someone gets with him, the calmer he usually becomes.

I think I will leave it for next week, as I'm really busy, and it will give him time to mull over what we said on Thurs...

Baffy hope you have a good night tonight
Am glad the doctor was so helpful too.
I hope you can lean on your friends tongight and your not just trying to put a brave face on things. You do really need to grieve for this relationship Baffy and let it out. You aren't going mad they are all feelings that you need to have and deal with it's all part of the moving on process.
I hope you can stay strong enough to move away Baffy i am still very worried that you aren't. Please stop taking their concerns and worries on your shoulders leave them too it you have to worry about YOU !!!
Dior glad the diet going well fingers crossed for Thurs!
TFM your posts about p are so lovely they really make me
UC i think if you want to try everything then you have to take the risk and if it works fab and if not wee at least you tried , you'll get over the embarrasment!

Then if he is type B UC he is not doing all of this for your benefit or your approval, he is doing it because he is interested. If he wasn't he would have just walked away and wouldn't have a need to talk things over with you. Also, I bet all this talking and opening up is quite a big thing for him.

It's good that you want to leave things til next week, for him to mull things over. I like your style Keep it up!

Hi Lily Thank you! It makes me smile when it happens. I get this nice little feeling inside that I want to cling on to and remember. It makes me feel that everything has been worthwhile and glad that I didn't/couldn't just walk away. Of course, it's an ongoing project I'm not resting on me laurels!

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Hi all sis here for weekend so busy - glad all ok - Uc sounds promising whatever end situation..
Baffy you sound tons better am so glad you got a good GP I would have been the same though sometimes people come tell me their stories and all I can think is " my god try live my life you have no idea"...but of course I dont that would be sooo unprofessional ...
Sis giving me a hard time TBH she is very frustrated with me - tried to tell her that until you have been in this situation it is impossible to know what you will do
ok gotta go - summer meetup????

Evening all , nothing much happening on here tonight so i have just been on threads i'm watching and found our old threads pre f and g
Baffy go read them r/e h and TFM r/e p can't believe we were there !

Hi Lily Yes, I had a scan of mine a couple of months ago, it makes for very uncomfortable reading. I can honestly say that I feel like a different person to the woman I was than. I have final become the person I always longed to be, confident, secure and happy and accepting of every aspect of myself. I have wasted many years being insecure, jealous, needy, hating my body, my face, everything! Living my life for others, seeking their approval and trying to be what they want me to be just to get some love and affection. I don't have any of that now. I feel so liberated!

Hi to everyone else. Have a lovely day! Baffy I am thinking of you. I hope you had a good time last night xx

Hi Lily Yes, I had a scan of mine a couple of months ago, it makes for very uncomfortable reading. I can honestly say that I feel like a different person to the woman I was than. I have final become the person I always longed to be, confident, secure and happy and accepting of every aspect of myself. I have wasted many years being insecure, jealous, needy, hating my body, my face, everything! Living my life for others, seeking their approval and trying to be what they want me to be just to get some love and affection. I don't have any of that now. I feel so liberated!

Hi to everyone else. Have a lovely day! Baffy I am thinking of you. I hope you had a good time last night xx

Gosh, this is what I get for deserting MN for a couple of days.

Baffy - many hugs - of course you're allowed to be upset. This has been like nursing someone (the old H?) through a terminal illness, having to stay strong however it hurts, and now they've died you can afford to collapse for a bit. Later it will be time to pick up the pieces and carry on with life, but for now no-one would deny you the right to let it all out and have a good cry. The ADs and sleeping pills are there if you need them, but you don't owe it to anyone else to take them if you prefer not to.

Mind you, if I may say "I told you he still wanted a good slapping"... I mean, like, when he's out with you, what is wrong with turning his phone OFF? Huh?

Oh yes, ADs, that reminds me. A friend said to me don't let them put you on Prozac as it tends to increase your weight - something I REALLY don't need! Dior, you've been taking heavier and heavier doses of Prozac and not feeling a lot more cheerful, meanwhile your weight is giving you trouble. Time to consider a change of medication? Also want to add, you won't lose weight every week, it goes by leaps and bounds, so don't be deterred if some weeks you don't lose any. It's your body catching up with the previous loss, as it were, and at least you didn't put any on! Keep going and you WILL get there. (sigh So much easier to give the advice than take it; 17 stone here, but fairly tall and quite happy to disgust XH, who hates fat people).

Best wishes to everyone else. It doesn't matter if some problems are bigger, all problems should be sorted out if possible. Suppose the police refused to arrest pickpockets because bank robbers are worse? (Oh wait a minute, I think they do... let's try "suppose doctors would only treat life-threatening illnesses, wouldn't many many people suffer unnecessarily?")

AGYG the AD's increase your appetite so hence your weight increases. I took them a couple of years ago and put on a massive amount of weight in a very short space of time. Thats why I prefer the natural supplements, they don't have the same effect.

Aha!

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Good Morning everyone

Dior, I can remember your first thread and tbh I am glad yu ar unable to read it, you are in a much better place these days than you were then, you have come a fair way

Well guess what! Yesterday I needed to go into town for a birthday present. DD was having a fun day out with her elder sister so it would have been just me except DP offered to come with me! Now normally we only do shopping together at Christmas so this was quite a pleasant surprise. Anyway, whilst walking around the shopping centre, all chilled and relaxed, I felt his hand searching for mine, then he very tentatively got hold of it beore doing the proper entwined fingers thing!!!! I was almost hyperventilating! He has never ever done hand holding!!! It felt a bit strange tbh but I went with it. THEN, later on, we were just finishing a coffee and were ready to head back to the car as the ticket was about to run out when he said "if we had more time I would go by you an engagement ring" Again, there I was totally amazed! Who is this man? He is a totally different man from the one I know! I have a diamond ring which he gave me in a non romantic way 7 years ago, he presented me with it telling me it "isn't an engagemnet ring or anything" because he is firmly against marriage, having witnessed his parents horrendous marriage and divorce. But it seems he may be changing his mind Trouble is, I really do not want to get married! BUt I am secretly enjoying the fact that he now does

Well thats my news. Have we got anymore takers? Any updates from the weekend?

Hi everyone

Feeling a bit low today - had a good weekend though but just not feeling connected with H at the moment.

I think i am scared we are both just going along doing our own thing and feel like we are back to where we were before .

H has tried so hard but i just get the feeling that things will never really change. I find it hard to lose weight and i have put on a lot recently . H has always liked a drink or two (which has from time to time caused small problems - he is not really supossed to drink at all).

Thing is in the past he has said he will give up drinking (and has been sucessful for over a year) but actually i like him to have a drink now and then. It is as if that is just him iykwim.
He tends to be a very intese sort of person and will succeed at anything he does (yes one of those annoying people ).

There have been a couple of other little things too which seemed to have slipped back to old ways - thats both of us by the way (hence me with the weight increase), and i just get the feeling that h is just one of those people who will never really change.
He found it so easy to lie - and i worry that he will again ifswim.
I think he truely believes what he says at the time - whether it be about giving up drinking, cutting down on spending, doing more things as a family, or staying faithful and not lying to me ever again.
But and here is the but - as time goes by he slips back to his old ways and no amount of reassurance is making me feel any better.

I feel as if i may as well say - well that is just what he is like - like it or lump it.
I do love him i just feel as if maybe i will just have to accept that he is unable to be 100% truthful to anyone - even himself. Not that he has given me any particular cause to dout him.

Here is an example - he buys a car to drive to work - as it will be cheaper than getting the train, spends a lot of money on this car which actually we could do without if he were getting the train. And now he seems to be getting the train in a lot more - now i predicted this would happen but h conviced me otherwise - so i went with it. Today he has gone in on train (which i predicted as he is going out tonight and can also have a drink). I feel as if i am being a fool and taken for a ride but i am being a bitch if i complain as he is the earner. If i raise it, he says he is doing everything, we knew he would go in on the train every now and then anyway, so i should not fuss.

I just feel so angry and want to say - see you have not changed - why should i believe you have changed in other areas? And with the non-connection at the weekend - i put 2 and 2 together and make up all sorts of senarios in my head .

This is probably pmt too - so feel free to ignore me. Also i know h is a big child - that is some of his attraction - life is never dull with him around and things really do get done.
I just want to KNOW that he is back for me and that it was not just what he thought he wanted at the time - if that makes sense?

Hi HW I'm sorry you are feeling low. I hope you don't mind me saying but from reading your post I think we can blame the hormones do you also think we could blame the fact that you are maybe not feeling that great about yourself, especially weight wise, which may be making you feel a tad insecure? Maybe it's just one of those times when you need more reassurance from H. If you were feeling better about yourself then all of the things you mention wouldn't bother you so much.

As for the car and train business and you feeling you have had the wool pulled over your eyes, DON'T! Don't feel like that. Just realise that you have learned something else about him and your relationship, you have learned that he feels he has to come up with some elaborate excuse or reason to get his own way and next time it happens, you just say something along the lines of "if you want it that much then get it, but don't try to fool me into giving you approval", just pass it straight back to him whilst at the same time letting him know you know exactly what he is up to.

Last year DP tried exactly the same line on me. He wanted a 4x4, hugely expensive to buy and hugely expensive to run. I told him i he really wanted one then he should get one, that he didn't need my permission, then I added "I promise I won't say I told you so when you start complaining about expensive it is to use for work" (he drives 100's of miles a week) So last July, he happily went ahead and bought the 4x4. In three weeks time we are taking delivery of an Audi A4 and the discovery is being traded in or it and I haven't said I told you so but he knows

What is it you want from him HW? Is it more reassurance? More attention? More effort with the relationship? Do you eel he isn't meeting you half way?

FWIW I don't think he is with you for any other reason that he loves you. You were leaving him, you were moving on, he came after you, you didn't beg him to come home or use emotional blackmail, he came home because he wanted to, he is with you because he wants to be with you.

Maybe you are just settling into a more normal routine now HW. The affair is 'old news' so to speak and for want of a better expression (sorry i that sounds harsh or unsypathetic, I'm not meaning to be, i do know how much pain it caused you) but i suppose I am trying to say is maybe 'life' is just getting in the way now. The way H is being probably has nothing to do with what has gone on, it's just the first thing you will think of when things do change.

I would say this is one of those times when you have to be kind to yourself, treat yourself, and try not to project how you feel onto H because that is when the trouble starts. I am sure this mood will pass so damage limitation is the key!

TFM
You are so right (whats new?).

The weight is an issue with me - i just cant seem to get myself motavated to get my arse into gear. And yet part of me thinks well h does love me whatever so shouldnt worry about it. I do want to do it for me but just love eating too , and then feel a bit low about it and hey we are on that cycle of feeling low, eating, and thinking what the heck. Dior you with me on this one?
Yes i know all the logic - just need that big kick up the backside (and just thinking well i will have to wait until september when life will be a bit easier). Mine break up on friday so it is hectic this week and then i know how hard the hols will be.

Thanks for saying that h has come back for me - i have been brooding over that a bit too recently - wondering if he hadnt had the time off ot sever the ties with her would he have been tempted back to her? I know i am tourturing myself again.
I also cant understand why she has never asked for an explanation and do wonder whether she did but h in his wisdom thought better of telling me.
Something just does not add up - or is that just me thinking this because it is so allien to me.

What do i want from h? - (well for starters i'll have that engagement ring if you dont want it.)
That is a good question - most of the time he is fantastic at reasurring me and this is probably just one of those 'low' bits and like you said i am tired of the affair now - and it seems a long time to have to wait for his new job and new start.
I think we both tend to look back to that time to 'blame' for any blips too - it is the easy option sometimes.

I do try and not give him 'approval' now either - I am not his mother after all, he is a big boy and can make his own mistakes. Its just that the part of me that says 'well i knew this would happen' also somehow sometime expects him to stray again - a leopard and his spots. And that makes me feel like fool for staying. I know this is about me, that little voice says 'you know you are not worth more so what did you expect?' How do i get over that?

Anyway i have given you enough to think about now i am sure thanks again TFM you really are great at cheering me up.

Also TFM you mentioned in a post about using natural alternive medicines - do you know about HTP5 (think thats what i have seen somewhere before) i cant get on with St johns wort.

HW you have done sooooo blooming well throughout all of this, I have so much admiration for you, you are a woman after my own heart, you don't give up easily, you fight for what you want, you accpet respsonsibility for your part in everything and rather than try and change H you set about investing in yourself and making changes that will benefit you and in turn benefit the relationship. You are fabulous! But right now you need to get a grip This is being said for your own good

You are right, all this is about you. This is you feeling unhappy with you and wanting H to make it all right, wanting him to make you feel happy. Unfortunately, as clever as he is he is unable to do this. He can;t physically make you lose weight, he can't physically stop you from eating all those foods you love and lets face it, if he did start trying to you would be on here posting very similar problems to those Dior has with her H.

I'm afraid there is no easy way to do it, if we want to lose weight then we have to eat less and exercise more. If we are not prepared to do that then we suffer the consequences. We are misrable with ourselves. And it's all our own fault but we make our poor H's suffer for it! I realised a long time ago that I am guilty of this. If I was feeling crap I would take it out on him. I make a very conscious effort not to do that anymore.

Everything you are feeling at the moment is perfectly normal HW. Even I feel like you do sometimes and DP hasn't had an affair so, I think it't imperetive that you separate the two otherwise, you are going to be aking your poor H pay the price for his affair for a long time!
I don;t know i this is helpful HW but when I am feling 'narked' and I know that no matter what he does DP will be in the wrong, I take myself off for some quiet time, I remove myself from the equation. If I can't trust myself to bite my tongue or i I can;t raise a smile i don't subject DP to it. It's my problem not his so I go deal with it. I give myself a good talking to!

And, you bloody well are worth more! Don't you ever thing that you don't deserve a faithful and loyal husband because you do!! And you get over that HW by loving yourself uncondtionally, accepting that you are not perect, that you might not have perfect skin, the perfect body or the legs of a model. You accept yourself for who you are, warts and all, and you learn to love your warts. You look for the positives about yourself and focus on them, you make the best of what you have got. You make sure that you smile as often as you can, even when you don't feel like doing. When you raise your self esteem you will feel you deserve the best and then you will realise that you are with H because you want to be, not because it's what he wants. You will be with him for you and nothing else. It takes some hard work HW, especially when you are not used to putting yourself first and looking for your best attributes and believing in yourself BUT it can be done! I am living proof of that.

Do you sometimes feel that you are drowning in all this HW. Trying not to want to control the situation, trying to 'let go' a bit and let H just be H but at the same time wanting to keep a hold of him? Does that make sense? I know what I'm trying to say but it's hard to write it down. I mean, you want him so bad, you want the marriage so bad but, you find it hard just to let go and trust him so sometimes you feel it would be easier just to quit, to walk away, give up on him and the marriage?

If you do feel any of the above HW (thats if you managed to understand wht I'm saying) then thats even more reason to work on yourself and your self esteem. You have to believe that, no matter what happened you would cope, if he did do it again, you would survive, then you have to draw a line under how you are thinking. You have to not let 'what if's' spoil your future. He is 50% as likely to have another affair as he is 50% not so why choose to give the negative head space? It doesn't make sense does it? Not unless you are enjoying the victim status is gives you. The wallowing. Yes, allowed occasionally but not for too long, wallowing only aloud to enable you to enjoy what you do have.

So, stop feeling badly done to, stop feeling negative, start feeling pleased with yourself that you have managed to turn this whole mess around, feel proud that you were a big enough person to even want to stick with H after his affair. Start looking to the future. New job etc. I've just had a bit of a lightbulb moment too. The new job signifies a big change in your relationship doesn't it. You wouldn;t be worrying that he is going to be working with another potential OW would you? Could that explain some of this insecurity?

As or the 5HTP, yes, thats what I take, its bloody brilliant! And, its a appetite suppressent too! And it works! I get mine from healthspan. 100mg tablets and they are cheaper

all those blooming spelling mistakes! I've done the girls aloud again instead of allowed too!

Just had another thought HW!

You were working on the relationship after the affair for such a long time, it was your focus, your mission, you invested a lot of yourself in that. Maybe now it's not taking up so much of your time, your energy, maybe it's not your diversion anymore. You are probably not reading as much So maybe you need a new focus????? I like to reinvent myself, like Madonna I can reccommend that as a new focus.

TFM wow I am so happy for you, have you really part ex dp

HW i know exactly where your coming from. I agree with TFM it's easy to blame the normal blips of a relationship on 'that' but remember these would have happened whetehr he had had affair or not (i am guilty of this too).
You do need to spend some time on you , look at the impact it's had on TFM. !
I think we need to learn how to live with the affair and have a 'normal' relationship afterwards.

Your posts about the car/train thing made me i am slightly cross at dp as he has been witdrawing money from joint account since being back at work and i am guessing it has been spent on odd drink after work/lunchtime and straight away alarm bells ring. I am going to speak to him tonight as i don't mind , although we are really skint but i need him to tell me or i add 2 and 2 together and get 5 !

I think things do go back to 'normal' in a sense and they don't feel they need to reaasure you as much and i suppose that's because they are happy with things , it's up to us to tell them wearen't but in a non hormonal , rational way ! (If you work out how to do it let me know ?)

PC are you back yet ?

Baffy hows things , thinking of you!

Hope everyone else ok!