Wife can’t live with my son

[Zihgty]

My wife and I have been together 6 years, we had our first child 4 years ago, and my son from a previous marriage moved in at the same time we had our baby (ex wife having trouble with him), and things have been ‘ok’ until recently when my son and wife have not been getting on- my son is almost 15 btw - he seems to resent her asking him to do things around the house, and when I was out for the eveing he called her a bitch. I spoke with him and told him if it happens again he can move back in with his mum, and things have been ok since.

However my wife now tells me I have to choose between him and her- if he stays she moves out, she’s not happy living with him.

Im so depressed that I’ve been put in this situation. My son’s mum is already looking after my 2 other kids, (11 and 16). Deep down I just want everyone to get along. I love my wife and want to have a happy life with her, my previous marriage failed and this time I’m sure it’s a good thing. I also don’t want to let my son down.

any advice appreciated.

However, even IF it's his mum that leaves and he sees her at best 50% of the time, are you saying that the breakdown of the 4-year old's family unit won't affect him because he gets to stay in the house? Are you suggesting that his upheaval doesn't matter? That it's somehow less than?

No the 4yo isn’t less than but it’s the wife who is choosing to take him away from the family home.

Why would you try and make her feel guilty for leaving by saying that it will affect him etc.

Yes of course it will affect him slightly but he’s 4 and he’ll adapt.
If the wife wants to leave, then no one should be guilt tripping her into staying.

Yes the kids come first, but you shouldn’t stay together purely for the kids sake.
Kids easily adapt to separated parents.

And yes the OP should discipline his son but that’s irrelevant anyway because his DW has already asked him to choose.

Anyone who asks you to choose between your child and them is not a suitable partner.

I hope you don’t have kids because it sounds like you would choose your partner over your kids which is quite shocking.

No the 4yo isn’t less than but it’s the wife who is choosing to take him away from the family home

IF the teenage son continues to live there yes. Or so we are led to believe. If the teenager doesn't live there then presumably she won't leave. It doesn't really matter what you think of her ultimatum but the fact remains that it is entirely the OP's decision that will determine to outcome for both his sons.

Once again, OP isn't choosing his DW over his child. He's choosing one of his children over the other.

If I had to chose my partner over my child of course it would be the child. But if it's my child vs my other child (who leaves with partner), the waters become much murkier - and no amount of 'child X was here first' will make an ounce of difference.

It's. Not. About. The. Wife.

No the wife has said it’s his son or her.

She did not say it’s the older son vs the younger son.

He is not choosing between his kids, he is having to choose between his wife and kids.
Of which there is no competition.

Are you really saying that he should kick out his child, just so his wife can continue living there?
Why should a child be removed from their own home because an adult has decided that she doesn’t want to live with him anymore?

Would you honestly kick your kid out if your husband said he didn’t want to live with them anymore?

No the wife has said it’s his son or her.
She did not say it’s the older son vs the younger son.

Good grief. Where the mum goes the 4yo goes - if OP chooses his teenager his wife 4yo also leaves. Even if DW doesn't take the 4yo, he still has a breakdown of his family unit and sees his mum less. It's emotionally impactful either way.

He is literally choosing between his children's relative trauma.

Would you honestly kick your kid out if your husband said he didn’t want to live with them anymore?

No. But you're forgetting that if I kick my husband out, I am actively losing my other children at least 50% of the time. Which I also do not want, because they are just as important to me, even though they weren't born first.

Why are you more concerned about the ‘trauma’ of a 4yo having 2 homes, than the actual trauma of a child having no home.

OP doesn’t want the wife to leave.
She is CHOOSING to do so.

His only options are to kick his child out of his own home or force his wife to stay.

Neither option is acceptable and so therefore the 4yo will have to have 2 homes.

If there is any negative impact on the 4yo from the parents separating, then this is from the wife because she’s the one who isn’t happy and wants to leave.

But the 4yo will be fine like every other child with separated parents.

I don’t know why you’re so desperate to make this about the two kids.
The wife has asked him to choose between her and the teen.
Stop trying to twist it to fit your narrative.

If you’re so concerned about the 4yo and their trauma from the parents separating, then you’d be more angry at the wife for wanting to leave.
But instead you’re trying to twist it into a completely different scenario, just to make OP be in the wrong.

Why are you more concerned about the ‘trauma’ of a 4yo having 2 homes, than the actual trauma of a child having no home

I'm concerned about them both. They're both children, both are shit situations, no one trumps the other.

Neither option is acceptable and so therefore the 4yo will have to have 2 homes.

Yes, by OP choosing his teenager over the 4yo he will have 2 homes, yes. That is true.

If there is any negative impact on the 4yo from the parents separating, then this is from the wife because she’s the one who isn’t happy and wants to leave.

I doubt the 4yo will care about who is responsible, the outcome for him is the same.

But the 4yo will be fine like every other child with separated parents.

Like the teenager, right? He's totally fine.

I don’t know why you’re so desperate to make this about the two kids.

Because there are 2 kids involved. One is not more important than the other. We've been over this.

If you’re so concerned about the 4yo and their trauma from the parents separating, then you’d be more angry at the wife for wanting to leave.

Again, it doesn't matter who I'm - or you, stranger from the internet - is more angry at. The outcomes for either child will be the same, irrespective of which adult you 'blame'.

But instead you’re trying to twist it into a completely different scenario, just to make OP be in the wrong

I've not said OP is in the wrong. What I do think is 'wrong' is the assertion that his teenager automatically comes above all else, including OP's other child. Because he was born first? Because he was there before OP left and started a new family? That particular crime is not the 4yo's fault - and however much you dismiss the consequences of leaving his family home as 'not that bad' that's not really your place to say.

Why are you more concerned about the ‘trauma’ of a 4yo having 2 homes, than the actual trauma of a child having no home

I'm concerned about them both. They're both children, both are shit situations, no one trumps the other.

What utter nonsense. As if a child having separated parents and spending time at both homes is in any way equivalent to both parents refusing to care for a child and leaving them with no home at all.

Ah I see. Is that how you'd word it to the 4yo? As you pack up his room, his toys and his safety and say 'bye then, see you in 2 weeks"?

Or would you elaborate more on why his world being turned upside down was much less important than his brother's wellbeing? As long as he knows that he'll be just fine. Especially if you throw in that because he was born last he's not as important as the older children. He'll completely understand and forgive you, no kickback from that will come in 5-10 years time.

MN is swarming with people saying how their parents' divorce and living between 2 homes hasn't affected their mental health in the slightest, and they certainly didn't have any trouble along the way.

You make your own choices about what you would do, should you be in this situation, you make your own justifications - as I said there are no winners here. But please stop trying to say that the 4yo won't be affected - I'm sure he might disagree with you. 'You pick the child, ALWAYS' is very noble until you recognise that there is more than one child here and allowing collateral damage to one of them to save the other is not as clear cut as you'd like it to be.

BOTH children are EQUALLY important. I’m not the OP but I am a father myself. The equation is really simple were I in the OP’s position. Any children I have and myself come as a package deal. Were I given the ultimatum under discussion my job isn’t to “choose” between my children it’s to make it work with all of them. If I had a soon-to-be-ex wife that suddenly wanted me to abandon one of my children, well that would be a seismic shift in the foundation of the marriage I thought I had. I couldn’t see it continuing. I’d propose either I take on the four year old keep my teenage son living with me and ex wife can have visits or we split childcare 50/50.

Now on a separate note the teenage son and his “issues”, maybe it’s a simple discipline issue maybe there are some neurodivergent elements to it. In any case it would be my job to figure that out and. Hopefully with support from but it wouldn’t be the responsibility of my wife to sort it for me.

Nobody said he was less important. Why are you making things up @Hhhhhot? There's no point in you writing nonsense responses that bear no resemblance at all to the actual points people have made.

Nobody said he was less important.

You can say (or not say) it as much as you want, if I was your 4yo I would interpret your actions very differently.

It's obvious we have a difference of opinion so I guess we'll have to leave it there - but I am genuinely surprised by how easy you and other PPs would find it to say to one of your children 'sorry, you can't live here full-time anymore, bye bye'.

I would find it an agonisingly impossible decision but we are all different and you can only feel what you feel and act accordingly.

It's obvious we have a difference of opinion so I guess we'll have to leave it there - but I am genuinely surprised by how easy you and other PPs would find it to say to one of your children 'sorry, you can't live here full-time anymore, bye bye'.

Right. So you're genuinely really surprised someone thinks that one child having two homes to go to is not as bad as another child having no home to go to.

I really hope you don't have any children. That's really disgraceful.

And all of that is entirely beside the point given that isn't in the OP's control. It is his wife choosing for the four year old's parents to separate, not him. He has no reasonable course of action to take but to agree to her demand to separate given that the only alternative she stated she will accept is that he throws his other child out of his home. The four year old having separated parents is not up to him.

Said 4 year old will also grow up and would presumably be horrified if they later discovered that their half sibling was made homeless at their mother's demand, let alone that their father capitulated to this on the basis that it was more important that their parents didn't separate than their sibling having a home at all.

Then the only option would be for dad to keep his kids together and OP to move out. That’s not ideal either.

Yeah I have to agree with this assuming your wife was happy to have your child(ren) there in the first place before your own child arrived. What would happen if something happened to your ex? You'd have all three (well, four) DC under your roof.

You shouldn't have made the threat to your child that they'd move back with mum if they misbehaved. That's a horrible thing to hold over someone's head, that you'll basically reject them if they don't behave exactly as you'd like. And it has made it an option for your wife. You're meant to love your child unconditionally, and parent them.

So you're genuinely really surprised someone thinks that one child having two homes to go to is not as bad as another child having no home to go to.

No. I'm not at all surprised you think that, I think most people actually do think that. What I'm surprised about is how easy you seem to think it is to make the decision to say goodbye to one of your children, in any capacity and for any reason - even a very good one. You seem to think there would be zero fallout and it not being 'as bad' makes it OK.

I really hope you don't have any children. That's really disgraceful

Please don't do that, personal attacks have no place in any debate. Wishing someone doesnt have children is cruel and unnecessary, you don't know anybody else's story.

And all of that is entirely beside the point given that isn't in the OP's control. It is his wife choosing for the four year old's parents to separate, not him.

No. It is entirely up to him, that IS the point. If the teenager doesn't live there, then they don't separate, so OP absolutely has it in his power. You don't like that reality, you feel that to do anything other than choose the teenager is outrageous (we heard you) - but that is, in fact, the reality - as awful as it is, there IS a choice.

Said 4 year old will also grow up and would presumably be horrified if they later discovered that their half sibling was made homeless at their mother's demand, let alone that their father capitulated to this on the basis that it was more important that their parents didn't separate than their sibling having a home at all.

I don't think that's human nature. I'd imagine that right now and for the foreseeable future its far more important to him that his parents don't separate. And even if this selfless epiphany about his brother's well-being comes later in life when he has grown up, that is many years away and the intervening years will have had their effect.

What you've just described is your OWN horror about the situation, your own feelings on it as seen through the eyes of an adult who isn't involved in the situation. You're not wrong to have them but there's no guarantee the 4yo will see it the same way, even when he's grown up.

I'm surprised about is how easy you seem to think it is to make the decision to say goodbye to one of your children

Nobody said it was easy. They said the OP's wife has left him np other choice because if he is a decent human being obviously he won't throw one of his children out of their home to appease her. If she then chooses to separate because he won't comply with her outrageous demand then it is her, not him, who is creating the situation where the 4 year old's parents don't live together.

Wishing someone doesnt have children is cruel and unnecessary, you don't know anybody else's story.

I didn't "wish" anything. However, it is clear that it would be very bad for children to have a parent who would even contemplate making one of their children homeless because their romantic partner demands that they do so. So yes, I hope that children do not have parents like that and it would be far better if people with such abhorrent views that they would find this acceptable chose not to become parents.

No. It is entirely up to him, that IS the point. If the teenager doesn't live there, then they don't separate, so OP absolutely has it in his power.

No, it isn't. His wife has behaved like a toddler having a tantrum and the situation is entirely her responsibility. She chose to marry someone who already had children. She has then tried to force them to throw one of their children out of their home which clearly no reasonable person would comply with or even consider. She is also a bully, to issue such an ultimatum and the relationship is dead in the water anyway as a result. If the OP was stupid and immoral enough to comply with her demand and trash his son's life and their relationship by complying with his wife's threats then do you really think the relationship will survive long term anyway? And if this dictator gets her way then it won't be long before she makes the next outrageous and callous ultimatum. If someone's issuing ultimatums of any kind their relationship has clearly disintegrated and they are trying to coerce the other person. It's toxic and abusive and so the "choice" you present is one in name only. The abusive, coercive person is responsible for their actions and the consequences, not the person on the receiving end of it.

I'd imagine that right now and for the foreseeable future its far more important to him that his parents don't separate

This is why we make decisions for children. Nobody asks a 4 year old to make such a choice because they cannot comprehend the implications. The OP has to balance the needs of all of his children. His wife has created a terrible situation for them where there's no ideal outcome, but overall clearly it is more damaging for one child to have been ejected from his homes with both of his parents than for another child to have separated parents and two homes where he is welcome. I'm sure the OP would prefer his wife wasn't behaving in such a callous and vindictive manner and creating a situation where at least one of his children has to have a less easy life, but she has. He can't make her behave like a reasonable human being if she's running around issuing ultimatums that children should be forced out of their home. The only thing he can do is try to minimise the damage and that quite obviously means that of course any suggestion that HE would eject one of his children from their home will be rejected. If his wife then chooses to leave and his 4 year old has separated parents then that is entirely her responsibility to live with.

Then the only option would be for dad to keep his kids together and OP to move out. That’s not ideal either.

Frankly it might well be, given the type of person his wife has shown herself to be by demanding a child is forced out of their home!