Wife can’t live with my son

[Zihgty]

My wife and I have been together 6 years, we had our first child 4 years ago, and my son from a previous marriage moved in at the same time we had our baby (ex wife having trouble with him), and things have been ‘ok’ until recently when my son and wife have not been getting on- my son is almost 15 btw - he seems to resent her asking him to do things around the house, and when I was out for the eveing he called her a bitch. I spoke with him and told him if it happens again he can move back in with his mum, and things have been ok since.

However my wife now tells me I have to choose between him and her- if he stays she moves out, she’s not happy living with him.

Im so depressed that I’ve been put in this situation. My son’s mum is already looking after my 2 other kids, (11 and 16). Deep down I just want everyone to get along. I love my wife and want to have a happy life with her, my previous marriage failed and this time I’m sure it’s a good thing. I also don’t want to let my son down.

any advice appreciated.

You should be the one asking your son to do chores around the house. It shouldn't be left for your wife to sort out. Someone needs to get him to behave and to be respectful to your wife. That's down to you and threatening to throw him out is not the way to do it. You should be pointing out all the things his Step Mum does for him. Do you ever take your son out to give your wife a break from him? If not why not? There should be no name calling or counter threats in your home. You need to make more effort.

Hate to break this to your wife (and a bunch of MN'ers, it seems) but anybody who thinks that a teenager swearing when they're asked to do chores is grounds for a 'them or me' ultimatum needs their head checking.

Either there's way more to this than you're letting on (or aware of), or your wife needs to learn how to deal with teenagers.

Either way, it's on you to step up and facilitate that that, given this particular teenager is yours.

It's sounds like the three of you need to sit down and have a serious talk about respect and responsibilities.

Yes I agree and as I said it’s unreasonable to then want to move out etc as a result if it was one time and out of character. But the dad doesn’t have to agree to her ultimatum - he can let her go. And the fact that he immediately reacted with threatening to throw the son out suggests that he has issues with the behaviour too and that it’s not a one off. Could be wrong though.

His own mother couldn’t handle him, but the SM will be making a fuss over nothing, standard MN.

OP- he’s your son to raise, not hers. You should be making sure he behaves and does chores, not her.

My world is the real world. Where it's not ok to call a woman a "bitch" in her own home and still expect her to be ok living with you.

And yes this boy is a child and, as I said in my original post, the solution is for his father to step up and parent not throw him out. But the stepmother shouldn't have to put up with this. The father needs to come down on this behaviour like a ton of bricks so that his son gets the message that life will be very, very unpleasant if it's repeated.

It might be that this child doesn't understand the meaning behind his words and the connotations, in which case his parents had better educate him pretty quickly or the world will do it for them. If he goes out and behaves like this in any further education or professional environment, he will be out on his ear. Because "bitch" isn't acceptable. And I don't care what people might say, that's not something on which reasonable people disagree imo.

I’d love to hear what has triggered this from your wife right now? It’s unlikely to be “he doesn’t do his homework” or “he called me a bitch that one time”.

Is there something you’re not aware of or are minimising? What were her reasons?

How does he interact with your much younger shared child as I wonder if that is key?

Agree

OP ask yourself the question what you would have needed as a 15 year old should that have been your scenario?

Your 15 year old clearly needs some guidance from the adults in his life, yet his own mum was unable, for whatever reasons, to cope with him, sending him clear message he is too much. Rather than perhaps parent him?
Its easy to judge on the internet when one has not got the full picture.

But at 15 you are not only stubborn, but feel you know it all, can do it better, sleep in, ignore piled up rubbish but can also be the best company, and loving.

Your son needs all the adults in his life to care for him., hear him out, and guide him. That is it. He did not ask to be put in the position where his family divorced, he then had to leave what he knows at home because mum was unable to come, and live in another home, a lot to ask from someone who is still a child. It is huge in fact. Regardless of how well they may cope on the outside to everyone else, this is hard for any child. He did not ask for any of this.

OP, you also seem to think this is someone elses problem by saying your current wife is unable to live under the same roof as your son. What message is that leaving for him and your other children? He is not a kitten you can take to a shelter once you have had enough.

Is your son causing issues?
And if so what issues?
Is there substance misuse?
Depression?

Get to know your son and his needs by having a genuine chat, not just 15 minutes, give him the opportunity to have a voice, then from that all adults need to come together and work together.

Would you feel it was fear if you got asked to leave home because you called your DF a bitch? Or does she genuinely feel unsafe due to other incidents?

Or does she simply use this incident as an excuse to keep home for just the 3 of you?

Yes it’s exactly what his own mum did. It’s equally shitty whatever sex the parent is. It’s even worse because his mum has already done it.

@Goldbar whilst I absolutely agree that calling someone a bitch is hugely disrespectful & needs dealing with, I can only assume you don't have teenagers. Sometimes they say and do the most horrible things to get a rise, to test boundaries and just because they can or they've heard their mates do it or just because they are angry about something & lashing out. It's not right and of course there needs to be consequences and discussion, but if you reckon a few swear words & grumpy attitude justifies kicking a teen out, you might be in for a rude awakening in a few years time.

My guess is there's a lot more than a one-off incident and your wife has had enough. If not, she too is in for a rude awakening and I'd be asking if she will want to kick her DC out if they do anything similar.

“You should be the one asking your son to do chores around the house. It shouldn't be left for your wife to sort out.”

Why? Either they’re a family or they aren’t, you can’t have it both ways. In a family, either parent can and should be asking telling the kids to do their jobs.

I know a lot of teenagers and I remember being one myself and, while swearing was commonplace and I imagine still is, calling your mother a bitch was definitely crossing a line. The kids that did this and similar sorts of things tended to be the ones that people avoided. There's a difference between what the DSS said and dropping a few expletives here and there.

I agree with this.

It's very sad for all the children involved.

I think they’ve both been a bit shortsighted.

It was his primary responsibility to look out for his existing children and should maybe have made it clear to any future partner him and his children come as a package deal and any or all of his 3 kids could come and live with him on a more full time basis at any point so if they’re not prepared for that they’re unsuitable.

However, at the same time she also chose to bring her own child into the world with him knowing he already had children who could at any point live with him permanently.

I do agree very sad for all the children. They’re the ones with no choice and little voice in these situations.

It is, but the post stinks to male entitlement, aka ‘a man who expects to put a group together and thinks “all will sort itself out”. It’s not this woman’s job to raise nor educate his child, it’s HIS job. Maybe step mum doesn’t like his child and he should not have moved in with her but prioritise raising him.

It was his primary responsibility to look out for his existing children and should maybe have made it clear to any future partner him and his children come as a package deal and any or all of his 3 kids could come and live with him on a more full time basis at any point so if they’re not prepared for that they’re unsuitable.

This is implicit in the fact that he was already a parent. Simply stating that fact to his prospective new partner should have "made this clear" to her.

What is it with there being so many adults around who think that their preferences and relationship desires come above providing an appropriate environment for children to grow up in without feeling resented, unwanted, rejected, displaced and held to higher standards of behaviour than the adults in their lives?

If you decide to have a child then they are your responsibility and their wellbeing should be your first priority. If you decide to marry someone with children then you must accept that their children's wellbeing will be prioritised over yours, if they are a decent human being. If you model selfish, disrespectful behaviour to children then they're very likely to display the same back to you as they grow older.

Hardly rocket science. Contained in endless studies on child development and the factors the impact their life outcomes that anybody considering having children could choose to look at and consider before they have children or decide to marry someone with existing children.

Adults really need to start taking responsibility for their behaviour rather than expecting children to put up with these enormous disruptions to their lives, being forced to live with unrelated adults who treat them in a callous manner, and then to top it all off their actual parents questioning whom they should be protecting in this scenario which they created and about which the child had zero choice.

I honestly cannot understand how unbelievably selfish and horrendous some people are and the utterly callous manner in which they treat their children. To then blame the child for their reaction to all of the adults in their life treating them in this manner is beyond belief.

I mean he did call her a bitch… I suspect the stepmum isn’t really the bad one in all this. Maybe she’s looking out for the younger child if the older one’s behaviour is getting problematic. She’s been there for six years so why has she suddenly snapped now?

And so SO many women have children with absolute degenerates. That’s not good for the children either, in fact it’s way worse, yet nobody is allowed to say that. And often they know very well that their “partner” is a useless lump of crap and highly abusive before they get pregnant (or get pregnant again) and the child has to grow up knowing that’s their dad.

I mean as they have been together for six years and living together for four I suspect there is a lot more to it than the stepmum deciding one day that she wants his other child out of her life for no reason. If the son at 15 is being verbally abusive to her that’s neither normal nor acceptable and needs to be dealt with, not excused. And presumably when he moved in he wasn’t like this so there was nothing to “make clear” to her.

I know several biological parents who have turfed out their teenagers for horrible behaviour and this boys mum sent him to live with his dad. Several posts on here too where the OP is advised to send one child to live with the other parent due to how they behave at home.

It depends on what exactly has gone on and we don’t know that for sure.

I mean, the OP says his children are 16, 15, 11 and 4 (the latter being the child of him and his second wife).

So working backwards his new wife got pregnant when his existing children were 11, 10 and 6.

Presuming he is a reasonable human being he wouldn't have considered dating immediately after the family breakup, he would have spent at least 2 years first ensuring all of the children were ok and had adjusted to the new setup and everything had stabilised. Then, if he was dating let's assume he met somebody suitable to consider (if he wanted to involve them with his children not keep dating totally separate) immediately, which seems unlikely, but to be generous let's assume that by miraculous chance this happened immediately that he started dating. He then pursued this relationship for at least a year keeping it completely separate to his children to check this was going to last and she was suitable then gradually introduced her to his children with no pressure over another 2 years before moving in together unless his children were comfortable with her moving into their home. Then allowed another year or two to see how that worked before considering having another child. Who was conceived 5 years ago.

So that means if we are to assume the OP conducted his relationship with his new wife responsibly with sufficient consideration for his children, he left his first family 5 + 2 + 2 + 1 + 2 years which is 12 years... older than the age of his youngest child from the first marriage now. So even on this generous analysis of squeezed timeframes that a responsible parent would consider he would have had to leave when his third child was conceived and his oldest two were 3 and 4.

It's very obvious from the timescales, as well as the way he has treated his son to date, the comments he has posted, that he isn't a responsible father, and hasn't followed anything like this timeframe because the desires and preferences of him and his new wife have been prioritised over the needs of his children, and he's learned nothing from this and is actually blaming the child for the entirely predictable impact of those decisions rather than taking a long, hard look at himself and what type of person he has decided to marry and inflict upon his children, presumably with no check with them first that they were happy with her moving into their home.

Except the children were all living with their mum at the time weren’t they because the oldest boy moved in when the baby was born. So not all the points apply.

I’m not sure about all the maths in that and how it all works out or why he needed to be single for two years before starting dating and all that stuff but it’s largely bullshit anyway and not based on any reliable research. Mumsnet tends to say 6 months for intros anyway.

Anyway if she’s threatening to leave then she won’t be “inflicted” on him much longer but her crime was asking him to put his laundry basket out and he reacted by calling her a bitch. I wonder what she would get if she asked him to pass her the salt.

I mean as they have been together for six years and living together for four I suspect there is a lot more to it than the stepmum deciding one day that she wants his other child out of her life for no reason. If the son at 15 is being verbally abusive to her that’s neither normal nor acceptable and needs to be dealt with, not excused. And presumably when he moved in he wasn’t like this so there was nothing to “make clear” to her.

Which means he did this in a completely irresponsible manner in the first place without prioritising his children and their wellbeing after the breakdown of his first relationship.

And yes, it is entirely normal for a teen to mutter an insult under the breath. He wasn't being aggressive or threatening, just normal teenage behaviour which is sometimes horrible but entirely expected and adults need to deal with appropriately through decent parenting (NB this does not include threatening to chuck said teenager out of the house).

What should have been clear to her is that if you decide to marry a parent that includes the fact that teenagers may come to live with you and no, you don't get to issue ultimatums and try to make their parent choose between you and their child. And those teenagers won't always behave how you like. And that if the parent is a decent one they'd issue divorce proceedings against anybody who tried to threaten them into throwing their teenager out of the house for muttering an insult.

I know several biological parents who have turfed out their teenagers for horrible behaviour and this boys mum sent him to live with his dad. Several posts on here too where the OP is advised to send one child to live with the other parent due to how they behave at home.

Those are horrendous parents also, then. You knowing some other horrendous parents doesn't make them any less horrendous than these ones.

Except the children were all living with their mum at the time weren’t they because the oldest boy moved in when the baby was born. So not all the points apply.

Nope. If you marry someone with children then you accept that those children may come to live with that parent regardless of arrangements at the time.

Their other parent may become seriously ill or die. Or the child may just choose to live with the other parent, as they should be able to once they are older. If you can't handle that idea then you have no business marrying somebody who already has children.

My 15 yo DS is pretty poor at chores, sometimes he can be quite rude. Calling her a name is obviously unacceptable but to say she is moving out seems to be going to far. And putting you in an impossible position.

Apologies, the penultimate paragraph should have been bolded because it was a quote from @Startinganew32 's post to which I was responding.