Married to someone with Asperger's/ASD/ND: support thread 15

[BustyLaRoux]

New thread.
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This thread is for those of us seeking to explore the dynamics of long term relationships with our ND partners. Some of us are ND ourselves, very many of us have ND children. It is a support thread, and a safe space, it does get emotional at times. Avoid sweeping generalisations if possible, try and keep it specific to you and your partner.
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It's complicated and it's emotional.
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The old thread is here.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5245372-married-to-someone-with-aspergersasdnd-support-thread-14?page=39&reply=143014416

I have pulled back but feel incredibly guilty. I realised when I was really sick recently that he hadn't even noticed, didn't message or call to see how I was (was hospitalised). Since then I've stuck to messaging updates every few weeks rather than inviting him down. For a long time I just couldn't manage it, then I reflected on that and realised I see him as a rather annoying son I have to do a lot for, usually for sulking in return. His house is really bad and I spent a lot of time trying to clear things physically - fallen branches, taking broken things to the tip, clearing surfaces and wall mould. He honestly didn't seem to see any of it and acted as if I was interfering and having black mould in the kitchen is completely normal! I have finally accepted he will never say he is proud of me and nothing I ever do will be enough. He's sadly one of those men who had women looking after them all their lives but still thinks they are superior somehow, despite the way he lives (no friends, no job). It is incredibly hard work.

My husband has just said kindly, after observing me making coffee in my long granny nightie “you’ve got an amazing body for a woman your age”. When I collapsed in laughter (on a different day I might not have laughed) he protested “but you’re nearly seventy!”
This group is a lifesaver for me … thank you everyone 🪷
He literally cannot understand why that statement was not a compliment.

@HmmLikeAVillager you do right to distance yourself, and any shame or guilt should be his, not yours.
I did also wonder whether any of this behaviour is new and could be related to the onset of dementia? You could consider contacting his local social services older adults team to inform them of the situation - although I guess he wouldn’t necessarily be happy for you to do that.
You have to put your own health and that of your family first, and well done for doing your best for this man - who from your account whatever his disabilities is also a very selfish and demanding individual.

Sadly not new. He lived with his parents after my mum divorced him, so they did all of his cooking and cleaning. When they died I took over but sporadically as I was only in my 20's and didn't live close. He's got very ingrained habits, or maybe its a lack of any habits...hard to tell. If he is unhappy he looms. Literally will stand over you seething. Slams car doors so hard they shake so you know he is angry/upset/annoyed. His communication has always been almost non-verbal. I do wonder if living with his parents caused some form of arrested development. Academically very bright though and certainly remembers slights my (now dead) mother caused him, no no memory issues. He probably won't even notice me not messaging him updates but he will be angry I haven't invited him to do his washing for a while and likely is blaming me for him smelling because he hasn't used my bath for so long. I can't be bothered with the anger any more.

Backhanded compliments are certainly a skill @Flamingfeline . Maybe you can think up something similar to say to him later?

“Invited him to do his washing” says it all doesn’t it …
You didn’t choose him to be your dad.

About twenty years ago I said to my husband “I always think I’ll find a dress that will make me look really beautiful “. His reply was “If you find something like that, darling, you buy it”. He still doesn’t understand what was wrong with that comment. I used to think it was just men, but I understand a great deal more now. He was replyyybg in a straightforward, in his eyes helpful, way to my comment without connecting to any emotion that might be associated with it.
Btw I don’t go round fishing for compliments!

I think they are stuck in teenager hood. So they either those stroppy teenagers or those ones who hide in their rooms. Usually we all grow out of this once hormones level out and our brains develop on. I definitely don’t slam my bedroom door or say “I hate you” to anyone or avoid the washing up etc. I behaved like this as a teenager though. It’s so hard to view a grown up adult as a teenager but I think they just are. They are our parents and partners and we project onto them the roles which they are “meant” to take. Inside they just teenage children, quite selfish and self centred. My mum had the biology to have me physically but not mentally or emotionally. I look at her as person should look at a mum but she isn’t, she 14 years old still.

I get a msg updating me on her latest project with a video. Basically a come look at me and what I’ve done. No, I’m not interested as you’ve not visited my house in so long I can’t remember, not come to see what we’ve been up to. It doesn’t work like this. You can’t just pick us up and put us down when it suits. What about a msg when we were sick. She has no clue how to relationship. My brother will go over all the time. Perhaps I’m getting petty but it’s never returned.

Peppasparty

I would think her emotional development stopped at around the age of six and dealign with her is akin to dealing with a six year old. Again this is not untypical behaviour from people who are narcissistic in terms of personality. Nothing whatsoever to do with ASD.

Does she favour your brother?.

I don’t think so it’s just he will go and listen to her. It doesn’t seem to bother him that it’s not returned, it’s just the way she is. She isn’t annoyed I don’t go either, doesn’t seem to have feelings either way.

That’s quite a statement to say it has nothing to do with ASD.

ASD is complex. In my opinion, it’s also always mixed with trauma, especially with the generation we’re talking about (The younger generation has had much support and protection).
I think separating ASD from narcissism or any other MH stuff like BPD is hard. In big part because it’s all down to intentions and you only guess that (in all cases!) from their reactions in other circumstances.

And I’m not sure why it is even important to say ‘it’s not ASD’ tbh. Unless you think that ASD gives a a Get Out of Jail card for most/all misbehaviours. Or you’re supposed to feel guilty for feeling hurt.

The reality is that a behaviour can be fully down to ASD and STILL extremely hurtful.
The reason doesn’t really matter as long as you dint make it an excuse.

ASD is a triad of social impairments. It is not a mental health condition nor it is a personality disorder.

If you read the posts that Peppaparty has written about her mother where does this suggest ASD at all re her mother?. It does not; from her descriptions of her mother it very much suggests an untreated and untreatable personality disorder. It's her personality that has made her act this way towards her and it is not her fault in any way shape or form.

But she isn’t nasty, she doesn’t really seek attention or talk about others like I’ve read about narcs. She doesn’t loose her temper or create arguments. She simply is not able to do a too and fro relationship. It’s like you don’t exist if you not right in front of you. She won’t think about me or us from day to day, like how we are or what we doing or be involved or think I’ll visit them today and have a tea. I wouldn’t say she was horrible at all just solo really. People getting involved annoys her, she wants to be in charge and people don’t tend to like that so she does it all herself.

Could she have hyper-independence? www.newportinstitute.com/resources/mental-health/hyper-independence-trauma/

Agree with this whole heartedly!

I don’t know it I am just becoming bitter and selfish myself but I’ve started to look at people by what they bring to my life because of my mum. If I stopped there would be absolute zero from her, perhaps the odd bit of communication about her. It sounds so cold but what’s the point in the relationship at all. Nothing is added to my life, no joy, no support, nothing. Relationships are supposed to bring something positive aren’t they? It’s not like she is a burden or needy, it’s that she isn’t needy at all. She can’t recognise other people might have a need sometimes. She’s over self sufficient with no emotional needs at all. I’m not 😂

Here you all are! Thought it was quiet. I’m waiting on pink kettle updates! 🩷

I think my DH could have undiagnosed something. Our emotional connection is non existent and over the years we’ve talked and talked about making it better. But things just drift. We really should split but I’m terrified. He’s a good guy but it’s always me bringing it to the table whilst he just bumbles along.
I’ve had counselling. We’ve had couples counselling. But still arrive at the same end.
not had sex in years and now it just feels awkward and weird to even try. I’m so sad about how it’s all turned out. I felt ignored in first marriage and now same in my second. Beginning to wonder if it’s just me.

I don’t think anything is wrong with us but I do think that in some way we have been trained to accept this type of relationship. I know for me in my life having a mum who is completely unemotional led me into relationships with the same type of man. Then I got into a mess because I couldn’t connect and it all was just wrong and I blamed myself. The truth is in my example I should have walked early on or never even got drawn to these men in the first place. It wasn’t their fault but I was seeking familiarity. Wrong for me but familiar. The men weren’t wrong or faulty but they were meant for someone else.

@Peppasparty yip. Can totally relate. My Mum was similar. I wasn’t planned, a late baby but nothing emotional from my Mum. Felt like she just wanted me up, away, married and off her hands. Never really felt invested in. Thus I married guys I shouldn’t have and I’m still seeking that emotional connection that has been absent all my life. I’m 56 and just feel totally bereft at times

I don’t think, and I’ve learned this very lately that we are seeking something that we are never going to get. Unconditional love, the love of a parent has passed, we can’t expect this from partners. I’ve been a terrible people pleaser because of my mum. I’ve tried to please the love out of people and it’s got me in trouble. I’ve tried to get that emotional connection from people and I’ve only got myself hurt. We have to let this go and grieve the emotional safety and validation we have never received and stop looking for others to fill this hole. It’s so so sad because it’s all I’ve ever wanted also but I’m beginning to understand that time has passed for this a long time ago. I’ve been quite needy in the past also and I’ve required too much from my partners also. I just got myself in terrible relationships but I have a good man now and I try my best to meet my own emotional needs. It’s hard. 😢

i keep thinking im ok then every so often i go to bits grieving for such a connection. My DH is brilliant in so many ways but he’s so monotone, no desire, what little sex we ever had was clumsy and unfulfilling. I’m on the brink of considering a no strings affair just to have some sort of connection

Aha! The kettle is in its new house. With its matching pink toaster friend! Not used either of them yet as I am still in my old house. Last night here actually. DB arrives with lorry early tomorrow and we load and leave! I’m signed off work with stress and anxiety this week and next. Work is very stressful and I don’t have the capacity to deal with that and stressful personal life at the same time. Manager very lovely. Almost shoved me out the door and into the GP’s office. I have packed the contents of a big house on my own and I’m exhausted. I’ve got my keys and have done multiple trips to the new house. I love it! It’s like a cottage. Took DD to see it again yesterday. Met her at school and walked to our new home so she knows the way ready for Monday morning. The walk is 11 minutes! As she’s the youngest she’s always had the smallest bedroom but this time she gets the bigger room. My DS is very matter of fact, says he doesn’t care what room he has. She chosen her new rug (pink - it’s going to be quite girly this house!). I’ve been doing multiple trips back and forth in the car this week. The kitchen is all unpacked. The fridge is stocked. Now I just need to actually move in. I’m very excited. Terrified. Sad, a little. DP has been mostly great. Says he doesn’t want me to leave but thinks I need protecting from him and just wants me to be happy. He also understands me and him/his son dynamic are not a good mix. I think he’s feeling the reality of me going today. He looks very sad.

I wouldn’t advocate an affair. It’s not fair on all parties really. You will kick yourself for doing it and add more shame to what you may already carry.

Very well done @BustyLaRoux. I might be close behind you. I think the pink kettle will become a thing on this thread 🩷

I know! Which is probably why I haven’t. But truthfully, I don’t know that I’d ever get the contentment and connection I seek even if I do the decent thing and split. I never thought I’d be in this situation. My life looks so golden but I want to scream in frustration. DH offers no solutions. I suggested an open marriage but that’s a no goer.