To never be a wife

[Whatwouldyoudonow]

I've been with my partner over 20 years since we were young. We got together and had children in our teens, I became a SAHM and he worked hard to support us. He asked me to marry him a few years down the line and I said yes. We had more children and were so busy with life that marrying wasn't a priority for either of us and to be honest I wasn't overly bothered about rushing to get married when I was younger. At that age you feel like you've got all the time in the world. We talked about it a while ago, we're older now and I hoped we would marry in the next few years and he seemed on the same page about it during those conversations. However, he's recently made it clear that he doesn't want to marry me, ever. He says we've been together so long and doesn't see the point now, apparently it's only a piece of paper after all. I don't want a big wedding, a registery office would be fine. I want a marriage, to vow our commitment to eachother, to be eachothers next of kin, to call him my husband and to have his name for however many years we have on this earth. He doesn't seem to care how upset I am about it but he wanted the same only a few years ago, to get married eventually. I'm sure many people will say this is why you don't have children before marrying, if it meant that much why has it taken over 20 years etc but it happened and I can't change any of what we've done in the past. We can only move forward and change the future. I feel hurt, rejected, embarrassed, resentful even and i'm finding it difficult to feel the same about him so it's really been affecting our relationship. I can't get over these feelings no matter how hard I have tried. I don't want to throw away our relationship, it's been very tough at times, but we've made it all these years and I always thought we'd be together forever. My feelings have surprised me as I didn't realise being married meant this much to me until he decided it was off the table. I guess I just don't know what to do or how to make myself accept and be ok with the fact he doesn't want to get married to me. Has anyone been through similar, how did you get over feeling this way?

You need to sit down and ask him what he thinks will happen to you and his children if he dies. Because currently you are in big trouble.

Has he even made you beneficiary of his pension?

You then need to get a job immediately and start paying as much money as possible into a pension for yourself.

This isn’t something you can leave you need to act on it right now. I’m so sorry.

This.

And don't feel stupid. Well, allow yourself to feel stupid today and then tomorrow change things. It's not too late. But you will have to be strong and lay it all out for him - and stick to it! It's very very urgent and very very important you take the advice on this thread.

My brother & his wife got married in their 50s after 20 years together for precisely this reason

Not the point of your thread, but I think it’s absolutely appalling that British law leaves people - let’s face it, mostly women - in this position. It’s so antiquated and gives men all the power and leaves women so spectacularly vulnerable, not only to men who do this deliberately but to decent couples who just don’t realise that eg they won’t automatically get half the house or the pension if the other one dies. Plenty of jurisdictions, like New South Wales, have de facto relationship laws that automatically give you pretty much the same rights as a married couple after two years living together.

Don’t beat yourself up. There is nothing to be gained from that. You aren’t the first or the last to be in this position.

We desperately need to educate people on the importance of marriage in these situations. There has been this narrative that marriage is the roses and flowers, rom-com thing to do and that cool girls don’t get sucked in by it.

That’s not it at all. It is a legal and financial commitment way beyond the love and bonding side of things. People don’t realise until this happens.

Every parent needs to have this conversation as soon as stay at home parenting is on the table. Trying to have the conversation retrospectively is never going to go well - by then one partner has all the cards and has no obligation to share with the one who gave up their independence.

No one who is completely on his side would advise your partner to marry you now.

You are in a very vulnerable position.

You need to find out all of the following:

1. Is the house own jointly or as tenants in common?
2. Does he have a pension? Are you named as the beneficiary? (He can change that at any minute to so it's still a vulnerable position)
3. Does he have life assurance, death in service and/or critical illness cover? (Again, who is the beneficiary?
4. What is his plan to provide for you & your children in the event if his death?
5. Where do you live? Are there any rights for long term partners? (For example co-habitation bill in Ireland)

Would be be willing to speak to a financial advisor or solicitor with you jointly or does he even care about the potential position he may leave you in?

If he won't you need to get your own independent advice.

Agree.
It's odd that women from conservative cultures that insist on marriage before cohabitation or children often find themselves legally better off than women from more ' liberated' families.

So many posts on MN where women have been told by their partners that marriage is ' Victorian", " outdated" and " not feminist" when actually it is a contract which protects the weaker party. In nearly all cases, this is women.

I have reservations about this too, though. I think marriage (and the contract it results in) does need to be an opt in situation.

I didn’t marry my DD’s father because it would have been to my detriment. That was a conscious decision.

it just needs more education about marriage, I think. It should be something that is pushed out with the maternity materials from the midwives.

Don't feel bad.

They talk in the news about giving lessons to boys on treating women with respect, well they need to give lessons in schools to girls on knowing their legal and financial rights.

My friend. As an unmarried SAHP you are the vulnerable person in this relationship and you need to advocate for yourself.

You need to find out what happens if he dies, has he made a provision for you to stay and made you a pension beneficiary. What happens if you pass, and he marries someone else - will he will everything to your children?

Mortgage, will, power of attorney and pension all can have different outcomes depending on if you are married or not. Additionally neither of you can claim the inheritance tax exemption.

There is a series of long and painful conversations to have with your partner but you do not want to find out the hard way that you have been left nothing and are liable for all the bills.

If it's the idea of Marriage that he objects to, how about a Civil Partnership. No one has to g a husband or a wife in that scenario but you get legal protections.

Don't beat yourself up. You say yourself it's been a good relationship and it sounds like, even if there were inequalities, you were happy and felt loved and supported. So, if you're lucky, you can make him understand.

The reality is that lots of women land up in this situation, and sadly, often their families/friends/communities are complicit without meaning to because of expectations etc. We're told we should be "grateful" that he's "providing" for us. We're told he "works hard" or "is trying". We're told "not to rock the boat".

I think it's changing, but it's not always quick.

It isn't just what he wants though, it's what you want. You seem to be accepting his feelings as the last word. You get a say too.

You need to speak honestly to him, tell him that although he seems to have changed his mind, you haven't, and it means everything to you for him to honour what you both agreed. If he won't consider it, then you have to ask him whether he actually wants is to end the relationship. I can think of no other reason why someone who loved his partner would refuse her something so important.

@Whatwouldyoudonow do you think your DH isn’t aware of the fact that marriage is no more a piece of paper than the contract he signed to buy his house. He is a grown man he completely understands this. After all these years together he is not willing to give you the protection marriage offers for you. I think you need to face up to the reality of your situation and protect yourself.

My brother and partner of 40 years are about to get married. No kids, but they both have big pensions and a couple of properties. They are getting married to avoid taxes, legal fees and headaches, when one them dies.

Eek, you really need to protect yourself. OH and I are not married but we do have wills. We are thinking of doing a civil partnership though, so legally both protected and it also stops you having to pay IH tax if the worst were to happen to one of you.

I take some pleasure in wiping the smiles off these men’s faces when I explain to them exactly how much unnecessary IHT they have to pay due to their choice to not get married.

I would be interested to know why he's totally changed his mind on the issue of marriage in the last few years. I would also suspect that he's got a huge pension pot and is making sure he doesn't have to share that if he leaves you. It's not good, OP, but you know that.

just to ask or say maybe: risks of a disabled child and care defaulting to the women and man leaving

How does marriage protect you here? married or not, anyone can leave and the parenting defaults to one person

You cannot be so sure it is financially motivated, I know men and women who have been together for so long and fully happy, they do not see the point of marriage.

Incidentally, I've had a few of these sorts of arguments with DH (not about money and finances) but where his view is that HIS opinion is the most important and/or that I just have to accept whatever it is that HE has decided is right.

I've found that usually when I say something like, "Right, so becuase YOU are uncomfortable with X, I must just be uncomfortable with Y? My discomfort is not as important as your comfort?" usually forces a conversation and some sort of compromise. I don't always do this in the calm, rational, polite way I would prefer....

eg a few years ago when the mental load was getting out of hand for me and I was trying to get him to discuss a particular event with me, happening in a few days and that required logistics to manage children etc. I had attempted to address this more than once. Now it was urgent. He basically said something INFURIATING like, "I can't think about this now, it's not until Friday - we can figure it out then". I pointed out yelled aggressively and sarcastically that actually, no, we couldn't think about it then becuase there were actual arrangements that had to happen BEFORE we could do the event but of course, perhaps this thing for our children was just too unimportant and boring for his very important man brain so I would, of course, as usual, just pick it all up and make all the decisions and do all the work. And would he like me to present it to him in in a preferred format?

I think even "good" men are socialised to expect women to just do what they want and to "trust them" and to make their lives easier. And it takes a lot to break that conditioning.

The financial split in a divorce can and should take this in to consideration, it would be highly unlikely to be a 50/50 split

She’s worked every day since having her children.

You get a say too and you cannot afford to be passive now.

So you are apparently good enough to live with but not to marry?.
I'd stick it to him big time now and show him the meaning of the loss of you.

I would ask him outright what he thinks is going to happen to you when he dies re the finances and property you reside in. The chances are that he will pre decease you. Is he burying his head in the sand here re his mortality?.

Does he work?. Who has he named as a beneficiary for his pension?. I am also concerned that as you have been a SAHM your NI stamp has not been paid so you will not receive much from your State pension when it is paid at 67 years of age.

How old are you now?. I assume the children have his surname as well.

You need to get informed.
What £ do you have? In your name? Eg he has paid for you to open max ISA s each tax year?
Is everything in joint account?
What is house equity?
His private or work pension?
Your private pension?
Are your NI up to date ? Eg you claime cb even if didnt take it .. for the NI credits

Will.
Life insurances.
He dies tomorro what do you get?
He leaves you tomorro what do you get?