Would anyone be interested in an Emotionally Immature Parents thread?

[Thundertoast]

Sorry if this has already been done somewhere and ive missed it!
I do dip into the stately homes threads, but wonder if people would be up for a support thread for emotionally immature parents specifically, rather than narcissistic parents which is its own beast of a topic...
I know this time of year can be incredibly frustrating and bring up old wounds, so just in case anyone else is in the same boat, and wanted a rant/cry/chat, there's a mulled wine here ready for you.

Shout out to the amazing book on the topic 'Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, Or Self-Involved Parents by Lindsay Gibson)

I'll start: have the annual festive 'performance' with emotionally immature parent scheduled. Last years was a disaster that let to me for the first time in my life approaching them to go 'what the fuck was that, you cannot behave that way and expect me to want to spend time with you' (in a nutshell, sulking and nastiness all evening) which was met with tears and denial and more tears and profuse apologies and guilt laden requests for comfort, and since then any meetups have had a heavy air of 'im so very sad and small and tiptoeing around you because I just want you to be happy'
Of course, I have tiptoed around their rages and moods my entire life, and have always sucked it up to keep the peace and keep the mood light, even when they have behaved like a sullen teenager, so the fact they are now behaving like a wounded animal does not induce sympathy in me, just annoyance and frustration that they cant suck it up and think 'Although im sad, my child shouldn't have to continue to deal with my feelings about me upsetting them'

Hope that if anyone's out there and in a similar boat they can come along and commiserate!

When they died I felt I had been let out of prison.

Mine are still with us but this is exactly how I think I'll feel. Felt something like it when I went abroad for an extended period when I was young.
It's the same shit that has happened every day for 60 years but it gets amplified at Christmas. And still a refusal to make any changes whatsoever. One is incapable of even contemplating change and when it's suggested to the other: "That's easy to say but a lot harder to do." And I suppose when you are getting whatever you are getting out of maintaining the status quo, it is hard to change. Impossible in fact. I wish I'd managed to escape.

I have only recently realised that my parent does this to me, ive characterised it as 'sulking' and 'moodiness' because they dont go fully silent but they go to one word answers and not engaging....

Oh yes. At my mums care home she had a stroke. She was 94 and spent 6 weeks in hospital before she died. I went a few times a week to visit her. All I could think about was how difficult this would be if I cared one jot about her. Truth was that by that time I hated her.

It's refreshing to read of other people's experiences with out the usual "but their your parents" "how can you say that about your family." Thanks for making this thread.

I literally am reading this book right now. so will be watching this thread - thank you!

I am very early in my journey of understanding things.

My story is:

now 36, but Mum and Dad are both emotionally immature in different ways and broke up when I was 2. my Dad has had a string of marriages and children and he has no sense of parental responsibility, When I went to stay with him, he would go to the pub or take me to the pub - that was basically it. My mum was raised by a narcissist so really struggles with life herself and was quite neglectful of my emotional needs, she remarried when I was reasonably young and had a child - they went on holiday as a family of 3 to Canada, France, Greece, Italy (all over) whilst me and my brother 12-14 to 15-17 stayed at home because it was too expensive to take us. I was always told - if she had her time again she wouldnt have children.

I am just navigating and learning at the moment.

So far the book has spoken to me when it said - many children of emotionally immature parents are in a hurry to be adults (I was 18 when I bought my first house, got married young - to the wrong person - divorced now) I am also an internaliser and I apologise for everything all the time, I feel guilt for no real sensible reason and most importantly now I am trying to learn why I dont allow myself to feel safe or to ask for help.

Its quite good just to write this stuff down. thank you

Of course - i think its important for those of us who sit in the grey area between 'abusive parents' and 'okay parents' to have somewhere to offload.
The idea that I am meant to bend over backwards to put up with someone in my life who behaves badly and brings me nothing positive, simply because they had a shag 30something years ago that created me and then did the bare minimum of parenting to a small child...
I dont see why people are told they HAVE to spend time with people whose company they dont enjoy, full stop, to be honest... for the sake of a 'relationship' that is only enjoyed by one person, and its not because they like me as an individual...

Welcome, and here for any and all thinking out loud and offloading.
' I am also an internaliser and I apologise for everything all the time, I feel guilt for no real sensible reason and most importantly now I am trying to learn why I dont allow myself to feel safe or to ask for help.' This really resonated with me. Hope you are doing okay.

Mine told me not to have children because they ruin your life. First time she said it I would have been 10-11 and just remember thinking 'thanks mum why do I need to know that'.
Similar with the holidays. I always had to stay at home alone because someone needed to look after the dog. My brother got to go because he was a lot younger than me but from 14 it was me and the dog.
Like you I grew up too quickly but fortunately met DP at 19 and am still with him 40 years later ❤

Does the phrase 'performative crying' mean anything to you? I use this to myself when my DM gets performatively upset about things. Quite often it's because she is 'worried about' me or one of the DCs. It means I now don't tell her about anything remotely negative that can be catastrophised

I'm reading this book right now and its so apt and the impact on me as an adult has taken me decades of untangling to get myself to a point where I can see clearly and understand that I am not crazy, that the things we had to put up with really did have an impact.

• I've stopped being my Mum's unpaid therapist, if she calls after a meltdown telling me she wants to kill herself I try to get her to seek therapy - she won't

• I limit my interactions with them - my Mum and my stepfather are both very 'unique' and basically believe they can behave how they want and that everyone else should just move on and forget as life is too short.
• I've had years of therapy, untangling why I had so little self esteem, why I was so scared of being in love, and then when I was in love, I ruined it because I was so terrified of losing it.
• An ADHD diagnosis has also helped, my Mum undoubtably has it too but scoffs at the idea, despite her emotions going from 0-100 in seconds, her inability to cope with said emotions and her communication style, which is sadly like mine but i've learnt to adapt.
• She can talk about really quite awful traumas from her childhood and pass them off as fine - like being hit around the head and having her eardrum burst, but her Dad meant well.
• For years I abused alcohol and drugs, sought solice in my amazing group of friends and allowed myself to be abused sexually because I didn't feel like I mattered.

but - i'm here now, and in a far better place - which I am very thankful and grateful for. Despite all the madness, I have empathy for my Mum and I do love her - she's like a child and I don't think she will ever be able to do the work that i've done. She see's me as humourless, which is a shame as that is totally not me - I have good friends that see a much lighter side of me - but I was forced into a position of responsibility for her as a child and so yeah, I do kinda find it hard to lighten up when I am with them.

I feel incredibly sad that I will not have the relationship with my family like I see others having, but I am grateful to be seeing and feeling more clearly than every before. I really do recommend therapy!

thank you for responding its really helpful to not feel like the only one. A PP above said something about the grey area - I would never think at all my parents were abusive but they were far from perfect so its feeling ok to process that as an adult.

I have never had children and the main reason is I truly felt children should be born to people who really want them and I didnt feel wanted. I felt like an inconvenience who cost too much money and demanded too much time and attention. I had a paper round from 13 years old so I could pay for dance classes and the bus to dance classes - my Mum hated having to drive me places and I basically had to figure it out myself.

What I find weird as an adult is at the time I think I told myself I preferred to be independent and taking care of myself and in a way I am really grateful as I know how to look after myself but I recognise how this might affect my relationship now - not letting anyone in or helping me and not being able to explain why I dont feel safe etc.

thank you so much really appreciate it x

Thank you for starting this - read the book a couple of years ago and am still having a lot of realisations around my upbringing. It very much applies to my mum, who expects to be looked after (whilst telling you that she doesn't need any help with anything), and will cry, sulk and emotionally manipulate if she doesn't get her way. I was recently quite unwell and didn't even tell her about it because I knew it would get turned around to be all about her. It also brought up a lot of stuff I'd forgotten about how she treated me when I was ill as a child - as if it was all a great inconvenience to her and telling me off for not behaving in the 'right' way when I was unwell.

My dad is one of many siblings, and could only make himself heard as a child by getting loud and angry, which translated into adult life, but he realised this about himself and had a lot of therapy. My mum refused to go to marriage counselling when he asked and they're now divorced.

Yes, used differently in my case (when they realise they are in the wrong or in the one time I confronted them, when I told them they were in the wrong)
Are you then expected to lavish physical affection and praise on them?

Those with siblings and/or children of your own, were/are your parents different with them?

It's weird isn't it? Grateful for the self sufficiency but so damaged that it's hard to let people in. It is a form of abuse because the effects are just as damaging as physical abuse, more so sometimes. I was also physically abused but actually the psychological and emotional harm is much more difficult to overcome. Bruises fade quite quickly but the other stuff takes much longer and can be harder to even recognise as abusive.

It's quite liberating to be able to say that out loud, isn't it?

Mine are tapping 80 and hanging on in there

I have been NC for decades - I am 60 now, moved far away when I was 19. Managed to salavage a relationship with my sister about 10 years ago. She clings to a vague hope and I am afraid I leave her to it!

Both parents have been ill recently. Dad is the most frail, has Parkinsons. I live in hope it will carry him off. Not because I think Mum deserves some life without him, she is just as bad, but because my sister won't have to keep going back to the man who lied to her, stole from her and pouted "But it's mine / I thought you wouldn't mind" for years

I have hated the pair of them for as long as I have not lived in their house - they threw me out at 16. It started as a raging hate and has now mellowed to pity, at best. Mostly just a shrug

I hope those of you who need to hear it take that in... you can hate them, you can work through it and come out the other side of that hate and just wonder how they ever got there in the first place?

Please could i join. Lots of similarities with what others are saying, particularly the belief that is always my fault. My dsis is quite enmeshed so I always feel it must be my fault if she finds DM so agreeable.

This thread is really interesting. I often think when my mum is off on one about something or other ‘grow up’ but I don’t think I had really translated that into her other behaviours. Her own mother is a very difficult woman so I try and give her leeway but I see her saying things and behaving in ways that mirror her own mother and it’s exhausting walking on eggshells around her for fear of setting her off on some other ridiculous rant. It might not be the same thing but I might have a look at the recommended book and see if it resonates. I always say I have such an intense fear of conflict because my mother was/is always flying off the handle at every slight, imagined or otherwise so whatever it is it’s definitely impacted me growing up/as an adult.

Really good to hear I am not alone in this. This week my dm had a strop because my eldest son who lives 6 hours away snd is only coming for 3 days at Christmas will not be going to see her the minute he arrives to look at her Christmas decorations, because he is seeing her for the whole day Christmas day at our home, she cried saying no point in putting decorations up then. No acknowledgment that perhaps I want to spend time with my own son for a bit. Then preceded to end the call with a laughing voice with, oh dear this call has all been me, me, me again! Ahhhhhh

Welcome, sorry you've had to deal with this too!
A question for you and anyone else who has talked about how parents make it about themselves when you are unwell.

If you dont tell them you've been unwell at the time, and then tell them when you are on the road to recovery, do they then make a massive fuss about you not telling them?

My parent has historically sulked when ive been ill as im not performing to their standard. I remember them being generally very dismissive of illness in general as a child.
I had a really, really nasty virus a couple of years ago where i was ill for 3 weeks and struggling to eat or talk, so was very tired all the time, mistakenly let them know as they had checked in, they were then texting/calling me loads (when I said I was fine, had support and just needed sleep) constantly offering to bring things round and getting offended when I said I didnt need anything and brought things i said I didnt need anyway. Lots of saying 'im your parent, you have to let me look after you' 'let me come round and visit you, I want to see you and make sure you are okay' i couldnt eat or talk and was sleeping all day and said that i just needed rest, repeatedly, and that I wasnt up to visitors which was met with 'but im not a visitor, im your parent' i couldnt talk! There was nothing practically they could do for me! I was texting that I preferred to be left alone and had support! But it was all about what they thought should happen, as usual.

I was then ill again a few months later (different issue, just a flu bug, much less serious) and didnt tell them until i was recovered and they went on for WEEKS about how I should have told them, why didnt I tell them. Got brought up constantly with repeated 'but why didnt you tell me! I could have helped!!' 'WHY didnt you tell me, i wish you'd have told me'

Same with sibling - parent has gendered expectations of their children (not blatantly stated, but very much there) so the problems were slightly different.
Their relationship was openly worse in our twenties, sibling and parent very similar so butted heads and sibling kept them at arms length, was willing to argue, put up walls etc, which caused a lot of conflict as parent simply didnt think they should back off.
As the people pleaser, this caused me a lot of anxiety as I believed it was my problem to keep things on an even keel at meetups. Neither of them had any thought for how their conflict would make me feel, but then I can also see why sibling gave as good as they got. They were hurting too, and why should they sit and take it?
Our relationship took a big hit as I associated time with them as stressful, and now certain parental traits (they are right, you are wrong, they know best, always someone else's fault, believing their right to feel their feelings means other people should put up with their moods spoiling occasions) are coming to the front of siblings personality, so I find them hard to spend time with in general.

@Thundertoast - yes, if she ever finds out I'll get a lot of "you should have told me, why didn't you tell me" - I'll have to say something like "I didn't want you to worry" rather than "because you'd have insisted on coming to 'help' and made me feel much worse, plus told lots of other people so you would get sympathy, and probably posted on Facebook about it for attention seeking reasons". I got 'told off' for not telling her when my dad was very unwell a couple of years ago - she's refused to speak to him since they split up, dragged out the divorce process because she couldn't possibly be expected to deal with something so horrible and difficult, and he didn't want her to know. But she thought she had some right to.

It's hard, because deep down when you're ill, you do still want your mum - but you never really have had what that should mean.

Its just the essence of emotional immaturity isnt it, its not that they even want an answer, I dont think, they just want you to know how upset they are, repeatedly.