Husband is unrecognisable

[phlebasconsidered]

My DH and I have always been different politically. We've managed it- it's fine to have different views. I'm left, he's Tory.

Or, he was. We have two nearly grown kids, 17 and 18. He's recently been spending more time in the back room watching stuff that i've pointed out is insane. You tube, Brit news or whatever that bilge is, I don't know where it came from. He's justifying his views by citing sexual assaults on white girls. He's basically transmogrified into a fucking idiot and I can't believe it.

We used to differ on economics, sure, but now suddenly he's a 53 year old fascist? I can't talk to him. His arguments turn me around. He's been radicalised- I recognise it from experiences in my profession. He says he's going to the march on Saturday. I've told him i'll go on the opposing one.

There's no way forward as far as I can see. As far as I knew he was still a loving family man but now I just see a big arsehole. He just circles around the phrases when I tried to talk to him.

I would just stand my ground and argue back- he's been a good husband and father till now, hitting mid 50s. But i'm in a job where if he goes and protests on Saturday and gets arrested, I will be compromised, asI work with children.

I need to distance myself. I'd really like to know i'm not alone I was hoping it was a bit of a mid life crisis, but I think he's just become a toral cock.

Wtaf am I meant to do. I'd rather he ran off with a younger woman tbh. I feel ashamed of him!

It isn’t illegal to seek asylum.

I sympathise with you on this. My uncle has gone down the YouTube pipe line these last few years. Generally there’s two camps in the family - one who will not be around him or entertain him in anyway and the other who put up with him and just roll their eyes. I’m more in the latter, but primarily because I don’t think it’s fair to isolate my aunt and cousins from family gatherings because he’s being weird. Also I see the person he used to be in him sometimes. He is still funny and can be kind, he still shows my kids magic tricks like he used to show me when I was little, it’s kind of a shame, but I understand why a lot of my family feel uncomfortable around him.

I would totally understand if you left him your DH to be honest, I think if my DH went like that I would probably leave. We are both in agreement on most things, and if anything he’s more left wing than me. Being around someone who insists they’re 100% right about complex issues and isn’t willing to hear anything else is draining and I can’t imagine living with someone like that.

OP was talking about university.

Although there is absolutely misinformation and purposeful whipping up of fear and anger online that needs to be addressed, I totally agree with you that, mostly but not solely the left have done everyone a disservice by slapping labels on any opposing view.

“Alt-right” or “far-right” being a good one that seems to be applied indiscriminately, “bigot”/“transphobic” for gender critical, “racist” for worrying about immigration, “anti-Semitic” for supporting Palestine.

It happened a lot during covid, people concerned that lockdowns were not a balanced strategy had nowhere to turn to in “mainstream news” but could find their views being discussed online, and then got trapped in the YouTube algorithm from there and caught up in more extreme conspiracy theory stuff.

If all sides of arguments for a lot of topics were rationally considered in mainstream news and we stopped labelling people with commonly held beliefs with really terrible labels to shut them up, or cancelling them/getting them de-platformed, getting them fired etc then people wouldn’t feel the need to turn to the Tommy Robinson’s of this world and wouldn’t be radicalised - they would feel they had a fair hearing and move on.

I am left/centrist myself but see this as a big problem too.

Can someone (with clearly far more superior intelligence than I) explain what the critical thinking is the right so lack?

The amount of times you hear this phrase used in any political discussion on here is hilarious. It’s like you think it’s a “got ya” but I’m afraid it really doesn’t work.

Please give me an example of critical thinking?

👏

Mine says the same but it's so obvious it will. There is an opposing march at the same time and the TR one is clearly going to descend into chaos one way or another and the police are going to be on high alert so I think it will all escalate. I also have a professional job and cannot be associated with this kind of idiocy - I am also embarressed.

Sounds awful. That’s beyond hard, I couldn’t cope with someone falling for that nonsense to divide and rule us either. Solidarity

Yes, anyone who has gone down the Tommy Robinson road is cruel or stupid or both.

I said 'broadly'.

What, in your view, is to be gained by going to university?

@phlebasconsidered my sympathies. I would find that difficult to live with. Unfortunately as you say, many men (and some women) have become radicalised after watching many hours of rage baiting You Tube videos late at night.

I don’t mind traditionally conservative people and it’s always good to have a debate but not when they join angry flag waving mobs. The madness of crowds and all of that.

Unfortunately it seems to mean ‘doesn’t agree with me or my one line mantras’ a lot of the time.

The thing that gets me is you can provide data from the government themselves, you can talk about your ‘lived experience’ but it doesn’t matter if those talking points do not match the status quo.

Never forget when we were told by the media that women had penises. I don’t know what critical thinking went into that…

It’s just considering information - deciding for example if it’s credible, considering its source, it just means thinking …so for these latest protests ..it’s challenging things that are plainly false like people are illegals (no such thing), receiving tons of benefits, living it up in hotels …it’s looking to see who benefits from your believing the lies

This is an absolute load of nonsense, and makes you sound incredibly pompous, sorry.
I am degree educated to masters level and work as a chartered professional, I am very critical of immigration and would probably be considered a “fascist” by folks like you….

you have to stop treating people who have opposing views to you as uneducated, lacking critical thinking and logic. This high and mighty attitude is doing the left no favours.

I controversially don’t believe anyone but the ‘top of the class’ should go to university and these should be for courses/careers that require university such as medicine (but arguably nursing could be brought back to degree apprenticeships).

Surely politics is at the centre of someone’s outlook on life? How can you not discuss your political views? Very strange.

Critical thinking is lacking across the political spectrum!

Critical thinking involves - (1) verifying the information you are basing your opinion on is factual (2) assessing the source of the information and what the motivations of the source might be - who benefits, who loses here? Why are they choosing to tell me this? Is anything missing? (3) being honest about your own biases (4) considering a topic from multiple sides, is it actually more complex than black and white and what are the different angles we could look at this from?

For me the left lose ability to critically think when they conduct purity tests - someone said something a bit off 15 years ago and now they need to be fired. Only perfect people can be good. Or hyperbolic labels, eg “transphobe” or “racist”.

For me the failing of the right to critically think is in failing to check if information is accurate and also failing to think about the motivations of sources of information - not asking, is this person actually just making a LOT of money off whipping up anger about this? Are there more sides to this story?

And for being willing to deny whole bodies of scientific research in favour of answers that feel good. This is not limited to the right, see how trans activists reacted to research on impact of puberty blockers on children, but is definitely more of a right wing problem from my observation.

Many are claiming asylum by pretending to be a homosexual and saying their life would be in jeopardy if they return. It was an Arab Muslim man that told me this is happening often with men from his country before you try and say I found this out off a propaganda news channel.

Name changed for this. I’m in a very similar boat, including the education levels and politics. My DH isn’t at the marching stage, but I have to deflect all convos on immigration, the flags, Israel and more, so that I don’t have to hear stuff that will lead to me ending my marriage. I’m also peri and can’t quite work out if he’s got worse, I’ve got less tolerant, or both. I don’t have any answers, but wanted to sympathise. I used to enjoy our political debates, but there’s no substance to them now, just abhorrent views from him.

It's pretty simple.

If you believe migrants rather than billionaires are responsible for the relative impoverishment of ordinary people in the UK, you haven't been paying attention.

Um that’s quite a snobby view that because he didn’t go to uni and doesn’t have a professional jobs he can’t critically think.
You don’t agree with his views. They may indeed be unacceptable. But part of the reason the UK is in this situation is the superiority complex of many of the 'educated' ppl in the Uk - in politics and in professions. Compared to what this group consider the ignorant

This is such a bullshit argument. Some people simply are stupid, and they're generally on the populist right, because that's where the easy solutions are. It's not snobby or elitist to recognise this.

Think about all those thick, violent, nasty kids you knew at school and vaguely stay aware of through social media. Always banging on about how brilliant Jeremy Corbyn is, or how the Green party would solve everything, are they? Of course not, it's literally all Tommy Robinson and Nigel Farsge, isn't it? Because they are thick, violent and nasty.

Stop blaming the people who recognise and describe this. The "calling people nasty names makes them vote the other way, you must be nice to them!" approach has always been nonsense, and was proved so during the Brexit debate when the same boring arguments were run. "Listen to them and their different views, they're the real, salt of the earth, voice of Britain!" Those of us with any sense knew and said what would happen, and now that it's made us hundreds of billions worse off, reduced our international influence, tripled immigration and caused the small boats problem it's obvious that the identity politics of working class Vs liberal metropolitan elite is just horseshit. We were just correct, that's all.

But part of the reason the UK is in this situation is the superiority complex of many of the 'educated' ppl in the Uk
Absolute horseshit. If the educated people were actually in charge and were listened to then the country wouldn't be as far up shit creek as it is. And it will be the same with the current situation - we'll listen to the idiotic mob, things will get worse, and the idiotic mob will have another reason it's someone else's fault not theirs, and another magical solution. (See also: Brexit turned out shit? Let's leave the ECHR!)

I'm just cleverer than people who thought (still think! Lord help us!) that Brexit was a good idea, and cleverer than radicalised idiots like OP's DH - it's simply the demonstrable truth, and I'm not going to apologise for saying it.

I thought people like you believed Arab Muslim men to be dishonest?

Unfortunately, the man you used to know isn't coming back. This only heads one direction. You can expect to hear a wide variety of conspiracy theories.

To be devils advocate here.

Do you not believe there are corporations and individuals becoming millionaires FROM the illegal immigration crisis? If you look at the money going to hotel owners and companies like Serco, it’s eye watering.

In terms of legal migration, do you not believe wage suppression is helping the rich stay richer?

They are supposed to present themselves at the first ‘safe’ country, not pass through several safe countries to get to the UK or Ireland.