Friend not disclosing she has kids she doesn’t see.

[99flake99]

How would you go about this? I have found out that a friend I have (reasonably close) has children she has never spoken about that live with her dad. She has had more kids now with someone else.

I don’t know how to take this, whether I should bring this up. I know there could be many reasons why it’s happened but I can’t help but feel a bit wary, it’s a massive thing to hide. Also I find it hard to understand why they haven’t kept any contact at all with them.

This is an important reminder that you never really know who you are entrusting your dc to when friends look after them. I’m not saying you shouldn’t but you need to be vigilant and not assume they are from your background with your values.

It’s not just a case of not leaving her kids with her, it could be that OPs children shouldn’t be around her at all or it’s something that OP wouldn’t be friends with her due to and that’s why she’s hiding it.

How absolutely routine and mundane a situation would this be if this was a male friend. Two a penny.

Because it's a woman you've leapt to it being something forensic, rather than a trauma or other circumstance that the mother has now grown and changed from.

You don't sounds like a good friend, OP. You also sound like you lack empathy and imagination - you can't imagine circumstances in which a woman would not see her children? You can't imagine why someone would want to keep their private life private? Do this poor woman a favour and find someone else to be judgemental and nosy about.

I don’t think it is incredibly rude and self entitled to be curious about something like this . It’s a huge thing not to have mentioned to someone you are friends with .

Why would you bring it up, it's none of your business? If you have concerns about her around your children because she hasn't told you every second of her life then just don't have her around your children. I have a friend who's kid lives with his dad because his dad engineered it that way and my friend has exhausted every avenue open to her and that she can afford, to no avail. She very very rarely talks about her kid because it's so fucking painful for her. People saying they would talk about it and it's all they would talk about it are once again failing to put themselves in someone else's shoes. It destroyed my friend, for years.

@99flake99OP, how would you feel if you find out that a friend had chosen to have two of her kids adopted in the dim and distant past, long before you met her? Would you judge her as a danger to your own children? Or would you have some empathy and ackowledge that she made a very difficult decision during a very difficult time in her life?

It's quite possible that she made a decision based entirely on what seemed best at the time. The fact that she doesn't mention them does not mean that she doesn't love them, miss them, regret the course of events. In fact her silence is quite likely protective because she doesn't want to have to repeatedly dredge it up and go over old ground that's probably very painful.

I know a family where 1 child was removed and 3 others were left with their parents with involvement from social services. It’s not a given that all children are removed.

Op, how do you know that the children were not her expartner's, born before they got together?

Maybe they were foster children.
Maybe the Dad's new partner adopted them.

Ask outright whether she has any other kids.
Or say, next time you see her (and when in private),
"My gosh Friend, why didn't you say you had two older kids?
XXX was talking about them and I was completely surprised.
Is that true."

Fine to be curious.

Not fine to insert yourself and start asking, under the guise of being worried about her looking after your kids.

She's not close enough to the OP to tell her and that's that.

It really has nothing to do with you.
Plus would you keep it to yourself if she ask you not to tell anyone, I THINK NOT
your already on MN talking about it, yet you dont have a clue.

Yes, but that was partly because of OP's bad communication because she first said the children lived with the friend's father, not the children's father and when asked to clarify replied very unhelpfully with 'father'. It took quite a while to get the correction that the children don't live with their grandfather so you can't judge posters for thinking the children live with neither parent.

Perhaps they have children they don't see themselves. It's the only thing I can think of.

It would massively change how I saw someone. Pretending your own children don't exist and lying about it so well. I'd also be wondering what else she was lying to me about.

You don’t know they were ‘taken’.

I have a friend who fled an abusive relationship. Her ex and his mum took her children, and threatened to tell the courts that she was abusing their children. She didn’t have the fight left in her.

She sees them now, and they understand but they were teens when she left.

No judgement please- she went through enough.

Could it be cultural? Many cultures and religions expect kids to be left with a grandparent / the father when a woman remarries.

They probably haven't been taken from her.

If you're estranged from someone then why would you mention them.

Even if she had multiple kids she had a perfectly reasonable relationship with she isn't obliged to 'disclose' their existence to anyone who's simply a friend.

Surely you're friends with for her own personality. Not the number of times she's given birth.

It’s uncommon for a woman to not see her children so of course it raises questions. Thats not to say fathers who deny their kids exist aren’t usually arseholes and that it’s fair that women are seen as odd for not seeing their children when it’s a common thing for men not to. None of that matters here, Op is right to put the safety of her own children and her own wellbeing above potentially offending someone.

I wouldnt feel the same about such a person.

Ffs, always people falling over themselves on here to stick the boot into OP, “none of your business”, “so what?”, “omg you’re being so judgemental”, “nothing to do with you”, “don’t leave your kids with people you don’t know then”

Classic mumsnet.

OP, of course it’s weird, and yes, I’d be wary of leaving my kids with her in future as well.

In the real world, if you’re fairly close friends with someone and have been for 2 years, it’s not unusual for the kids to be in each others houses in the other parents care etc.

And yes, it IS unusual to have more kids that you just NEVER mention.

So yes, I’d feel as you feel OP. Don’t know what you can do about it though.

Yeh but the op was just asking for advice and a discussion on it . To be fair it is weird .

If she sees them then she wouldn't pretend they don't exist, surely?

How awful if those children try to find her one day and find out no one has a clue about their existence and their own mum pretended her only children were her 'new' children.

I had a friend who I knew for about a decade before she disclosed to me that she had 2 other children who her ex had taken when they split. They had 4 children very close together and one day he walked out and took 2 of the children with him. And disappeared.

Years of battling to see them and she ended up with a few times a year contact. It was heartbreaking. The poor poor woman. Shoe died a few years ago I’m sure the grief was part of her decline.

I never commented or made it about me. OP you need to have a think about what is your business and what is not.

I can understand why she didn’t tell you as she probably doesn’t want to explain the situation. I’ve had this situation before and once they volunteered more information about the situation I decided to distance myself as I didn’t think they were a good person to be around.

How do you know they were taken from her and it's not that she willingly gave them up?