Married to someone with Asperger’s/ASD/ND: support thread 17

[SpecialMangeTout3]

New thread.
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This thread is for those of us seeking to explore the dynamics of long term relationships with our ND partners. Some of us are ND ourselves, very many of us have ND children. It is a support thread, and a safe space, it does get emotional at times. Avoid sweeping generalisations if possible, try and keep it specific to you and your partner.
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It's complicated and it's emotional.
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The old thread is here.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5355546-married-to-someone-with-aspergersasdnd-support-thread-16?page=10&reply=148665446

My ex was certainly an asshole. Was it is autism that made him like that? To a degree yes, I do believe it was. The rigid thinking. The insistence that he was right. The low frustration tolerance. The emotional dysregulation. The strong sense of shame which I now realise governed his every behaviour. The lack of social awareness. His innate need to think of his own needs (and really have very little sense of others’ emotional needs). His self focus. His dismissal of others’ points of view.

But he could have learnt to be a better person. He could have learnt to be curious about my experience. He could have learnt to give people the benefit of the doubt. He could have learnt not to jump to (incorrect) assumptions about people’s behaviour and motivations by taking time out, listening, asking questions instead of reacting. He could have learnt that firing off an apology after the fact is not reparation.

But he didn’t. And instead he went and found someone else. And I’m sure she is very much enjoying the new relationship phase where he gets to be in his element, whisking her off to places, paying her compliments, laughing, carrying her bags, arranging things just the way she likes, being very physical…. She has no idea what is to come. And he has learnt nothing from our time together and despite his awful treatment of me, he is now the one telling me he chose her over me because “she makes him feel safe!” Hmmm what he means is she doesn’t challenge or question his behaviour. She doesn’t make him face uncomfortable truths. I did. And instead of learning, he got angry or he withdrew. Eventually he withdrew and had an affair.

And yet I miss him! Ugh!!!

Anyway , sorry that wasn’t what you asked. Yes of course autistic people can be assholes. And who cares why they’re an asshole. They’re still an asshole.

@Theydontwantme the way I look at it, to take your example of mobility issues, someone who is disabled, eg in a wheelchair, can be an awful person or someone genuinely wonderful. Having a disability doesn’t make someine either nice or awful. That’s including ND.

Now take 2 people with a similar level of mobility issues. They both walk very slowly. One just cross the road like this, the other uses a rollator to get around.
I can tell you, by experience, the first person is likely to get huffing and puffing, lots of grumbles (someone even used their horn) because clearly that person is inconsiderate, should go faster rather than taking their time. A lot of people would say theyre a twat.
Yet the second person with the rollator will not get that. Because most people recognise that, when people are disabled, they are. They can’t help it. And they can’t go quicker. Yet they could be an inconsiderate twat that has decided to take all their time, holding the traffic as a result.
Same should happen with ND imo. Once you know the person is ND, the first reaction should be ‘ND reaction’ and then wondering if actually theyre not just awful.

Then, staying with mobility issues, you can have 2 people with MS. One is struggling to walk more than room to room. The other is going up and down stairs and can walk quite a while. Would you say the lerson who doesn’t go further than room to room is taking their time piss abd should just kearn to walk for longer oerson? Or would you say that not everyone with MS is affected the same way? I’m pretty you’d say the second tbh.
And same with ND. Saying ‘they should just learn’ is just as impossible for some people than asking someone with MS to walk more. It’s part of their disability. It’s not going to change. Even if SOME people can learn or aren’t affected that way.bits NOT an excuse. Never has been. It can be a very good reason.

And both, having a go at someone becayse of their disability (you’re too slow) or assuming that disabled people should just ‘get over their disability’ (and learn how to do xyz) is very close to being ableist.

Now the big difficulty with ND and the lack of care etc…. is that, from the outside, whether it’s disability or being an awful person is very hard to separate. Sometimes, it migut be some of both. A lot of it is down to intend.
Thats why I feel the most important is about you, your needs and you can or can’t cope with said behaviour. Not the intend.
But the first step imo should be ‘Here is the REASON for their behaviour. It’s the ND’. Then assess and check it’s not being an arsehole.

I am only talking about the ND in relation to relationships. Obviously ND folks like myself exist very well outside of relationships, work etc. Within the confines of a relationship my ND mum is of no use whatsoever. Outside of this she is a fantastic worker, great, even amazing at many other things. None of those things I need from her. I want relationship things from her and she can’t any of that. Inside intimate relationships she is an asshole, arrogant, controlling and no empathy. She is a fantastic manager but a shit mum. Relationships aren’t her thing, unfortunately I had no say in that. I think it’s ok to say that someone’s thinking makes them shit for relationships.

I would absolutely pay my mum to manage and arrange things. But in a relationship there needs to be other things.

This got me thinking about gender roles and ASD. Whether women with ASD are more likely than men learn to adapt to do the 'right thing' by others emotionally given the roles we tend to get bought up with. That would certainly track with a lot of what's said about the experiences of women on the spectrum, re: masking, learning behaviours by observing when they don't come naturally. And sometimes burning out doing it.

Women are most definitely expected to be a certain way and men get away with a lot of that behaviour in my opinion. I feel that’s why my mum in my opinion feels really off to me. She does not mask and isn’t maternal or warm and loving, it’s more noticeable.
Wheras last week my brother got off in my opinion ruining his daughter’s birthday. She wanted to go somewhere where he said the the potato’s weren’t consistent enough so he refused to go. He’s the man so he is in charge.

I have read that a lot of ND people hate to be perceived. I get it, I have been labeled sensitive and dramatic, even though this comes from a place of dysregulation. I can understand from the outside this just look different and in terms of my relationship I have to do a lot of work to make sure I don't hurt people with my emotions.

If someone focuses on their special interest and neglects the relationship or they get mad and dysregulated or they make no effort or offer no empathy are they not right to be perceived a certain way? It says that true selfishness is conscious choice. But is it still selfish to behave this way despite it being due to differences. I mean I understand that acting this way has no intentions, a lot of the time they are unaware of the consequences on the other person. How can you get around this? I am struggling to understand how a person doesn’t know how their behaviour affects others. Saying you love someone but focusing all your time on something else obviously doesn’t align. That person will miss your company.

You know what I need. Some tips on how to process this feeling I have that I’m a bitch that I don’t like my mum or brother despite the fact that it’s a disability. If they were people in the street I’d just never meet them, it would mean nothing, we’d not be friends. I am trying desperately to understand and accept and take on board the disability.

My partner yes has ASD, but he is likable. He has a special interest and he talks my ear off but he shares his interest. He goes to groups and it’s opened his life and ours, it’s a sociable interest with great people. He invites people into his world and he does show up to everyone else. I think it’s the fact it’s a disability and they don’t intend it and they never asked for it that makes me feel a right bitch. But they still self centred and one way.

If there's one thing I learned in life, it's that if a feeling of affection/love towards someone that you'd expect to be there is actually missing, it's because they did not inspire it.

If you can like/love other people in your life (and be liked/loved) then it's extremely unlikely to be -you- that's the problem.

If someone elicits feelings in you, it's usually for good reason. If they don't, that's also for a good reason (usually).

We tend to give back what we're given, emotionally.

That makes sense. I think I’ve fallen into a trap of wanting those feelings and trying to figure out a way of getting them, because it’s painful to not love your own mum, and not really right. But I do love others and I’m loved by others. It’s usually those who mirror how I feel and see me that I feel safe with. Not being mirrored and being dismissed is very upsetting for me. I think you are right that you can’t make something exist that doesn’t and there is a reason why it doesn’t (although it’s sad and sad it’s due to a ND).