He bought her diamond jewellery - Follow on thread

[Spikyseason]

I was in two minds as to whether to make a follow-on thread, but primarily I wanted to thank everyone who supported me on the previous thread. I am so grateful for such comprehensive and sound advice, and for those who were brave enough to share their own experiences with me. I do at least feel less alone.

I have an update as I spoke to DH when he got home yesterday, about everything. I’ll try to summarise.

He was still cagey about his feelings for OW. He did admit he missed her and he said he had communicated that to her since. He also said he was only human and had wanted to make sure she was ok, ‘what happened’ was his fault and he hadn’t intended to hurt her or me. He apologised for it, said it wouldn’t happen again. That ultimately he had made the decision to commit to his family and the promises he made. Usual. Wanted the opportunity to prove that.

The furthest he would admit to was that it was an emotional thing (couldn’t really deny that given the jewellery - he promised it was not a ring) but ultimately being in his children’s lives was more important, that clearly there are problems in our marriage that he should have addressed, he didn’t blame me, but overall he felt we could work on any problems between us for the sake of DC and he understood it would take a long time for me to trust him.

I do feel very much like he wants to just get back to normal asap. I also feel like he is maybe either lying to me about feelings for OW or in denial. Perhaps he thinks with time any feelings will fade. I think though if you genuinely loved someone that never goes away. I don’t suppose I’ll get any true answers on that front. I mean worst case he did and I suppose we just carry on and hope for the best and he forgets all about her, if he genuinely is committed to that?

On some level of course I worry this would never have happened if he genuinely loved me. I read something somewhere once that if someone falls in love outside of the marriage then it’s almost always irreconcilable. But if we’re both determined to make it work then I hope eventually the memory and pain will fade? I don’t know - I would welcome thoughts from those who tried but ultimately had to call it a day 😕 I don’t know if I’m kidding myself. My primary concern is DC but also aware I have a fear of change.

I was having therapy before, I’ve rebooked some sessions to help get my head straight as I don’t feel strong enough to leave yet. Part of me feels like time will test his actual commitment. Then there’s the angry part of me that doesn’t see why he should just be able to walk out on his wife and family into a shiny new life…

Anyway, I just wanted to provide a little update and thank you all again x

The thing is op, like an awful lot of people in your situation, you are currently doing the "pick me dance" and it never, ever works.
All the while you are doing your best tap routine, complete with jazz hands and a big false smile on your face to try and hide your devastation and get him to stay with you, that sad sack of shit still sees you as an "option". He thinks he has a choice!!!
Can I suggest that you move from the "pick me dance" to the "Fuck You Fandango"? The thing about the fuck you fandango is, it feels uncomfortable as hell. You don't know the moves, you've never heard the music and it feels awkward and wrong. So, what you have to do, is fake it til you make it. Head up, shoulders back, with the contempt you feel for him written large across your face. Grey rock the twat, be cold and calm and do not show him one ounce of sorrow. Instead, start dancing for YOU. Think about the things you want (retraining, work, time with friends etc) and make it happen. Stop making him the centre of the universe. You are not used to putting yourself first so it will feel weird and uncomfortable initially, but the longer you fake it, the more it becomes real and the better you will feel.

When this happened to a very dear friend of mine, this is exactly what she did, after the initial period of wanting him to pick her, she moved to the Fuck You Fandango. Her dick of a husband took that as the green light to naff off to the OW, but she stayed her course, wished him well and carried on doing things for her. Predictably, after 6 months, her husband was back with his tail between his legs, begging for another chance. Funnily enough though, by that point, friend had moved on to the "I am better by myself salsa" and wouldn't have it. He now lives alone, wallowing in the knowledge that he was the mastermind of his own downfall and is spluttering with horror that said friend has found herself a new very "energetic" 35 year old "dance partner"!!

Start fighting op, and not for him, because currently, he isn't worth one minute of your time, but for you and your dc. Pick up your sword and start swinging!!!

This with bells on

I said it on your previous thread OP I think you play the long game here with the focus being on you. Use the time to gain independence, to build a good exit fund and to work out what you want from life.

Sadly I think your H is going through the motions and not wanting to be the bad guy. Ultimately you have 1 life and deserve to be happy but you can be happy on your own or meet someone new.

From his actions and what he has said it looks very strongly like a case of when not if for the next one be that the OW or someone else.

So readdress the balance, follow something you want to do etc. At best it will not be needed if your happy and he sticks to his word. At worst your sorted to support yourself and DCs.

Being alone is far better than being with someone who treats you like this.

Gaining more independence is a great idea, try breaking things down into small steps.

You won’t feel this way forever. It’s impossible. Feelings change and fade.

Don’t compromise your standards and deal breakers for this man. He has shown you no respect. Have respect for yourself, focus on what you deserve and act in alignment with your values.

Well he's clearly not your type OP as your type is someone who has integrity.

@Spikyseason , It's really painful reading the way you speak about yourself, and I think part of getting through this will depend on changing your self-talk.

You've apologised for being on YOUR own thread, for being boring/frustrating/a failure etc... And now you have cast yourself as someone who cannot compete with this other woman who is supposedly out of your husband's league.

You are a woman who should be confident in taking up space on YOUR thread - the one you started for support. If anyone is bored, frustrated or otherwise, they can move on to the countless other threads available. In the meantime, type as you're feeling, and the posters that wish to stick around and support you will do exactly that - with no expectation that you're packing your bags right now, on their say so.

You are a woman, phenomenally. You may not have completed the course/career path you all started out on, but that's fine. The retirement age is almost 70, which leaves plenty of time for us to pivot. And if you choose not to even pursue a career; as long as you can be financially stable, that's fine too.

You wouldn't tell another woman here who doesn't have a career, wealthy husband, healthy children or such that she is - less than, not worthy of respect, not worthy of her husband's love, not worthy of our time; so why say that to yourself?

You are a responsible, faithful partner who has managed to keep her vow of honesty and fidelity to her husband. Not a sexually and emotionally incontinent ass like your husband.

You are not in competition with the OW. Your husband has engaged in an affair with her, and may even love her, BUT (big but) - you are his wife. The woman who could actually royally upend his life at this point. You need to own your power - the one that's making him stay more than anything else right now. The power to cut in half, what is making him attractive to 'Miss out of his League'. You are currently holding the key to half the finances, half the time with his children, his image as a 'respectable family man' and so much more.

And please- she stopped being out of his league the minute she engaged in this affair. Whether she came down to his level or he climbed on his £80k to get to hers; the whole league foolishness became moot.

Think about the many wonderful things you are, and start talking to and about yourself accordingly.

Ouch! Him staying with you is his penance?! Being with you is not the fulfilment of his life, but a punishment for being caught?! That must feel horrible...

He didn’t actually say that, just the way he probably sees it given what’s happened and what’s been said from my point of view!

@Spikyseason good plan to get more independent as you will start to see your worth. Please don’t write yourself off here as a bad package as you are “wrong” side of 40 with young dc. I am similar age to you with older DC. Met my dp approaching 5 years ago now. He’s always thought himself lucky to have me and embraced me having kids. It’s hard to think this far ahead when you have so much going on. But don’t think you are not lovable and attractive just because of what has happened to you. Just because you’ve only been in a relationship with your H doesn’t mean you can’t with anyone else. I was with H from age of 22, separated at 39. Then I had a fwb, then dating men younger then me then met dp. Honestly when I look back I feel like crying that I wasted so many of my prime years with my ExH.

@Whenim63
Brilliant post.

You don’t have to follow in your mum’s footsteps. If your mum didn’t find anyone else, it’s doesn’t mean you won’t.

He’s a shitbag and doesn’t deserve you. He’s hoping you’ll be passive about this and he’ll get to keep all his options open. He doesn’t deserve that either, and knowing that being with you is just a (boring) option to him will completely destroy your sense of self worth if you stay. Good luck finding your rage and creating a new life for you.

Would he gift you 80k for you to keep as an exit fund for your use alone?

I do feel like my identity is wrapped up in him which is why in some ways separating feels like literal death. It’s that terrifying at times.

This is one of the saddest things I've ever read on MN. But - sadly - also one of the most frustrating.

You need to give yourself a bit of a talking to @Spikyseason . No-one wants someone else to lose their own identity. For a mediocre man, such as your husband, it could be a heavy burden for him to feel that his wife's identity is "wrapped up" in their own. And he has been careless and callous in response. Because your husband is a shallow idiot, he's responded to that burden by avoidance, instead of speaking to you, or getting some counselling for himself.

Yes, in the melée of child-rearing and supporting a "big" career of your spouse, it's easy to lose yourself. But finding yourself again is down to you to stop being a doormat! I'm glad to read you're going to go back to your therapist.

But the questions/issues you take to your therapy might need to change - on these threads you've consistently written out your thinking through the situation, focused on HIS actions, HIS intentions, HIS thoughts.

What about yours? What do you want, OP?

There's a technique in some approaches to therapy (eg story therapy, dramatherapy) often used with children. The therapist asks the child to describe their perfect situation, or that there's a magic wand to change one thing, or that you tell a familiar story but change the action a bit (eg Red Riding Hood sees the wolf straightaway).

If you had freedom to make your life as you wanted it, what would that be?

Because working that out, and doing it, is the action of a lifetime. It's sometimes difficult and lonely. And hard. But you cannot continue to use his awfulness as an excuse.

I really hope you find your courage

All of this OP - "start dancing for YOU"

A climb-down is never easy - I've had to do them myself! I'm trying to think of how to pat you on the back for holding your hands up, without being patronising but can't quite think how to phrase it. So please just take my word for it that that's what I'm going for!

<and then everyone was friends again> 😅

that has probably made me irrationally afraid of being alone.

Is being alone so much worse then being with a man that seems to be in love with someone else?

You seem a wonderful woman, too good to be the 'right' choice - you should be the ONLY choice.

I appreciate only you really understand what's at play, his tone when he speaks, the way he says his words. But from what you are repeating here - to most of us it is sounding like he doesn't truly want to be in your marriage anymore. Of course though you will listen to the words you want to hear as it is hope for what you want, but that is not what is being portrayed to us.

Please OP - You deserve so much better.

PS - My partner had a ONS and i forgave him, were still together now 4 years on and are happier than before. Maybe that makes me a hypocrite, but it has opened my eyes to the difference between remorse and guilt. Your H does not seem remorseful.

I literally have no idea what I want to do in terms of retraining. I can’t go back to my old job, and I can’t qualify in what I studied (I never managed it, probably wasn’t for me) so I would be starting entirely from scratch. Never really had a ‘career’ as such. I did odd jobs and then got pregnant soon after marrying. I will need to have a think about this, I am lucky in many ways there isn’t an immediate financial pressure if we do separate.

DH is literally wedded to his job in many ways and that hasn’t changed. It does at least give me some space. When he isn’t working he’s at the gym. So the PP who said he was avoidant is probably spot on.

I have taken on board the comment regarding the self talk and agree that’s something I need to work on changing.

Op don't keep him
In your marriage to punish him because he doesn't deserve freedom. You'll only punish yourself.

But .. if you are staying together, you need a whole new attitude. Put yourself first always. Self care, treats, boundaries, time with friends. Ensure you are benefiting as much as possible from this life. You will flourish and despite the fact that you're no longer caring for Or about him this sickly will probably make him fancy and lust after and desire you and respect you more. Demonstrate to him how to treat and respect you with how you treat yourself

Ps what you say about identity- use this time now to pour into yourself and find a hobby

I’m sorry you’ve been through it, not to minimise at all but I think a ONS is slightly different. I’m glad things are happier for you now.

re: guilt vs remorse, I know he feels really guilty. Whether he feels remorseful is another matter. He initially said he was surprised I was so bothered about it (given I must be such a horrendous and disinterested wife!) and my emotional reaction was probably another thing to ‘deal with’ and interfered with him doing his big and important job and his sex dates with OW…

he seems to say stuff like this but then as I said objectively does the ‘right’ things. So it’s hugely confusing.

This happened to my sister. Her husband had the big job, had affair with a woman in his company. My sister immediately left him...he pursued her to get her back when ge realised how bad the affair made him look she agreed to give it another go. 8 months later he left her for the other woman. This time his behaviour was terrible because he had got over the guilt of the first time!
Not telling you what to do, but I would pull the plaster off and go it alone. She will always be lurking somewhere.

“But then everyone says ‘look at his actions’ and his actions are him adamant he is staying and won’t leave me. “

Those are words not actions OP. Actions are: He had an affair for a year. Lied for a year. Spent £80k investing in that relationship. Is still in touch with her.

Look at what he does. Actually does. Not says he is doing or will do.

Really hope you find some fire soon OP and start planning your future away from this turd.

💐

Is there no end to the cruel, unpleasant things he has said to you OP?
What a nasty piece of work he is.

Op,
The sad truth is that your dh does not love you the way a man should love a woman
He is in love with the OW. There isn’t anything that shows that he really wants to save the relationship. He is still in touch with the OW .
I just feel so sad to think that you believe that this is all you are worth.
Remaining in this marriage will simply rob you of the chance to be with someone who truly loves you