Married to someone with Asperger's/ASD/ND: support thread 15

[BustyLaRoux]

New thread.
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This thread is for those of us seeking to explore the dynamics of long term relationships with our ND partners. Some of us are ND ourselves, very many of us have ND children. It is a support thread, and a safe space, it does get emotional at times. Avoid sweeping generalisations if possible, try and keep it specific to you and your partner.
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It's complicated and it's emotional.
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The old thread is here.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5245372-married-to-someone-with-aspergersasdnd-support-thread-14?page=39&reply=143014416

Just wanted to share as I dint really have anyone else to share it with.

I went to see a new GP last week for some daily headaches. They referred me for an urgent MRI, 2 weeks pathway. So yes you think cancer etc… At the very least serious.
Got my appointment letter at the weekend and asked dh if he could take me. Huge hesitation, looking uncomfortable. Turns out he is out that day with his hobby/special interest. And was relieved to find appointment is right at the end of the day so he could still go….
He hasn’t asked any questions about it, if I’m ok, if I’m coping. Nothing.
Last was this morning, coming his laptop that was overheating, jokingly asking if it would help with my headaches.

Im so used to him not caring, not supporting me that I didn’t even realised how poor form it is straight away. I did think (loudly on my head) TWAT with the last one….

Autism can only go so far to explain the total abandonment really.

🫂

@SpecialMangeTout2 🫂 so sorry, hope there is a non serious cause for the headaches.

@TooLate82 I'm sorry for your diagnosis. I hope you have support beyond your DP. Sending love.

@SpecialMangeTout2 thank you for your kind welcome. This is how my DH would react too. Oh, the swearing behind his back is off the charts! I hope you get a quick answer to your headaches and it ends up being best case scenario.

@SpecialMangeTout2 I can totally relate, unfortunately.
I live in dh's country so wasn't really familiar with different towns/cities at the time.
Asked dh to come with me as i had to get a biopsy from my neck.
Even thought he had actually lived in that particular city, he 'really didn't want to drive the 2 hours there and back'.
I drove myself.

Also not an isolated occasion 😞

They can be incredibly selfish. I’m yet to understand if it’s pure I’m just not bothered or I’m trying not to acknowledge it because I can’t deal with it or I don’t actually care about you that much or you are going to want sympathy from me and I can’t do this and I’ll feel totally overwhelmed so I’ve developed into this totally avoidant person. It is selfish though because we are all overwhelmed with health scares like this. I suppose that’s the whole issue with being avoidant, no one actively chooses to be it but it develops to save themselves.

Hi to everyone new, like most of us, you probably didn't think you'd be happy to have found this thread. It has, and still is a vital life line for me. Just knowing I'm not alone, which i did for such a long time helps me through a lot.
Everyone is so supportive here. Beautiful wonderful people 💐

@Peppasparty i think with dh it’s a whole mix of I can’t deal with this. Im getting too overwhelmed and I actually dint know what to do which blends into total avoidance.

But as repeated many times on here, it doesn’t explain the total abandonment.
There is still a part of dh that just cannot be bothered.
And yes @Ohdostopwafflinggeremy ive taken myself to hospital many times too. Incl when I was on sedation for a colonoscopy….

I'm a parent. I won't get too involved as this space isn't entirely relevant to my situation and I understand it needs to be a space for partners.

I believe, and I have no evidence, but believe strongly that being an Autistic male dramatically increases the risk of having an ASPD. The 2 therefore co exist often and it isn't a case of misdiagnosis.

For me, as a mum, I felt for a long time,' this is autism ' which is present and eventually diagnosed, correctly I am sure. ( Significant genetic family history).
But over time, I now sadly feel, is there more here and is this actually also a problem of ASPD on top.

I now understand why even with the best intentions, an ASPD state may occur where there is autism or other ND conditions in certain groups.

I'm absolutely not saying all ND people. I have family who are ASPD from my lifelong experience of them, and they are certainly NT.

How you figure out what is what is incredibly difficult. We just don't have a good enough approach to assessing and flagging ASPD. I believe therapists will often miss it and may be out their depth dependant on the severity and capacity to manipulate in certain ASPD people.

The horrible reality imo is that with an ASPD, the capacity to improve or for sustainable change, to me, feels futile and actually impossible.

Hi I occasionally comment on here and often lurk.

Just been reading up again, prompted by another thread, about theory of mind, theory of mind and autism and double blindness. And it's in and out and in again popularity with autism research.

My dh is very unpredictable in his traits. Sometimes is really on the ball and seems to very naturally have insights and then other times none at all.

He's also, throughout our time together, over 35 years, had massive inability to share info. Like quite trivial stuff usually. He's going out tonight and didn't tell me and I just found out by chance. This is frequent sometimes no notice at all. I think he just doesn't feel the need to tell me.

I saw the post upthread mentioning "taking turns". Dh bad at this. I frequently ask (couple of times a year) how he sees things like his career etc, life etc. Never really get anything back. Never asks my ambitions etc. I used to think it was just because I'm super talkative and nosy but it's not just that.

Yet often he can remember very thoughtful things and we mostly get on very well 🤷🏻‍♀️

He's just accepting he probably has autism and now confronting he has ADHD. He comes from a background of "this is made up stuff, pull yourself together, don't be nosy!" Where to me, looking back, I think he's whole family he grew up with are/were autistic.

@CinnamonTart excuse me for not knowing the background. My husband did attend couple therapy on a couple of occasions with two different therapists probably nine or ten sessions in all, but he always sabotaged it with anger outbursts or if a female therapist he would seduce them into being on his side (also narcissist personality disorder). Therapists are also human and he’s always had this effect on people so I didn’t blame them 😂. So I did t bother asking him to come any more although I have had lots of individual therapy over the years.
Did you do anything or say anything particular to persuade him, or was he quite willing? Many thanks x

Oh and also, since he's accepted he's autistic, I sometimes think he's pulled away because he's dealing with it, it absolves him. It's certainly not made him more understanding.

What's the definition of madness? Hoping again and again things will get through to him?

What's the definition of madness? Hoping again and again things will get through to him?

Yep.
But hard to accept isn’t it?

@SpecialMangeTout2 i started suffering from daily headaches a few years ago. I had lots of things rules out. Obviously I was petrified while all this was being done. In the end I was diagnosed with chronic tension type headaches. Which is a catch all for when other things have been ruled out. I started medication (prescribed painkillers which work differently to the OTC stuff).

I know I can’t diagnose you, but just wanted to let you know daily headaches are not necessarily a sign of something sinister. The tension headaches are annoying to live with, but not life threatening. Given the stress you’re under chronic tension could well be the cause.

Hi everyone, I don’t always read these threads because I am long separated from my Ex.Unfortunately, due to our shared child I still have to deal with his nonsense so I read here to remind myself I am not crazy.
Someone a couple weeks ago posted a link about PDA. It fits my ex very well as does the impact it left on me. For years I really struggled with the question why can’t I ask anything of him even though we have a shared child and it’s normal day to day things I am asking.

A few weeks ago DC made a mistake that inconvenienced his father. It’s an understandable mistake when you know how autism impacts DC. Most of us are parenting autistic kids and you do have to be mindful of their struggles not just their strengths. Ex of course can only consider his own feelings and has no understanding of how DC can make a mistake. Fast forward a couple weeks later DC gets a load of missed calls and then texts demanding an apology. DC decides to apologise to appease him. Of course that isn’t enough. DC father wants to know exact reasons for doing it. DC try’s to explain it was a mistake this isn’t good enough. According to DC father It was deliberate. In end DC retracted apology. Next time DC hears from father it’s a text asking if DC will call around. Like nothing happened. DC gets very frustrated with father and looks to me for explanations. What can I say. I really don’t understand DC father’s behaviour. DC being autistic I am very mindful of not blaming autism. Quite often it’s DC is the adult in the relationship with father.

@BustyLaRoux Wow such big changes ahead for you. I wish you nothing but best wishes…..and pink kettles.

Your situation is very different to mine. Myself and ex split long before we managed to find separate accommodation.
One thing I found was I did not realise how much stress I was under until I had my own space. I could finally breathe again. I was a much better, calmer mother to DC once I left because I wasn’t constantly full of cortisol and in fight/fawn/flight mode. That was my normal. Now I find I can’t really handle dealing with ex anymore because I can instantly feel the stress kicking in.

I am so grateful to have a peaceful, loving home. I wish that for everyone here too.

A recent example of Ex behaviour. ( we are not in UK so in our case maintenance is court ordered not CMS). Ex refuses to pay it because it’s unfair on him (and obviously money would go on me and not DC.) He absolutely believes he is right and that the judge was wrong to order him to pay maintenance. I went back and requested that court summon him for arrears. He tried to ignore the whole thing even emailed judge to say he couldn’t make it one day. Judge threatened jail to get him to turn up and then threatened jail again to get him to pay arrears. He told judge how unfair it is on him. He is back now accumulating arrears again.
The guy almost ended up in jail because he ignores things he doesn’t like and also has an unwavering belief in how right he is at all times and out of principle wouldn’t pay maintenance.

I know that ex would have been freaking out and stressed about the case being back in court because I have been a witness to how worked up he gets over everything big or small. I have no compassion for him anymore, which isn’t like me. I always wish the best for people.

@Flamingfeline After things deteriorated horribly for a very very long time, I asked him if we could talk about ‘us’. This of course caused the most incredible row. He then said he wanted a mediator to help him discuss the issues he was having with me.

So I went on the hunt for a male who had experience of ASD etc.

@Crunchingleaf I know exactly what you mean about being full of cortisol and in flight / fawn mode. That’s totally me. I can’t believe that about the childcare maintenance business. Unbelieveable.

Yes I am. I haven’t told anyone apart from my therapist.

I am very fortunate at least that I don’t have to deal with his cruelty and neglect while I’m so vulnerable. I’m positive he would have put on a show for others but behind closed doors he would have continued to be cruel and neglectful. My marriage therapist would have excused him with long drawn out explanations and excuses about PDA which I now know is nothing more than calculated emotionally abusive withholding. How could it be anything else when he can choose where, when and who to be PDA with.

I feel a lot of anger lately towards that marriage therapist. I am probably displacing a lot of my anger about the situation onto her. I spent a lot of time and emotional energy to be told
“ Your husband has a neurological condition that means he’s going to treat you, and only you like shit. He is able to understand everyone else but not you. He has no control over it but he does so he will turn it on and off but don’t worry because you’re privileged that he feels safe enough to do that with you. He also has PDA that he can’t help but can help because again he will only do it to you because of his disability”.

I don’t know how she could say that with a straight face. It is the description of an calculated abuser.

@TooLate82 Right now you get to be angry at anyone you need to be angry with. That marriage therapist sanctioned the abusive behaviour. You have paid the ultimate cost.

I am sorry this has happened you.

@TooLate82 I am so so sorry you’ve been and are going though all this. I wish I could wave a magic wand for you.

“... excuses about PDA which I now know is nothing more than calculated emotionally abusive withholding. How could it be anything else when he can choose where, when and who to be PDA with.”

Wow - reading this has actually really helped me - to see it down in black and white - plus what your therapist said. Thank you - you have set a lightbulb off in my head. x

Re therapy of all sorts - I’ve learnt to be very careful. Not all therapists understand every aspect of their trade and indeed how could they - the human psyche seems almost infinitely complex.
For example, I’ve come across therapists who don’t understand neurodiversity at all, who will agree to try to treat a narcissist in individual therapy which is almost bound to fail and actually by validating their sense of entitlement can make them worse. Who aren’t alert to the signs of control and domestic abuse.
The first therapist I had - many years ago - I still credit her with saving my life when I was in a very dark place. However, she supported me to try to understand my husband and persevere in the relationship, when signs of abuse should have been clear. Gentle questioning could have helped me perceive my situation and make better choices while I was still young.

I feel a lot of the time people think that they can come about an issue from a different direction and they will be rewarded with change. I’ve heard this from others that my mum is empathetic but I just have been trying to get it from her in the wrong ways. It’s rubbish, it’s not there no matter which way I try and provoke it. I wonder if therapists sometimes give people the benefit of the doubt and they think that if we change the way we do something they will effect change in our partners. I’ve heard it many times that asd people do have empathy but I’ve yet to witness this in my mum. She isn’t a sociapath but she has zero thoughts about others feelings. I’ve seen her in situations nodding along trying to be sad and show empathy but she has the wrong look on her face.