In shock, should he leave?

[Ialwaysthoughtitwasadojo]

Sorry if this is a bit muddled, I’m honestly in shock. We’d actually been getting on better recently, he was finally making an effort, and then today he suddenly announced he wanted out, and doesn't see a long term future with me.

We’ve been together 12 years, two DC still at home, 7 and 9. The marriage had been hard because he gets incredibly grumpy, makes no effort, but we had been going to therapy and I thought things were getting better. We've just had a wonderful week away together.

So first of all, I'm feeling blind sided, has anyone had this? I feel so torn like I should try and save it. My therapist did say he was emotionally abusive, so I probably need to give my head a wobble. I thought maybe she was over reacting.

Also, he doesn't want to leave. He wants to stay in the house for 6/7 months if needed, whilst we figure things out! I can't do that. I can't pretend we're ok, it will be so much harder to get over! He's the one that wants out and works away all the time, can I ask him to leave? I'm primary carer, pick up all the slack and work from home.

We’re trying to spend time apart but inevitably we end up in each others space and sort of competing for the children’s time.

I asked him again tonight to move out and he just won’t.

He says we need to talk about it with the therapist but what will that achieve?

Yes I’ve done this, it’s a great school for this sort of thing.

He’s still dictating to me what should happen and pushing back when I want something. For example he wanted to have one of the kids for an activity but they’re already doing something that was booked months ago. Acted all annoyed, but it’s not his to control anymore!

@Ialwaysthoughtitwasadojo "He says we need to talk about it with the therapist but what will that achieve?" He's probably hoping she'll persuade you to leave the home. (Fortunately, from what you've said, she's already got the measure of him.)

Hes hoping the therapist will take his side and declare it acceptable to cohabit.

Have you got a family calendar? Put everything on there, activities, clubs etc so he can't say you are being obstructive.

That’s an excellent idea, start as you mean to go on, @Ialwaysthoughtitwasadojo. I think I’ve heard/read about an app for separated/divorced parents who do not get on well to use in order to work out schedules for them and their children (school stuff, holidays, access, after-school clubs, parties, sleepovers, etc) without the parents having to have any other direct contact with each other. Might that be of use here?

Just be aware that he will be as obstructive as possible. I say that, because if you say I’m going out on X and it’s your time with the DC he will probably try and manufacture something so that you will need to stay home.

You need to grey rock him but also be mindful at how controlling he is. It was not surprising in regards to the comment that your sister made. He has held you back and now you can blossom.

I would still contact the therapist before the meeting and be very clear that if he tries to engineer it in any way for you to be the scapegoat, then you will leave.

You’re doing so well OP. Learning not to be compliant and trying to choose the path of least destruction must be very difficult; but you owe him nothing - least of all making life easy for him.
I think if you have the feeling the therapist knows what he’s like, “sides” with you and that he seems to hold their opinions with some esteem, I’d be inclined to email the therapist and tip them off about what’s happened, what you want to happen and why- a little preparation may put you in a stronger position. I’d use this to your advantage because really, the therapist is otherwise a pretty pointless at this stage.
There’d be no coming back from this for me and having this person on your side may help you to find your roar.
This dick needs to hear some brutal home truths that he doesn’t get to have it all his own way anymore.

Seeing the counsellor was presumably a way for you and your husband to try and work through problems and issues in your relationship. Your relationship is at an end which renders this meeting rather pointless.
Obviously the way forward now is mediation as recommended by your solicitor when you reach that point during the divorce procedure and you are negotiating living arrangements, child care, visitation rights and so on.
Obviously if you feel you still need to talk to your counsellor then do so but on your own - the last thing you need is someone taking sides even if you feel justified.

@Ialwaysthoughtitwasadojo as others have said, I’m sure I’ve heard people mention an app for co-parenting. As for who moves out, the main thing is the kids stay in their home, surely, if the house is not being sold. Whether he likes it or not, that means the parent who they live with the bulk of the time is the one who lives there, i.e. you. So I think if you frame it that way rather than him being ‘forced out’ (as he sees it) he will get used to it having to be that way.

Thanks everyone, it’s just shit. I’m trying to take it hour by hour still, I’ve laughed at things today and had fun with my kids. Then I’ll remember and just be filled with a sense of dread! My appetite is slowly returning and im getting SOME sleep. I’d really like proper sleep tonight though, I feel like it helps so much.

He’s away for work tomorrow, and I’m just counting down the hours till the counselling session on Wednesday.

@Ialwaysthoughtitwasadojo How did the solicitor appt go today OP?

You might feel a bit better when he sods off to work xx

You are separated under the one roof. That means no doing anything for him and TOO BAD if he cooks dinner and expects you to eat with him. Let the kids eat with him and you go out for an hour. Get take away and eat at a park or eat at a diner. Anything/anywhere to make the point to him that HE IS NOT COOKING FOR YOU.

I would be wary he is trying to put the date of separation forward (as well as being emotionally abusive). Not sure why but he could say he was still cooking for you/you were still a couple up until X date. Wonder if he is moving money around?

Good luck today @Ialwaysthoughtitwasadojo, I hope it is a productive session.

Thanks @Inthedeep it was helpful in terms of understanding what is best for the kids, which apparently IS him staying in the house. Not the outcome I wanted but knowing it is better for the children is helping me reframe things. I just need to work out some strategies on how to cope.

Even the counsellor did say, that usually the split has to reflect the nature of who has been primary carer, so I pushed back on DH's 50/50 suggestion immediately and she sort of reinforced it.

I just don't know how he'll do 50/50... I hope he realises it'll mean 50% of organising activities, school admin, clubs, holidays, doctors, dentist...

I'm not finding the solicitors very helpful so far, all have said I need to start divorce proceedings and decide what I want... but how am I meant to know? I don't know what's reasonable to start with. Both said we'd need to disclose finances, and I need to start that step next.

Anyone got any idea what I should go for?! He wants 50/50 and claims he can do it with a new work contract, he's been the primary earner and my income is really up and down... for many years I didn't earn much at all and can demonstrate this.

What is his new work contract and when does it start?

@Ialwaysthoughtitwasadojo ,

Firstly, solicitors do a divorce in three tracks. The first is the divorce itself, the second is child arrangements and the third is finance.

i hope that you can negotiate child arrangements without court. I would go for a reasonable compromise based on what the current situation is- not 50/50 but allowing him to have ample time to have a solid relationship with the children.

As for finances, your lawyer should advise you. But, fundamentally, you should both have enough money to continue your current lifestyle as much as possible. Both of you, however, will be expected to generate as much income as you can. Decide what settlement would put you both in an equal position after your earning capacities and go for a bit better than that (to give you some negotiating room).

Only if you have excess assets after your needs are fully met (rare except for a few high net worth couples) will pre marital, post marital and other non blended assets be considered.

Regardless, the financial discovery process takes a while, so you might as well get started.
You are very early in the process! It is not too late to change solicitors if they are not filling you with confidence.

It's not better for the children for you and them to leave the house. You can stick to your position that you should have more than 50/50 and stay in the house.

Edit: Unless the discussions with your therapist revealed something about why he should stay?

Why would 50/50 be an issue? his work? If thats all it is thats not for you to worry about.

IF he is asking for 50/50 i think thats the way it will end up unless of something that would definitely stop it. If you don't agree to it and he keeps asking you may need to go to court and spend a shed load of money to do it.

I agree that it sounds odd that the therapist is saying that it's better for the children if your ex stays in the house. How will it be better? And what about after the 6 months when he leaves? Is that still better? What's the difference between now and 6 months down the line?

He doesn't actually have it yet! So no idea what his work will look like, I just don't think he realises how much I do, and his job is very full on. His life will just be looking after the kids and his very full on work. I'm not going to let him get away with not doing the admin associated!

He said because we've just announced the separation, but I do want to ask him so at what point is it ok? We can't live together forever.

If he can GENUINELY do 50/50 I don't mind that, but it's just so very different to the last 9 years where I am the default parent, he has missed countless parents evenings, sports days, I'm the one that stays off sick with them. I don't think he knows where their dentist is.

I don’t agree with the therapist. My DC were younger (lower primary school years) but my ex actually moved out before we told them. Yours are used to him being away (as were mine) with work so it won’t be a shock that he’s not there.