Husband affair?

[GreenBiscuit25]

im looking for a bit of clarity as I’m in shock right now.

i (f35) have been married for nearly 10 years to husband (41) we have a good marriage, we have lots of family time with our only child (son, 6)

husband usually works in the kitchen and left his laptop open, I jumped on to check a recipe whilst I made dinner and a message popped up on his work channel from a woman he’s mentioned before but rarely spoken about- I clicked on the message which opened up all their message history (probably not ok for me to do this but still)

anyway it turns out they message aLOT! Like just about every day over work channel- and especially the last few weeks- the tone is sometimes playful and flirty and sometimes just about everyday life/weekend- but rarely work stuff! A few things that stand out-

1. the tone is definitely flirty at times- her mentioning going topless in the park and him saying “tell me more”
2. from what I could gather they have set up secret hangouts (dates?!!) going for coffee and a walk- this all took place during work time but clearly took a lot of planning of diaries- both talking about being excited for it- keeping it secret from others (she even suggested they set up a fake meeting!)
3. they have planned another hangout in a couple of weeks to give them both “something to look forward to”
4. when he take about his weekends he never mentions me and she only asks him about him and or son! But I know they have worked together a while so she must know he’s married!

I honestly felt sick- he’s out with his mates tonight so doesn’t know I’ve seen it. I’ve spoken with my mum who has told me to confront him when he gets back- what do I do!

It's wooing.

And you only do that when you want something more, like it leading to a date.

He's still pretending he's baffled. But he'd know exactly where the line to be crossing was if it was you and a younger male colleague. He thinks you are an idiot.

He needs a sharp shock from you. Maybe in the form of divorce papers. Because right now he's smug in the knowledge that because he hasn't actually had sex, he's home free.

I'd be gutted OP. I know this because I WAS gutted when something similar went on in my marriage.

Like you the problem wasn't that they hadn't had sex... Because it was clearly moving that way.

I know it's a busy thread so you'll have lost track but I threw him out into the spare room (there were no out of the house options for us) while I figured it out.

However there was one thing I wanted to draw your attention to. I always laboured that point that this had all turned ME off HIM. I now saw him as someone disloyal, unattractive, needy. I was being truthful. I found OW pathetic, attention seeking and desperate and the fact that he had been the man willing to give her that attention disgusted me.

If I was you I'd ask him what would he think of you if he realised you'd (even in your single life) been hanging off a married man like she is? Force him to think about it, describe the exact scenario with you as the woman. He'd feel pity for you. And yet this is the person he risked his marriage and family for.

Then do the same, this time with you married but behaving like him in the scenario. Go deep with this one.

Even if you don't take him back you're entitled to make your feelings known.

I know people have said you won't ever trust him and that may be true but I wanted to offer another pov that I have no trust issues now with my husband. He never minimises it though and is fully transparent now about whatever I want.

I do think he is sadly treating you like a fool. Pretending he doesn’t know what the fuss is where it’s clear he’s shown another woman attention that should only be reserved for you.
He is not trying hard enough to win you back which means one foot is likely out the door anyway.
I am not a believer in counselling for the cheater. A simple reason why they do what that do is because they can. After how he’s made his feeling clear for the other woman , no amount of counselling makes you fall back in love with your partner. For me it’s a box ticking exercise. It’s very sad and shocking to take in. You would do well to speak to a solictor today.i know you would never imagine yourself in a position like this a week ago but you are here :(

Until he fully understands your perspective on this, you can’t possibly decide what to do.

For him to understand your perspective, which is that of complete betrayal, you may eventually have to spell it out, because he’s still at the saving his own skin stage. But I wouldn’t do that yet, I wouldn’t give him any more verbal prompts at all at this stage.
I would simply wait it out until he decides he actually has something useful to say about his betrayal.
Let him come to his own light bulb moment and then fall on his sword.
If he can do this, all on his own, then you might have a chance at working things through.

This isn’t an excuse, but men really are wired so very differently to women when it comes to their emotional reasoning skills, (if they’ve got any at all) so it will be difficult for him to be accountable with his limited emotional literacy compared to yours, which are very mature and articulate.

I might ask him to take time out to go back and read, all in one go, all of the messages between them as you were forced to do, That’s the only prompt I would give him.

He also needs to address his lack of effort at work and explain how he managed to square that up with his own moral values for all the time this has been going on.

You do appear to have this horrid discovery all in hand, as shocking and devastating as it is. I do admire you for your calm and steady approach.
I really hope he can get over this futile denial stage in order for you both to have a chance to talk about it properly and honestly.
Wishing you all the best OP.

I think you should demand to look at his phone, every message. You’ll definitely find upsetting messages on there! However it may be the evidence you need if it proves he hasn’t been intimate with her. It’s very easy for all of us to shout lose the bastard etc, real life isn’t so easy. Especially financially. If they’ve not been intimate do you think you could move past this? I’m not saying you should or shouldn’t. Most men get very flattered by a younger woman paying attention to them, he’s got carried away. Maybe this will nip it in the bud? It’s human nature, all of us love attention from the opposite sex, but he’s taken it too far. You need all the full facts before you decide what to do

I would tell him you need time to think so are blocking him for a week. Any information about your child can be communicated with his mum. Tell him to take the time to read the messages from the beginning and imagine how you felt reading it.

It gives him an opportunity to empathise with you and also gives him a chance to change his perspective. If at the end of the week he still has no insight as to why his behaviour is so hurtful and unacceptable then there isn’t much more you can do.

Stay strong, show yourself the respect he hasn’t.

Why don’t you put it to him like this:

how would you feel DH if you discovered I’d been messaging another man, telling him he looked handsome, that I couldn’t wait to talk to him the next day, planning little picnics and lunch dates with him whilst you were getting the me that sits on the sofa grunting at whatever you say, no little in jokes, pet names, thoughtful gestures like your favourite coffee bought when I’m out etc? Would that be ok? Would you genuinely be happy for that to continue and not be cross or upset about it in any way or think i’d betrayed you just because I hadn’t kissed them or let them put their penis inside me?

I do know what you’re getting at and with a normal person then of course she’d get the response she wanted but I agree with a PP. he simply wouldn’t care. It would be advantageous to him, at this stage in his feelings for the OW, because it would give him the green light.

I suspect he already feels he’s been given the green light by Op as, she’s effectively said she’s not sure she wants the relationship - he seems unbothered and is probably busy seeing if he can move the affair on to the next stage. If OW isn’t keen he’ll probably come crawling back cap in hand, but if she says game on, which it sounds like she would, he’ll probably then head off with her claiming Op had already kicked out when he’d ‘not down anything wrong’. So it’ll be Ops fault.

You missed out the bit where she says “ tell me more” when he outlines his plans to unclothe his penis.

Perhaps clearly ask him how he would feel if the roles where reversed. How would it make HIM feel if it was you doing the secret chats, the meet ups, with a younger and very interested 'other' man.

Fucker. Remember to look after yourself here, too, OP.x

When I first saw this thread I thought the dalliance was possibly tame. A few flirty comments about his nice tie shirt combo and a gauche response to her desperate bare boobs comment.

But as the op has updated, I think the ship has sailed.

The most telling aspect is the fact he doesn’t seem too rattled that op has booted him out. Far from being apologetic, he’s even lobbing grenades.

With his attitude as it currently is, it's dead in the water but @GreenBiscuit25 be prepared for him to come crawling back once he has shagged her a few times and got her out of his system.

I've been there and I refused to have him back which stunned him. He had no choice but to move in with her and it went to hell in a hand cart after another four months. I was well out of it all by then.

For me, at a bare minimum he would have to change his job. If he wasn't prepared to make that effort then I would know I just wasn't worth it to him and that would be the end.

Regarding nothing physical happening, he's wrong. He has been physically messaging her, walking with her, talking with her. He has physically planned dates and physically invested his time and attention on her. He is going to have to make huge changes to his attitude and actions if you are to get over this I think.

Congrats OP for having dignity and not accepting this disrespect.
What a stupid man. He did all this for what? For a stupid low level tart. Let him be with her. This will be his punishment. A massive downgrade from the life he had. A high value woman, a beautiful son and a safe lovely home exchanged for a low level woman with 0 values and quality.
Welldone OP for being so strong. Your son is very lucky having such a role model in his life.

I think calling the OW that is unfair. She is a single woman with children. No doubt she’s liking the attention and thinking she’s building something with this man.

He doesn’t talk about his wife so even if she knows he’s married it’s very unlikely that he’s told the OW he’s in a happy relationship and wants a bit on the side.

Either he never mentions his wife and she’s naively created a narrative in her head that makes his behaviour acceptable or he has told her untruths. I’m not saying she hasn't got questionable morals (assuming he does know he’s married) but she’s not the villain here.

If it's all so innocent he wouldn't mind you sharing his messages with his parents ...

There can be more than one villain. There are two in this scenario and she’s one of them.

OP doesn’t need to emphasise with this woman. What she is going through is awful. But making the OW equally culpable only benefits her husband.

All I am saying is, we don’t know the full story, and the word used (now removed) to describe the OW was unnecessary and likely very unfair. From what OP has said there are no messages that show she is fully aware he is in a committed marriage and he hasn’t been behaving as such. We don’t know what she has been told. However we do know he knows the truth.

I reiterate, dating someone when you know they are married, even if they tell you their marriage is terrible, they are basically separated etc, does show questionable morals and naivety but doesn’t show she’s the word used by the pp.

Op i feel like you're doing the pick me dance.
He began cheating . You caught him early. He would've jad sex with her. If he respected you at all he wouldn't have started it.
Ive been where you are altgoigh my ex was physical and I caught them red handed. Filed for divorce the day after. The pain is unbearable and seeing my children cry breaks me daily. But I know that I and my children deserve someone who loves us, respects us and wouldn't mess around.

By giving him space you're saying it's ok what you did..now you choose who you want..nope sorry.. you tell him he's weak and his behaviour is not acceptable. He should beg for forgiveness.

Sorry if this is harsh, I've read so much about infidelity over the last few months and can see clearly.
Id hate for you to take him back..then in a years time find out it was more or he starts again and you're back here telling us having wasted more of your life.

Always open to a pm. In the meantime join chump nation on fb and reddit aswell as the infidelity help group. You will read lots of stories which started off like yours.. then 10 years later they're still at it.

Of course she knows he's married.

It's easy...if someone is married or in a relationship you stay away. Why women want a man who would cheat on his wife is beyond me anyway unless they're so stupid they think they're somehow special or different

I hope you are ok OP.

There are women that do not want a relationship and just want sex. A married man is ideal for that. It’s completely wrong I know but it happens. Men do this all the time.

This woman might not want a relationship with him or care that he is married.

Like, She can’t actually think that saying the comments that she said would make her look anything but desperate.

@GreenBiscuit25, your guiding star should be about your feelings, boundaries, and peace of mind. Is he a safe partner for you? Please do not passively wait around while he picks between you and OW. Take that decision out of his hands.

He has an agenda to keep his double life and maintain control of the narrative. He is not going to admit making unethical choices and being emotionally unfaithful. He is not going to acknowledge having a romantic and energized dynamic with OW that involves over-frequent contact and meticulously planned dates. His mantra ‘It’s not physical so it’s not cheating’ is a manipulative tactic to justify pursuing thrills and validation with her while keeping his convenient home life with you. It’s straight from the Script. I would be taking myself out of his equation.

I do wonder how he explains that drooling at the thought of OW’s breasts is platonic.

It speaks volumes that he is not moving mountains to be accountable for his wrongdoing, to prove his cherishment of you, or to take steps to change jobs and eject OW from his life. His failure to act on those elements of remorse is a further degradation of your marriage.

Stay with him if you want to live with perpetual anxiety and mistrust in a
3-person relationship.