DH and woman friend/colleague, am I being naive or paranoid?

[Mybloodyvalentine2]

Last year a woman joined DH’s workplace, they quickly became good friends and work closely together. No issue with that, DH always been very sociable.
But at the last few work dos I joined him at I saw for myself their relationship - the easy laughter, closeness, banter and how they just ‘get’ each other. If I’m honest, that really hurt. As did a jokey comment at the Christmas party from another colleague about their workwife/husband vibe which DH quickly laughed off.
After this party I peeked at his phone (I know) and saw a few longish calls and many texts between them going back over months. There was nothing sexual but there was an intimacy of a different kind, lively, lovely fun messages, sharing things to make each other laugh, witty little comments he’d make. All non-work. Often sent when I was out (I work 4 evening shifts) or asleep.
What particularly got me was he hadn’t been honest about some things that I’d asked him about. Nothing huge but like when he’d been away for a work thing in November and I’d asked who with (it had been with her and 2 others) but he said she wasn’t there.
I confronted him and he was furious that I’d looked and read messages. I get it but all my concerns were completely ignored, and became all about me in the wrong for invading his privacy. He didn’t talk to me the next day. He then said he’d lied because while it was innocent he would have got grief from me again.
This was a month ago and things are sort of calmer but he refuses to talk about it as it’s all completely innocent and it’s my issue.
I haven’t snooped again and won’t, mainly because I feel ashamed that I did but because it upset me so much I don’t want to go there again if there are more.
Am I being overly jealous or naive? Because he’s lied about the little things I don’t know anymore and I’m beginning to mistrust and resent him which he says is completely unfair when he’s done nothing wrong. We’ve been married for 17 years, 2 older teens. She’s married with dc too.

Naive. They are having an an emotional affair, or heading in that direction. The fact that he was defensive rather than trying to allay your fears speaks volumes. Set some harsh boundaries now about what is acceptable to you, and the consequences he will face if he crosses them. Ask him how he would feel if you were behaving the same way with another man.

Do a search here for "emotional affair" and read the countless threads that will come up - you will likely recognise your husband in many of them.

I am so sorry, it is a horrible situation to be in.

so dodgy op, there's so much of this on here lately. It's never being matey with a male colleague is it.

Thanks, he told me he refuses to give up her friendship and couldn’t even if he wanted to as they see each other everyday.
he says he loves me and want things to be better between us and she is just a mate. Nothing untoward at all and that I’m risking a happy home because I’m being paranoid.
if this really is true then I’m risking so much.

If there is "nothing", he shouldnt have hidden anything from you. He's gaslighting you. And on that basis, i think you are being naive. She's married with kids so this might not amount to much, but seems like there is an emotional affair in the making or in progress. Hope for the best but get your ducks in a row.

I think she strokes his ego by finding him charming and funny and understandably he is enjoying the attention. Why would he not?
one of her messages which I confronted him with was about how he is her “most very fave colleague in the office and in fact the whole branch” 🙄

So why is he messaging her/calling when you are not around then? Why so covert? Dodgy isnt it, but when you ask him, he says its all in your head, thats gaslighting. Does he have an explanation as to why he calls/text when you are not around? I would be suspicious but not run for a divorce just yet. Keep a close eye and get your ducks in a row just in case

Naive sadly.

This is how they all start.
This is how they all respond when confronted.

They may not have crossed the physical line but they are both clearly getting something out of their contact.

I think I'd find it upsetting that he's making such an effort being lively and fun and friendly with another woman - you should be the focus of that attention. It's not great to look on your partner's phone but he should also understand that this relationship with a work friend is making you feel unhappy and insecure. He should be concerned that his behaviour has made you feel this way and want to reassure you, not make you feel like you're making a fuss about nothing.

Married people can still be attracted to and have a spark of connection with someone, we're all human, but if you're married, you have to guard against getting too close with a colleague or a friend outside the marriage. Emotional affairs are exhilarating and exciting and can often lead to full blown affairs.

Your gut tells you there's a threat. Don't ignore it.

Is this a physical affair? Probably not. If it were, they would be working harder to hide it.

But it is an emotional connection that is too close for comfort considering that they are both married.

I would play it like this:

Tell him that he can fool himself as much as he wants but he’s not fooling you nor the others around him at work. That it’s obvious that there is an emotional connection between 2 married people that is deepening. That he is playing with fire.

Tell him to mull over how he would feel if the tables were turned and you were messaging a male work colleague when H was at work or sleeping?

Tell him that you don’t want a long conversation about the situation. You don’t want to hear his protests. Tell him that you want him to take some time to think, really think, about where all of this could be heading.

Tell him that you won’t beg, that everyone has choices in life and in their marriages. But he needs to think very carefully about the choices he makes from now on and the potential consequences of those choices.

I would do this very calmly and with minimal emotion. Ice Queen. I would be very clear and precise so that he can’t have any confusion over your thoughts on the matter.

Show him your boundaries and see if he continues to trample over them.

I have long believed that affairs do not just happen. They are the result of many little decisions and choices a person makes in the run up to the act. I think he’s at the stage where he thinks he can pretend to everyone that those choices are innocent. The messages, the lunches/coffees together at work, the in jokes and banter, the nick names. All on their own, these individual actions are nothing. But when put together, over a period of time, they become something.

What you see as an emotional affair, I just see as normal friendship. You sound as if your concern is that your marriage isn't in great shape, and you feel the version of him you saw in his text exchanges with this woman was one you'd like to encounter in your marriage.

It’s always a huge red flag when they make it quite clear that they won’t give up their “friendship” and prioritise it over their wife.

Typical DARVO, he denied anything was going on, attacked you for looking at his phone and reversed victim and offender. It's manipulative and used to avoid taking responsibility for harmful actions. He is damaging your relationship and he didn't care to listen to your concerns, he then blanked you for a day and then blamed you for his lies. Is any of that the behaviour of someone who loves you?

I love what Ohcrap082024 has to say.

It’s one thing having a lovely friendship at work, it’s another messaging and calling each other while you’re asleep. Why are they in each others mind at night time? That would make me uncomfortable.

I had an EA with a colleague a couple of years ago. Nobody expects it to happen and it’s never something you consider to be a problem until you find yourself thinking about them when they’re not around and looking forward to seeing them.

It started off for us as you say, we got along super well and had really great lively chats primarily about work but our lives, books, current affairs etc too. Then I noticed certain body language cues from him indicating attraction and I realised when I thought deeply about it, I was probably giving off similar vibes because he was massively attractive. We started finding reasons to spend more time with one another. We’d always pretend they were innocent and related to work but the more time went by, the closer I realised we were getting.

Luckily I guess for me something in his life happened that meant he had to return to his home country. I was devastated when he left and it showed. I hadn’t told anyone how much I cared for him at all but one day decided to tell my best friend. Unbeknownst to me, DH checked through my phone every so often and he decided to read this message so found out. It all blew up and I felt super ashamed of myself. Nothing physical ever happened beyond leg grazing and a long hug when he left but you know, for DH it was somehow worse because feelings were involved.

We had to have counselling and I had to come to terms with it all but it’s been a slog and I still think about him. I’m just giving you my story because your DH might be in denial about his feelings, or he might be at the stage where he’s telling himself it’s innocent and a friendship. The long intimate messages say it all. I’m not convinced heterosexual people of the opposite sex often engage in this behaviour unless there’s some attraction and desire. Perhaps I’m cynical.

You have friendships with male colleagues that you'd lie to your husband about being away with, that are referred to as your work husband in front of him and who you have long calls with and message privately at night while he is not there?

I’m all for people being friends and having a laugh at work - it makes the working day much more enjoyable- but when it is hidden from partners and extends out of work hours I think you would be right to be suspicious.

If she was just a mate, why were you kept in the dark?

I don't ever tell lies about friendships to anyone. What I'm referring to as 'normal' is having an affectionate, banter-based friendship with an opposite-sex colleague, exchanging text messages out of work. Two of my closest friends are men I used to work with, in two different jobs. I now live in a different country to both of them, but I used to see them for a drink out of work, or go to a film or have a meal. I got on very well with one of their wives, too, but she commuted internationally, so I saw far less of her. DH didn't turn a hair. He has good, longtime female friends, too.

The fact he lied about her being there and then gaslit you to blame you for that - this should show you enough. He's a twat

OMG how cringe - she's deffo stroking his ego. I do have a few close male friends from past jobs that I still see (group setting) probably every other month for a few drinks in London. We don't message flirty (more brother/sister vibes insulting each other etc. in group whatsapp) so my husband doesn't bat an eyelid. If it was flirty that would be another story..

So true.

Can you have another discussion with dh and say Huw you understand that people can have platonic friendships at work , but regularly texting and communicating outside work feels wrong to say. Even explain the concept if an emotional affair, and say it feels sneaky to you. Why hide things if it’s all innocent? And how would he feel
if you message gorgeous hunk Brad from accounts regularly?

There is DARVO at play here.

You are right in being suspicious, but what you do matters here. You have now spoken with him, and he has basically gaslit you, and managed to even blame you for this.

Now you have a choice as he has had his head turned from someone at work. It happens all the time, more often than people care to admit to. What you do now is think about what you are prepared to accept, and at what point you say enough is enough. He is showing you where he feels you should be at in terms of his so called friendship, he wants you to stay in your lane. I get why you are jittery over what to do next, and if this spells the end for your marriage.

You need to think about where the dealbreaker is for you, and where you draw the line. What else needs to happen for you to think that is it?
Respect should be his priority seeing he is married to you, but what he has said to your face, then given you the silent treatment, as if you were a naughty child that needed to be disciplined, stay in your lane etc, is him disprespecting you, your marriage and the unsaid is telling on his entitlement.

No I wouldn’t put up with this. Not at all.

He is DARVO-ing and gaslighting the fuck out of you and if it isn’t already a physical affair it soon will be.

Never in the 26 years we’ve been together has my dh felt the need to text a female colleague about anything that isn’t work related. It’s basic respect.

He’s cleverly backed you into a corner already and made you second guess your feeling that his relationship with her is deeper than a normal working one.
From what you’ve told us here I think you are almost certainly right. Don’t ignore the fact that his other colleagues at work referred to her as his work wife - their closeness has obviously not gone un noticed in the office either.
I’m really sorry you find yourself in this position OP and The AvidWriter’s last paragraph is spot on for me