Is it ok for a man to hit a woman if she slaps him first?

[Comparethemarket]

Just looking for opinions on this as I don't want to reveal anything to RL friends.

I was reflecting on my relationship with my ex, which was abusive in many ways (and certainly toxic, if not abusive).

Sometimes I'd say something, or ask something eg wanting reassurance (yes, I know that's needy, but there were circumstances in which I felt very insecure for good reason).

When I'd ask something about "us" there were times he'd lose his temper, shouting and screaming at me. I'd try to calm him down and plead with him to stop. On a couple of occasions he then pulled up something that just made me snap and I slapped him across the face (one of these times was saying something derogatory about my then teen children, another time he was shouting and screaming, threatening to leave and I just saw red).

I know I shouldn't have slapped him across the face, but immediately that I did on both occasions he hit me back, much harder. The first time he split my lip in retaliation and the second time I was bruised for a week afterwards.

I said it was my fault because I slapped him first, so he was therefore the victim of physical abuse.

I know everything about this relationship was so very wrong and I'm not asking for opinions on that. I'm out of it now and it will stay that way.

I know I was wrong to slap him first. I saw red and it was a way of trying to defend myself whilst he was screaming at me and telling me he didn't care.

Is he right though? Was I the one being abusive by hitting him, or saying something which made him angry in the first place?

Please no judgements. I'm just struggling to process what has happened.

I just don't understand what I did to provoke the tirades. Sometimes I struggle to even remember what started it.

This is very outing, but a couple of years ago I found out he'd been booking "massages" (with extra services of you know what I mean). I ignored this when I first found out. Gaslighting myself to believing it was all innocent. Then he got a nasty rash on his genitals. I asked him about where it had come from and did I need to get checked. He got angry. Very angry. His usual response of, "we're done" after several hours of shouting etc. Several days later I told him I knew about the services he'd been having and he admitted it. He was remorseful, said he'd change, went to therapy etc. We carried on seeing each other as friends. A few months later, we started sleeping together again. It wasn't until someone else started showing an interest in me that he begged for us to get back together properly.

We did. It took just a few weeks before the anger started again, mainly because I was struggling to get past what had gone before. He just wanted it swept under the carpet and never to be mentioned again. Every time I tried to talk to him about it, it started another tirade.

I know I shouldn't have agreed to try again when I was struggling to get past what had gone before, but that is hindsight.

I know that for the moment, I don't have the emotional capacity to get involved again and that's fine with me. I don't want to.

I'm just struggling to process everything that's happened.

When he was being nice, he was so charming. Nothing was too much effort. He did everything for me, then it was like a switch when the other side came out.

Apparently I was being ungrateful, was never happy with anything, he mocked me and my family. I didn't walk away because the good side of him was so lovely and the awful side was clearly my fault.

Sorry, I'm rambling. I don't have anyone I can talk to about it in real life. Everyone who knows him adores him. Even if I did tell anyone, nobody would believe me. He's a big deal within our local community and I already know he's set up his 'public' story of what's happened.

He was abusive when shouting/screaming and insulting you and your kids.

You was abusive when you slapped him.

He was abusive when he hit you back.

he sounds awful and the relationship was toxic. Are you wondering if you were at fault or if he was? Really you both were and neither behaviours are excusable but he sounds worse. I’d wonder if when in a relationship, if the person you were with didn’t scream at you and insult your kids whether you would still behave the way you did. Probably not.

My children have seen nothing of this relationship. One of them has met him once in the years we've been together. They don't even know about the relationship as we only spend time together when the children (both older) are not here.

I just don't understand what I did to provoke the tirades.

It's like being in a relationship with an alcoholic and wondering what you did to make them drink.

You were in a relationship with someone abusive and he abused you. He will continue to abuse women, it doesn't matter who he's in a relationship with.

You could have been Mother Theresa and he'd have abused you.

You were both abusive. You were toxic together.

You were just as bad as him seeing red and not being able to control yourself. And yes IMO you hit someone they’ve every right to hit you back irrespective of different sex

It can take a great deal for an abuser to get to the bottom of why they are like that. Could be an event, could be relationships modeled to him or the way he was raised. You won't get to the bottom of it. It wasn't you fault. Focus on recognising red flags in people rather than the why.

Sweetheart, you did nothing. Trust me. You did nothing to provoke him. His anger wasn't justified. You didn't cause the rages. The rage was all in him, in his head, and he coped with it by exploding at you. He looked for things to get pissed about.

Things I remember my father blowing his top over:

how my mother breathed
that he didn't like my t-shirt
that we weren't grateful enough when he cooked, which he did once in a blue moon, and which was always inedible
that someone had the wrong look on their face
because i gave him socks for his birthday
that someone else was in the bathroom when he wanted to use it
for not wanting to give him my birthday money
because we were 'embarrassing'
for liking the 'wrong' book
for liking the 'wrong' film
for not liking the 'right' music

He lost his temper with you because he wanted to.
Because he enjoyed it and liked the way it made him feel
Because he liked the way he felt afterwards, when you grovelled and apologised and took responsibility for it so he didn't have to

Please ring women's aid and talk to someone about it. They will be able to explain this far better than I can and support you with understanding things going forward.

The whole thing sounds really toxic. This isn’t a good relationship. You need to end this.

Thank you

I have. I'm just struggling to process what happened.

OP said she is reflecting on the situation as she doesn't want to get to a place where it could happen again. When you have been in an abusive relationship you doubt yourself and everything you did or didn't do.

I did not read that as she is at risk of slapping the next person she is with. It sounds like she was pushed to her limit by a gaslighting abuser, who said the most vile things to her. As long as she does't get back into another abusive relationship I am guessing she will be just fine.

I have seen abusers provoking their victims and breaking them. It's a manipulative tactic too. Abusers pushing someone to their limit until their victims snap so they can then make out that the victim is the one in the wrong and then they can blame them for their violent outburst in response. Which is why OP ended up injured.

You'd really benefit from some specialised therapy. If you contact your local domestic abuse organisation, they may be able to signpost you to therapy.

Domestic abuse is misunderstood as you can see from this thread and a specialised counsellor will help you process what happened.

I'd also recommend the Freedom Programme to help you learn about healthy relationships.

Wow.

So she slapped him due to being verbally abused for however long (obviously not ideal). He hit her to the point where she had bruises and a split lip, and therefore his reaction was excusable? He had every right to do that? What is wrong with you?

OP is not as bad as him. You do not say this shit to someone who has been abused. It's cruel and dangerous.

Take male and female out of it. Is it wrong for a person to punch someone who just slapped them first? Yes it is.

i wouldn’t say you were abusive yourself as he clearly abused and pushed you to snapping, perhaps that was his intention we cannot know, but regardless the slapping was wrong as you have acknowledged.

move on. Accept you were wrong but not equally wrong. He was the cause. Learn and do better. In future if you feel the need to slap a partner then end the relationship as it’s not healthy

He shouldn't have hit you back, you shouldn't have slapped him. He sounds awful and it is good you are out of this relationship.

Served you right seeing as you hit him first. What did you expect? Sheesh.

Wow.

Being bruised and cut served her right?

You are disgusting.

No

Oh love. I think you're doing tremendously well to be acknowledging your wrong actions and reflect on what you did wrong. You can't control his behaviour but you can control yours.
Maybe some anger management counselling would help to address the causes of you lashing out.
Self reflection is great but don't forget to forgive yourself too for what was a toxic situation. You handled it badly and you can do better next time. Xx

They were both abusive.

Christ people really need to understand the power and strength imbalance between men and women. This isn't the movies where high kicking heroines can inflict damage on men or hold their own in fights.

He was a nasty sod OP.

My DS is 13 and has ADHD and can be aggressive.
He needs to learn that you do not retaliate to anyone: if his sister breaks his toy, even if on purpose, if a lad at school hits him, never.
Doubly so for adults.

If anyone throws a slap or a punch they deserve one back

And this is why men don’t tend to talk about female abusive partners.
No-one should be hitting.