When do you just know its wrong?

[LostInMyLife]

So I am in a tricky situation with DH. For months he has hardly been near me physically, we have been intimate about every 6 weeks, I have lost weight, my low self esteem thought it was how I looked and I have been trying to initiate us being intimate but it never happens, he does struggle with his mental health or he has the classic "headache" everytime. The low self esteem has completely gone altho the weigh loss has given me a little more confidence in myself and I feel better in myself despite how I feel within the relationship.

Anyway over the weekend I stood near DH and he had a long text message on his phone and he turned it away from me, I think that was the final straw and everything clicked. Now this sounds silly but last night I woke up as he turned over and he actually put his arm by me and moved away, I realised he has tucked his blanket so he was actively not touching me. I shot up and woke up, and I can't speak with him, in my head there must be someone else otherwise why would he check out all day. I have been to work then took dd out, got back and had a long bath I haven't actually spoken to him today, I can't face it but moreover he hasn't spoken with me either. Now if he acted like that out of nowhere I would be checking in to see how he is...clearly he doesn't care anymore. I am heart broken, weve been together nearly 20 years and were nearly 40, weve never been like this. But now looking back I can see it's been like this for months and I am so scared. I don't care if he leaves but I care about dd, and how it will impact her. She is closer to her dad than me, it breaks my heart but I work full time and support the household, he is just around more. I don't know what to do.
Am I being stupid? I just feel lost.

I also don't want to look for evidence because frankly it's not about someone else, although that would be a deal breaker but how I feel now it enough for me. What do I do?

What a woman.
Treat his behaviour like a bingo sport.
Watch out for his bad behaviour, raise your eyes to heaven and keep careful note of it.
He's a nasty twat.
Drive him mad by ignoring him.
That's how you take your power and control back, by letting him know just how absolutely insignificant he is to you.

@Creameded a bingo sport, hilarious! That is exactly what I am going to do.
I am not reacting to him, just ignoring and its getting no reaction either by me blowing up to him or responding or doing what he wants....not my circus not my monkey!
This is definitely my way of taking back the control, I cant control what he does only how I react. Now it's been almost 4 months, I haven't where I haven't said a word but just distanced myself that's my motivation to not respond to him.

Wonderful!

@LostInMyLife

Good on you for telling him not to come in the house without your knowledge/invitation. To tell you the truth I'm in the 'better to ask for forgiveness than permission' camp and if he did it again I'd probably 'lose my key' and change the lock. If he makes a fuss you can say you 'forgot' to tell him. I'd only give him a new key if he asked directly. In the meantime I'd keep the door locked when I'm home, although he's shown he's too much a coward to try to walk in when you're there. He's afraid of 'the new you'.

And a 'high five' for not reacting to him. Not reacting is the best way to get them to stop their bullshit.

You and DD have a wonderful day. You've given yourself the greatest Mother's Day gift of all....freedom. What more could you ask for?

Evening all,

Up and down over here. Mothers day was lovely, no present or card as I didn't buy them myself, but I had the day with dd, my sister and my mum and my nieces it was lovely much better than anything.

Still trying to sort my tenancy agreement out, and also working up to it, it is taking an emotional toll on me but I am trying, need to send an email tonight about it.

Dd is doing ok, her attitude is a bit up and down atm but I think thats normal, again I am trying to be consistent and also maintain my boundaries, she's getting there.

Looking forward to breaking up for the Easter break not got many plans or much spare money so will be local...still waiting on H to stump up some money for dd but I won't ask, my pride is worth more especially since I know 1. He wants me to ask and 2. He will give me a sob story and not give anything anyway.

My life and the version of me from 4 months ago feels like a lifetime, I know I am like a broken record but I am still impressed by how far I have come.

My main focus is trying to sort the tenancy agreement out....gosh I hope it gets sorted and we can stay here but the housing officer didn't seem very supportive despite me talking about Hs behaviour towards me....I hate using the word victim but it annoys me how when your the victim of this or any kind of abusive behaviour that your the one starting afresh, having to deal with the consequences of other people's actions. He walked away and is living an easier life, for now anyway I know mine will be easier one way or another in the long run(or so I hope) but im fed up of the constant grind.

You have - consistently- been doing well, calmly, sensibly.
The tenancy is a stress, I’m sure, because so much is out of your hands, but it will work out.
In terms of him paying - I’d be tempted, rather than asking him for money - to ask him to tell you exactly what income he receives so that you can both calculate the Child Support he needs to pay.
He's probably well aware that if you won’t disclose, there’s a ‘default amount’ and if he doesn’t pay, they can collect on your behalf directly from whoever he gets any income from. So you’re right not to ask - as if it’s a favour - but asking him to declare what he’s obliged to pay - feels sort of different? Makes it transactional rather than emotional.
There’s 2 parts to what you’re going through- 1 is the emotional bit about looking after yourself and your daughter, think you got this nailed. 2 is the transactional bits about housing, money - it’s harder because there’s stuff outside your control, but really they’re short term obstacles that you’ve just got to drive through, because once they’re sorted, the issues should go away and you can spend your energy on the emotional bits that really matter. You’re going to feel a bit drained until you get through them, just try to remember they’re short term obstacles and you’re in this for the long haul. You’ve been so brave, just got to keep going now, there’ll be time to rest and relax later. Hugs

Have you reached out to Women's aid for advice and support?

Tell them about the tenancy agreement problems and ask for help.

Don't hold out about all the different types of abuse you have suffered for years.
Don't hold back.

Read over this thread again and frame your application from what abuse we have said you have suffered.

Make it work for you.
You suffered enough.
Use it.
Don't be proud.
Pride won't help with this.
Spell it out.
Coercive control.
Financial abuse.
Emotional abuse.
Was their any sexual coercion at all?
If so mention it.

Thank you both.
@Bittenonce I know i am consistently staying calm, no idea where i have had the strength sometimes but now it's just natural for me to not react, a wonderful part of the self growth i have achieved from this mess.
It is definitely the lack of control over the transactional issues that is getting to me, because it is waiting on someone else and their opinion or their procedures. After years of thinking I had control and now knowing I didn't its a hard pill to swallow.
As for the support, honestly he won't know there is a default amount or care. He will have his excuses thats why I don't want to ask and put myself in that position, I know its money for dd and what she is entitled to but I also know he won't care about that. Id rather not ask than have to hold onto more animosity on dds behalf because he doesn't care enough to provide for her.

@Creameded I should look at women's aid but with my job I feel quite ashamed to need their help, I know it sounds silly but I work in a safeguarding role and I am concerned about things coming around to my employer despite them knowing everything that's happening, I cant face the extra scrutiny especially as I work and live in the same borough, I would see any workers I deal with regularly at work it's two sides of my world I can't have clash, for me not for any other reason.

Although the support would help I think in the long run it could do my professional reputation some damage and supporting dd how I do I can't afford that.

For now I will use the friends I have with the professional knowledge they do have to help support me where they can.

@Creameded also there was 100% no sexual abuse apart from not wanting to be near me...nice eh? Took my confidence a huge hit but I am getting there. Not that I have thought of anyone else or even been near anyone but I'm working on myself and loving who I am. I am accepting that it's ok for him not to want me one day i will meet someone who does.

In terms of CMS, can you just put a claim in directly so it’s taken out of his wages, so no need for a discussion or for him to fob you off. Or does he work for himself?

https://www.gov.uk/child-maintenance-service/payments

@LostInMyLife my point about the support is - as you sort of alluded to - it’s not about asking. Asking implies a request, assumes there an option to say no. Clearly you don’t want either of those things, but it’s not a request, it’s clarifying exactly what you and your daughter are entitled to. It’s a bullet that’s got to be bitten at some stage but you’ll know when’s the right time for you to do it.
@Creameded is probably right about using WA - maybe just in a limited way to make sure your communications with the LA are ticking the right boxes to get you the outcome you want. I’ve obviously got no experience of them but I’m sure they’ll have experience of helping other women in the same situation- and it is often about a clerical box ticking exercise, so it helps you know what they’ll be looking for.
Above all - keep your head up, keep going: You might not think you can see the light at the end of the tunnel yet, but you’re headed in the right direction.

As @Bittenonce has suggested, could you talk to them out of county for advice and explain briefly your very legitimate concerns about privacy.

Simply double checking that you are doing everything you can to advocate for yourself would give you some peace of mind at least.

You really are doing great.👏👏👏

@LostInMyLife by chance I found your thread a month ago and I was going through something similar and this has really helped me realise i shouldnt settle for someone who has lied for years about about who he really is as a person, and the worst part - he has wasted the best years of my life and im devastated. Please keep up with the updates, because theyre really helping others. I hope you are getting on well x

@Peachperfect I'm glad my posts resonated with you and hopefully helped. Even if it's just feeling like your not alone. It's hard when you see their true colours and especially when you think of the time lost. For me I am really trying to not worry about the time lost, I have dd she had a relatively happy home for the younger part of her childhood, maybe it wasn't real but as long as it was real to her it is worth all the crap I had to deal with. Dd is happier now though, i can see it in her. Family members have also commented on it.

It just takes time, I think what's helping me is knowing me living a happy life is me winning, not against him, I don't care about his feelings or views, but for me. I will try and post more its just been crazy here recently.

Well its been a strange few days over here....H went Instagram official with the new woman over the weekend, im not on there but found out when with a friend, then got lots of messages checking in if I am OK, not the whole world knew our situation as I didn't want anyone gossiping about it to dd or about dd and her current homelife so those that checked in were trusted people.
Then today the shocking thing happened, he sent me some money "incase dd needs anything" nearly fell through the floor. Now it took everything in my power, went against how I am to not say thank you, because it is not something I should be grateful for it is his obligation so I just sent back "ok" 🤣 was priceless. Petty?yes. Powerful? It felt more powerful than anything in the world.
Thanks to his post my extended family are aware, they have been supportive which is nice. I didn't go into all the details but they know the basics.
So this woman I knew about in December when he said there was no one else is 15 years younger than him, not idea what the appeal is. Everyone keeps saying it won't last but I have been truthful and wished them the best as its nothing to do with me. I have no idea if dd knows or not, she's not said anything to me but she may not want to hurt me by saying something not that I would show it anyway. I have deleted all his family from social media, none of them have reached out so I am stepping back too and creating some more privacy in my life, there isn't much of a life or that I post but I still want it to remain mine.

Dd is fine, she hasn't seen her dad since Sunday they have been messaging and she's going to his tomorrow night after her club, we've had some nice days together just visiting family and staying in the house and had some film nights, it's been lovely.

Im trying to leave the negative feelings towards him in the past, it's not always easy but I am trying. I have no positive feelings towards him either, my feelings are nothing, he's dds dad and that's it. I do feel sad about the script he's used waiting 3 months after moving out to announce his "relationship" but that's it, if anything it makes me feel more empowered that I was right. That i did know deep down and I can trust my instincts.

You always knew didn't you? I've read every one of your posts and was very surprised that the other woman wasn't revealed until now. In each of your posts I expected you to say she'd appeared.

He's an out and liar and you have behaved impeccably. I am in admiration of your strength to put boundaries in place that really matter.
Especially at these most difficult of times

@Havingaswimmoose I did always know but I refused to go looking. I did find out who she was in December so I was playing the waiting game, I will talk to him about it one day, but that could be 10 years from now, I'm in no rush and I will tell him something along the lines of "did you think I didn't know it was going on or who she was? Why do you think the only thing I asked of you was to leave?" Clearly his family are aware due to the lack of contact I mean i wouldn't have expected them to tell me but I think partly their behaviour is due to them feeling guilty for knowing. But that is on them, I have my family and thankfully dd has my family, she rarely sees his family now so thats on all of them h included, its up to them to make the effort if they want dd in their lives, I am not forcing anyone to be in mine and dds lives.

Maintaining boundaries has not been the hardest part, for me it is recognising what boundaries are needed in the first place, once I have that down I work out how to implement them, it's not something that comes easy to me but I am working on it.

I wouldn't say i have behaved impeccably but I haven't reacted, I've remained seemingly unbothered when in reality I'm fuming, that's where my friends and family have helped for me to get it out with no judgement they just know I need to say it even once and move on. Dd hasn't seen or heard me say anything, I don't even discuss it when she is in the house, I go to the shop and make a call if needed, covering all bases to ensure dd is feeling safe, secure and somewhere happy and peaceful. This thread has also helped me so many times, everyone who has posted has helped me in many ways.

H is a lying sack of s**t, that's the most accurate description, he is a manipulator and is amazing and becoming a victim that's why all along I know me not reacting is killing him because it's hard to play a victim when you have an affair, tell your wife your leaving, treating her like crap, not providing for your daughter, be cruel and nasty to the woman that has supported you for years and what does she do, nothing just accepts it with an ok. Hard to be the victim there in anyway. Oh i am sure he has another version of it but that's the truth and ultimately dd knows how I haven't reacted, how I have been consistent for her and provided for her and thats the only one I am bothered about. Even if she doesn't know what's going on she definitely can see what's in front of her eyes with me anyway especially as our relationship has improved so much more and we are closer than ever.

As you can tell from the time my sleeping has been out of sync it's the stress atm I am just glad I'm not at work this week. Hopefully it will calm down and I will be back to normal soon.

@LostInMyLife when I saw you’d updated, I must admit I felt nervous (again) about opening it….
And I do feel a bit worried for you still: You said there were no feelings, one way or the other, but it is still messing your head and your sleep. I think maybe the fact that the OW is now in the open, means you’re for the first time able to open up those emotions you’ve been controlling so well for so long. It’s just another step on a long journey, but you’re still heading in the right direction, I think there’s not many women (or men) who’d have been able to hold their shit together so well. Can’t really offer any emotional advice at all, just a virtual hug. In boring practical terms though, his relationship is no longer a secret he’s been trying to hide from you, and he’s offering some money for dd - so the door is well and truly open for an unemotional practical conversation about how much he owes you every week for CMS.

@Bittenonce thank you for worrying. No sleep is messed up because I am constantly worrying about dd. The strongest feeling I feel is relief, relief that I knew what was happening and that I was right. I dealt with the emotions (I hope it was all of them) when I found out her name and details etc. I won't lie i was angry when it happened and blindsided but that's because of the lack of communication with him, again he has no respect for being a parent with me, I'm not sure what dd knows and it's not nice.
I am a worrier at the best of times so all this with dd isn't helping me stop worrying.

I do think an unemotional conversation about child support is on the horizon, not this week but maybe next?
And virtual hugs are always welcome ❤️

You are AMAZING! Just keep putting one foot in front of the other, as you are doing. In the end nothing matters but you and dd. And you are already over the hump.

@LostInMyLife

You may not see it, but you are 'Woman Triumphant'. You say you don't think you've behaved 'impeccably', but I beg to differ! I think you've been, and will continue to be, simply glorious.

Honestly, you are amazing - dignified, brave, tenacious. You have buckets of strength and integrity. Your daughter is very lucky to have such a great role model and you are more than making up for that fuckwit of a half baked Dad. I’m sure there will be more bumps in the road, I’m sure you’re having a good days and bad but step back and look at your overall trajectory and keep focussed on that. I think you’re already seeing what a favour he had done you. 🥳

I would try to have a gentle conversation with your daughter about his new woman. It’s possible she was aware of her when he was cheating. Kids are very observant. I knew about my mums affair before anyone else and it tore me up inside. Guilt about keeping it quiet but also not wanting to blow up your family. Hopefully she had no idea but on the chance she does you may want to probe gently and reassure her it wasn’t her fault and you don’t hold it against her if she knew.

It must be very painful even with the relief of knowing you were right. But I doubt his relationship will last. Most people go for older men to have a stable person to look after them. What she has got is a dud. When she met him he was living in a house with lots of spare time because you were providing for him. The reality will soon hit that she’s with a guy who can’t even support himself let alone the child he has and any she may have/want. Throw untrustworthy and a liar into the mix and he’s not worth anyone’s time. The shine will wear off and I wouldn’t be surprised if he comes crawling back at some point by which point you will be sailing off into the sunlight in peace. ✌️

Definitely go after him for child support. Make sure he takes care of the one he has before he has any more. Even if he doesn’t pay it now it can be back dated for when he has the funds. If you don’t start the process you are doing yourself and your daughter a disservice. He cheated and left his family. The least he can do is be held accountable financially.

Thank you for your very detailed reply.
Your DD is a very fortunate girl to have you protecting her and showing her how to live with dignity.

I missed your lovely reply I thought you'd gone to sleep and hoped you were snoring away !

You really are a star.
Your control and dignity is powerful.

I have had a few cases around me over the years.

One such great woman in a story similar to yours took great pleasure in telling those that remarked shocked at his new woman (including her ex Mil) to her...many sincerely, a few faux shocked...with a very calculated dismissive shake of her head that "she knew about his affair ages ago, well before we split, he was never the sharpest tool in the box" eyes to heaven 🙄 completely dismissive. Not an ounce of upset nor regret, just a whatever vibe.
She found it very satisfying.

Another lovely woman I know had two daughters and his family never really contacted them again, they just never bothered.
When they ran into them they were polite and friendly but just never showed any futher interest. Very sad.

Their father has suited himself over the past 15 years, seeing them irregularly though has made a bit more effort in the last 5 years with very mixed results as the girls have successful happy lives and have little interest in him.

The eldest is marrying a very very successful man 8 years her senior whom she met through her work and they are having a very swish wedding.
No one on her fathers side have been invited and it is her neighbour and best friends dad who will be walking her down the isle.
He has been a wonderful support to her, taught her to drive, collected her late at night and together with his wife have been as close as any family could be.

Her father was very upset at the slight and it remains to be seen if he will attend....
She just doesn't feel it would be right for him to walk her down the isle as the connection is not there.

Keep your powder dry, remember YOU have won.
You got rid of that loser and the proof is there to see, your daughter is the happier for it.

His loss completely.