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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

December 2024 - but we took you to Stately Homes

999 replies

AttilaTheMeerkat · 19/12/2024 11:07

New thread

OP posts:
VWSC3 · 06/02/2025 07:40

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 07:18

You think people get their comeuppance but they don't. My narc family are very wealthy and I'm very not, I'm struggling. They seem to have amazing financial luck and karma never bites them in the arse. That annoys me 😂

Same with the ones DH and I are related to. They have very (seemingly) perfect lives.
They’ve even used it as part of the smear campaign against us - we are jealous of them apparently! 😂. Another thing that a lot of Narcs seem to have in common - the assumption that everyone is jealous of them.

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 07:45

I know 🤣 because they're jealous they assume everyone is jealous. They really imagine that everyone else is just a bit player in their life. They don't understand that other people have their own lives SEPERATE to them. That the world keeps turning with or without them.

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 07:45

VWSC3 · 06/02/2025 07:40

Same with the ones DH and I are related to. They have very (seemingly) perfect lives.
They’ve even used it as part of the smear campaign against us - we are jealous of them apparently! 😂. Another thing that a lot of Narcs seem to have in common - the assumption that everyone is jealous of them.

Are these lives perfect or is it just that they hide the not perfect parts? From the outside my family looks so perfect. I can’t see how it’s possible for nothing to ever be perfect all the time?

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 07:49

happyfarm We aren’t their loved one unfortunately.

I disagree, I think we're super fortunate NOT to be a favourite. Look how awful the GCs tend to be.

We're just suffering whereas they're insufferable 😂

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 08:09

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 07:49

happyfarm We aren’t their loved one unfortunately.

I disagree, I think we're super fortunate NOT to be a favourite. Look how awful the GCs tend to be.

We're just suffering whereas they're insufferable 😂

Yes we fair better. Being able to be vulnerable is how we connect with people. My GC has no friends because he is always in competition and people can sense this. I’d rather be SG than GC as I have some lovely friends. I can talk to them about things that are going wrong and visa versa and we help each other up.

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 08:32

I think narcs tell themselves people are jealous because they need them to be jealous.

It doesn't matter if the jealousy is real or not - the narc tells themselves it's there (and also tells other people) because that's one of their coping mechanisms. It comes from their root problem, which is cripplingly low self esteem.
Other people are jealous of me = I am better than them = I can cope with life.

Fwiw things can catch up with them eventually. All it takes is for something they're ashamed of to be exposed in a way they can't deny or blame on someone else and they're done. It happened to my father after the divorce. Without the family there so he could use his abuse of us to prop up his self esteem, he couldn't cope with life outside the house. And when your wife has gone and your kids won't talk to you, other people know that something has gone very wrong. There's no explanation you can give that doesn't have some cracks in it.

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 08:49

@CheekySnake so basically in a narcs life are there 2 types of people? Those who reflect the perfection and those who are perceived as lessor whom they feel superior to. Both are fuel?

I remember a conversation a while back where the FIL said to me about mine and other sons houses “am I jealous of the other sons house”. Why would I be jealous, I was confused but I get it now. I am supposed to be jealous as the lessor.

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 08:53

I think they don't understand lack of jealousy. Mum always said i was smug and sly, I don't know why really. Oh and fake too of course.

I'm like a lot of people that I'd love a lottery win, but why not? Who wouldn't?

But I don't want other people's kids, husbands, houses, cars, jobs. My own aren't perfect AT ALL but they're mine and I love them.

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 08:56

I guess that was the smugness, being satisfied. And sly? Well, obviously. Why would I say anything real to a bunch of nutters. Fake? Yes, with them 🤷🏼‍♂️

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 08:56

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 08:53

I think they don't understand lack of jealousy. Mum always said i was smug and sly, I don't know why really. Oh and fake too of course.

I'm like a lot of people that I'd love a lottery win, but why not? Who wouldn't?

But I don't want other people's kids, husbands, houses, cars, jobs. My own aren't perfect AT ALL but they're mine and I love them.

Thats a lovely thing to have isn’t it, contentment with what you have. It must feel awful having to only have things that you think others are jealous of. Nothing ever means anything unless you think other people are jealous of it.

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 08:59

@Happyfarm the ones who reflect what the narc wants to see are still seen as lesser, though. Or at least, as not separate from.

In the narcs head, son's house = their house therefore they have a better house than you.

But the narc may not actually treat the son that well when no-one is looking. Behind closed doors, they can be very different. And the son can be trapped in a loop they aren't aware of, where fawning makes the narc less dangerous and so they fawn, and when they get praised for fawning, there's a short period of relief. The only way to be in a relationship with a narcissist is to constantly work for their approval. It can be very hard to take a step back and see what is really happening.

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 08:59

Yes happyfarm I love that about myself, I'm very easily pleased. It's sunny here today and I'm going for a walk with my youngest and the dog and then for a pub lunch.

And for me that's tip top, a lottery win.

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 09:00

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 08:59

Yes happyfarm I love that about myself, I'm very easily pleased. It's sunny here today and I'm going for a walk with my youngest and the dog and then for a pub lunch.

And for me that's tip top, a lottery win.

Me and little one currently having a kitchen disco! Enjoy your day!!!

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 09:01

I look back now and understand that publicly my father boasted about how clever I was, while at home, he constantly told me I was fat, unattractive and stupid. So I worked even harder to do well at school and be thin, and then outside the house, he boasted about how clever I was. Crazy making.

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 09:08

@CheekySnake its part of the reason for removing myself from the family chats. The brother was in constant competition. He seemed to need to out text, out do and out buy anything that was said. It was unhealthy for me to live in this. I’m happy in my own little lane. I love my little family and the way it feels. You do if not careful get drawn into these things.

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 09:32

How much ego does a person have to believe that others should want to be like them! I guess that’s how the gc situation works, they want/need to like them and they are them by extension so you should want to be like the extensions also. I want to be me thank you!

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 10:13

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 09:32

How much ego does a person have to believe that others should want to be like them! I guess that’s how the gc situation works, they want/need to like them and they are them by extension so you should want to be like the extensions also. I want to be me thank you!

Again, though, this is about pathologically poor self esteem, not enormous ego. The ego is a shield to protect the self-esteem.

People want to be like me = this is proof that I am amazing and can therefore cope with the world.

A narc needs people to want to be like them and will therefore (unconsciously) manipulate/bully them into it. Golden children aren't better than the other children in the family, they're just forced into playing a different role, and are manipulated in a different way, but it's still manipulation.

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 10:16

Narc's don't bully because deep down they really think they're amazing, they do it because deep down they are utterly terrified that they're not, and everything is about protecting themselves from having to face it.

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 10:18

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 10:16

Narc's don't bully because deep down they really think they're amazing, they do it because deep down they are utterly terrified that they're not, and everything is about protecting themselves from having to face it.

Yes I know, it’s very sad. I can’t afford to feel too sorry because I start to get empathy then get drawn in. We all want to feel liked deep down but we all know that not everyone will like us. It must be hard having to be liked for fear of life or death.

Dogaredabomb · 06/02/2025 10:29

They deserve to be miserable because they're so nasty

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 10:36

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 10:18

Yes I know, it’s very sad. I can’t afford to feel too sorry because I start to get empathy then get drawn in. We all want to feel liked deep down but we all know that not everyone will like us. It must be hard having to be liked for fear of life or death.

I feel sympathy in that I think what a miserable life these people lead. How utterly grim their existences are, how limited, how joyless, how much they miss out on. But at the same time, there were many, many things that my father did that were unspeakably cruel, I believe beyond a shadow of a doubt that he knew what he was doing and the decision to behave that way was conscious and calculated. In those moments, he knew what the result of his actions would be in terms of the distress it would cause for others. The distress it would cause for me. There were occasions when he deliberately put me in a state of terrible, hysterical distress specifically to hurt my mother. I don't look at those situations and think poor him, it was the only way he could cope, I look back now and think what a cruel and wicked man. What a horrible, nasty, abusive person. He actively chose to cross that line, and he did it over and over. No-one made him do it. He chose. Being consciously aware of our actions/urges and able to decide not to act on them is what makes humans different from other animals. He chose cruelty.

There are other ways to cope with low self esteem. He chose to deal with it the way that he did. I've got very poor self-esteem and don't cope with it by hurting other people.

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 10:40

You can feel sorry for someone and still choose to keep your distance/ignore/not engage/not step up and make yourself available for them to abuse so they can feel better.

Did I feel sorry for him? In some ways, yes. What a horrible life. What a wasted opportunity.

Did that mean I was obliged to let him set me on fire to keep himself warm? Absolutely not. That's codependency. It was his responsibility to sort his misery out.

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 10:41

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 10:36

I feel sympathy in that I think what a miserable life these people lead. How utterly grim their existences are, how limited, how joyless, how much they miss out on. But at the same time, there were many, many things that my father did that were unspeakably cruel, I believe beyond a shadow of a doubt that he knew what he was doing and the decision to behave that way was conscious and calculated. In those moments, he knew what the result of his actions would be in terms of the distress it would cause for others. The distress it would cause for me. There were occasions when he deliberately put me in a state of terrible, hysterical distress specifically to hurt my mother. I don't look at those situations and think poor him, it was the only way he could cope, I look back now and think what a cruel and wicked man. What a horrible, nasty, abusive person. He actively chose to cross that line, and he did it over and over. No-one made him do it. He chose. Being consciously aware of our actions/urges and able to decide not to act on them is what makes humans different from other animals. He chose cruelty.

There are other ways to cope with low self esteem. He chose to deal with it the way that he did. I've got very poor self-esteem and don't cope with it by hurting other people.

I suppose it’s ok because they have underdeveloped empathy and they can just about justify anything, especially if in some weird way they have devalued the person. The only way surely someone could carry on with their life is if they actually believe they deserved it. My ex got himself unstuck in court because he never denied any of the abuse…he just justified it and it got him banned from seeing his daughter for years. (Until he evolved to hide his intent and then contact resumed)

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 10:58

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 10:41

I suppose it’s ok because they have underdeveloped empathy and they can just about justify anything, especially if in some weird way they have devalued the person. The only way surely someone could carry on with their life is if they actually believe they deserved it. My ex got himself unstuck in court because he never denied any of the abuse…he just justified it and it got him banned from seeing his daughter for years. (Until he evolved to hide his intent and then contact resumed)

My father was absolutely clear that nothing he did was his fault. Nothing. He got an awful lot of mileage out of 'look what you made me do.' He was also very clear that the expectation was that you agreed that it was your fault or else, no matter what he had done.

Happyfarm · 06/02/2025 11:01

CheekySnake · 06/02/2025 10:58

My father was absolutely clear that nothing he did was his fault. Nothing. He got an awful lot of mileage out of 'look what you made me do.' He was also very clear that the expectation was that you agreed that it was your fault or else, no matter what he had done.

It’s so funny you should say that as my little one has started to say to me “you made me do that, you made me sad, you made me get cross” she then hits and bites as punishment….totally normal toddler behaviour…you can see where their reasoning gets stuck.

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