To lbecome a SAHM if I don’t want to?

[Yesgojess]

My husband works in finance and works 12 hour days including commuting, and once a week will be out late with clients. The kids (18 months and 3) love him but he’s very much fun dad. I do all the hard graft, everything at home falls to me and I’m trying to hold down a part time senior level professional job that I worked hard for. The thing is I’m just crumbling. I’m burnt out week to week, I do all the meals, drop offs, pick ups, housework, cleaning, organising. He leaves the house before the kids wake up (and they are both up before 6), and then it’s just non stop until they are in bed. If he gets back in time he will stick them in the bath while I clean up downstairs but it’s all just a mad rush and it’s not like he takes over, I’m still just grafting alone all day. He’ll do the dishwasher once a day, make a soup and a few brunches on the weekend and that’s about it. He thinks this counts as being “non-stop” and “doing everything” outside of work. Neither of us ever get any down time. It’s been all go ever since we had our second. Not to mention when he started a new job and I had a 21 month and 8 week old and he said he needed to sleep in a separate room because he had to be on form, while apparently it was fine for me burn out and break down while being made to feel like I was pathetic for not coping.

I’m barely staying on top of my job, it’s impossible to get into the office because the morning juggle is usually so stressful that I’d end up being really late if I went in, added to the stress of being the only one to do pickup if the trains are messed up (which is common). So I stay at home and end up doing a million household jobs and just being stressed out all the time. We had a cleaner who had to leave the country a few months ago and I tried getting a babysitter in to help and she kept flaking, but despite all this think ultimately the issue is I just don’t want to be parenting alone or with paid help and no partner to share the load. It’s just not the same and it’s not what i want. I feel like my own mother who was a single parent and always stressed out doing it all herself. recently I’ve realised that something has to give and I’ve seriously thought about giving up work to stay on top of it all but I just feel so sad about giving up my career to be a skivvy just so my husband’s life can carry on as normal. We’ve talked about all sorts of options but he’s just so intent upon needing a ridiculous amount of financial security at the expense of my mental health. I feel like I just hate him for leaving it all to me and I fantasise about leaving him. Struggling to see what’s best for the kids in all of this because I just want them to have a happy home life with some equality and not a stressed out mom and absent dad. What should I do? Would you quit, give him an ultimatum? Spend all of his money and stop giving a shit? I just don’t know what to do. Things are so bad I’m just crying all the time, still getting support from the peri natal mental health team and just see no sign of things getting any better.

thank you for reading if you’ve got this far. I know it’s a first world problem and people have it so much worse for so many reasons

You sounds like you are at the end of your tether you poor thing. I really really wouldn't give up your job and I'd think carefully before taking lot of sick leave - I think by doing the latter you may make him think it is a 'you' problem and that you giving up work is the solution. I think you need to sit down and be very clear with him that it the current set-up is not acceptable and neither are any comments or digs suggesting you are not able to cope. You are struggling as the situation is not sustainable. BUT, I do think you are making it harder for yourself not wanting a nanny and I think if he does something around the house but it isn't how you want it done, you'll need to bite your tongue otherwise he will view the home as your domain even more so.
It is not up to him to decide that your job is not worth the money/stress - it brings other positives to your life.
It is crazy you don't have a cleaner at least!
I think you need:

1. Cleaner
2. Nanny
3. Stock up on Cook! meals or even better start getting a meal delivery kit - they are a game changer.
4. Serious chat with your husband
5. He should use some holiday to look after the kids in the Oct half term or a week at Christmas (before you get a nanny) and you take yourself off for a few days. Or even better he does the same part time hours as you that week using annual leave. You get a break and he understands.
6. Get married.
7. Couples therapy and your own therapy.

Good luck ❤️

Yeah nail on the head here, thank you. I guess my reasoning was that being a SAHM would be good for the kids in terms of me being present and not stressed out worrying about work (or how little of it I’m doing), and also not feeling guilty that I’m hiring help instead of doing it myself when we can afford for me to.

I am well aware it’s a first world problem and not having to worry about money is definitely not to be sniffed at. He’s providing in his way and has always encouraged me to outsource but I think fundamentally i just don’t like the attitude of rich bankers who think they can have kids and then pay someone else to raise them, squirrelling away their money just to retire early when the kids don’t need them anymore.

i appreciate that so much of this is about my mindset and values and how I had hoped to raise a family, which he honestly always seemed to be on board with and I think he is in principle. He’s just been sucked in to knowing he can make all this money and cannot bring himself to give it up.

the conclusion we have come to for now is that I take some time off work just to have a break. He is going to ask for some flex at work to say do the Wednesday drop off/ pick up so that I can go into the office and just do my job without all the other stuff, with the knowledge that it will either not be allowed or be so frowned upon that they’ll get rid of him as soon as they can which might not be the worst thing that could happen.

he had a cushty job for 10 years that was long hours but a lot more comfortable, but he was made redundant when i was pregnant with DD2. Everything went completely to shit when he got a new job when she was 8 weeks old and we had 2 under 2 and he was expected to work all hours to prove himself in a new role. At that point it was 13 hour days plus 2 nights out a week and the burn out has just built up and up for me all while I’ve felt like I should be coping better because my mom was a single parent and his mom did everything. So much of this has been wrong and awful and I wish I’d seen the wood for the trees and got him to get out after the redundancy.

basically he didn’t want to pay the extra stamp duty for having more than one property when buying our house and then the extra capital gains when we sell it

Be very careful about this. It is not as simple as two unmarried people can have two properties without CGT arising on sale. In general a property has to be your main residence (ie you have to live there) in order to claim CGT relief on selling - if you moved out, you only get tax relief for any gain during the period you lived there. There are a few exceptions for if you move out for a while for specific reasons, but these are time limited (I think the max absence is 3 years) and generally you have to move back in again for a while before selling.

So this really isn’t a good reason for not getting married - assuming you and your DP are intending to be honest with the tax authorities.

Thanks @minipie for the reminder we moved out exactly 3 years ago so it’s indeed a moot point anyway.

Forgot to say in my previous post I’ll be getting a weekly cleaner asap and I’d like to look into a housekeeper. My dream is not to constantly do all the drudgey shit and to actually be a good mother. Something I just don’t feel able to do all the time atm.

Please approach your work about parental leave and/or an unpaid sabbatical , rather than resigning.

Honestly I totally understand why resigning appeals. I did it myself in similar circumstances. But do not do it until you are married. Please.

I couldn't stay with a partner who clearly didn't respect me, but I think for now you need to put your energies into the quickest solutions that make the biggest impact first. Lots of great suggestions already on the thread but prioritise what'll help the most and get that in place asap. And as each solution gives you a bit more headspace then it'll be easier to look at the bigger picture.
Another one saying don't even think about becoming a SAHM while you aren't married though. A man who didn't make the marriage legal here to save tax is a man who will fuck you over financially if or when you eventually separate.

Good, it sounds like he is starting to see things as they are at least.

It feels to me like you are the default parent and the assumption is you will sort everything. If that was my partner, I would ask why he doesn’t feel accountability and responsibility for the wellbeing and day-to-day with the children. Why is it all falling to you?

I know you know this but he needs to understand that money isn’t everything either, you can’t buy back your mental health or your relationship if it goes beyond the point of no return. Resentment festers. What would he prefer, being sat on a pile of money alone, or have a little less but be surrounded by a happy and content family?

have you had a conversation about what the endgame is? How long will he be staying in his line of work? What are your own plans for your work life? How do you see yourselves evolving as the family unit develops and the kids get older?

Sounds good to take some time off work to get yourself together, if you do end up leaving, make sure you are protected as you can be, especially if you aren’t legally married. Also, leaving your work may alleviate guilt you feel in some respects, but that feeling could be replaced with something else, in relation to not having your job and losing autonomy in some respects.

I hope it all works out for you ❤️

Thanks for the reminder we moved out exactly 3 years ago so it’s indeed a moot point anyway.

FYI you can only claim CGT relief for that 3 year period if you now move back in again. Otherwise, you can claim relief for the period you lived there plus last 9 months of ownership. Apologies if you know all this.

Thanks all. We’ve agreed to get married when we get back. We were always intending to but life and the pandemic took over, but I think I’ve managed to drill into him all the sacrifices and risks I’m taking. I know full well it would kill him to hand his precious money over to me if things imploded and I really did need this reminder. To be honest I have given him absolute hell the last few days. I’ve been really stressed out wondering what to do and suddenly realised he was being an absolute dick by leaving the entire decision to me instead of offering to make any accommodations to help.

I will speak to my gp and my manager and find out how much time I can take off and how flexible my job can be for the next year or two while it’s so intense.

Getting the very strong sense that quitting work just plays into his hands and bolsters his career while potentially ruining my mental health further. A bit of me still wants to but I think I need to wait it out as long as possible and get some perspective.

thanks so much to everyone who’s weighed in 🌺

He needs to change job. If he won't you absolutely need paid help. Sounds like you could afford a good wage to a nanny housekeeper and could get someone great.

Please don't give up a job you love because your DH is a knob. Use that household money to keep your sanity.

Not only that, sahm always sounds good when they're small so you can dust off that rose tinted photo of what you thought being a mum was like, but it is so hard to get back in.

If you've got a part time senior position, you need to hold onto it, as climbing back up the ladder with a dh who is the primary earner, and kids whatever age is harder than hanging on.

Get a good nanny - it's a big investment in your kids. I had a choice and I went for saving money and honestly, it probably cost me a couple of promotions due to still being worried.

Let go of Victorian expectations that you ought to want to sah.

And get married, as everyone else says.

He is selfish. Just because his hours earn more £££ doesn't mean he is working longer hours than the OP who is holding down a senior job and 100% of the home front.

He wants the money to pay for fancy holidays etc which the OP isn't even enjoying whilst (like many men) just assuming she will constantly bend like elastic to ensure his life continues untramelled.

Either they pay for a lot more help OR he steps up to to take a share of his house and his DC or in the long term the marriage won't last and the OP will be scrabbling to try and rebuild a career disrupted and downgraded to facilitate his career.

I can entirely see why men do this - its easy for them to just carry on regardless, especially when their wives are constantly told by other women to be grateful for the Big Man with this Big Job. Set your standards higher for men.

If you quit and lose your career, and he leaves you and the kids. You will be entitled to zilch nothing, nada apart from child support.
Buy in help. Don't quit your job.
You're very very financially vulnerable.

A PP put it well when they said it is actually him who needs to be outsourcing his half of the parenting and housekeeping if he isn’t willing to do it himself.

OP, it sounds like you’ve put your cards on the table and are willing to give it a last go. I’d have been out the door by now but can understand why you want to keep trying.

It’s too late for OP, but one of her updates should be a very clear lesson to any woman yet to have kids with her partner: if he isn’t actively countering and challenging the outdated, sexist views of his parents on gender roles, run a mile.

Having read your updates I can totally see why you feel he is selfish but I can also see why he thinks he's trying hard.

Sounds like he works long hours, comes home and baths the kids, weekends are spent taking them out. It sounds like when he does try to do something "to help" i.e. with a good intention he gets it wrong (totally on your side here, we all know how infuriating it is to have a husband who uses up all your allocated ingredients!) To be honest he sounds clueless - no surprise given how he was brought up. I wouldn't want to be a man brought up with mum doing everything and dad only having to provide fibancially and nothing more. I love that I'm a smart and capable woman and can't imagine having to start to learn how to pull my weight as a grown adult. Does he get any kid free time?

Im usually the first to say throw the whole man away but I can actually see both your points of view here and you've said you love him and want to make it work so the only way how is to outsource as much as you can, and maybe get him some meal planning lessons.

Thanks @Natty13. I agree with most of the comments on here that it’s unfair and disrespectful and ridiculous but you’re also right. He thinks he works his arse off for us to have a comfortable life and then I’m here ripping his head off because I’m burnt out and he’s not doing his share of stuff at home. We have been together since we were 18 and are clearly both pretty clueless about family life, because I didn’t have one and he had a 1950s one! I genuinely didn’t even realise how bad it was before I wrote this post. I thought I was just unable to cope. He is open to talking about these things and I think he’d do almost anything for an easier life at this point, but quitting his job seems to make him really uneasy so I think there’s going to have to be a lot of compromise. No he doesn’t get any kid free time, I can’t bring myself to do anything with them solo on the weekends. The only thing he started doing was trying to fit a 5k run into his commute if he leaves the house at 5.30, to make sure it didn’t eat into any of our time. It’s just been really hard for both of us, though I’d definitely say more so for me given that I don’t get to swan off and focus on my job and have a fancy steak and drinks every week. Eurgh.

I think a lot of us have been there - the years with under 5s, my main regret is I wish we'd enjoyed them a bit more. I didn't, it was such drudgery. My dh felt exactly the same. It does get easier, honestly, and for now, spend your way out of it. The small years aren't forever and you do want some good memories as a family.

Exactly, and if he times it right, and leaves his job to live on his saved resources, there would be NO child support! No spousal support, no split of pension and assets, no nothing. I guess you have the flat - whose name is the house in?

one of her updates should be a very clear lesson to any woman yet to have kids with her partner: if he isn’t actively countering and challenging the outdated, sexist views of his parents on gender roles, run a mile.

Unfortunately this often doesn’t become clear until children arrive. Many men are perfectly good at doing their fair share of the (relatively light) pre children domestic load. The crunch comes with children, when the domestic load increases massively and doing 50% would interfere with career and require a drop in status and/or pay . At that point many previously egalitarian men will revert to “my career is more important, it pays more” rather than “of course I’ll go down a rung/go part time so I can share the nursery runs, sick days and night wakings equally”. Don’t even get me started on the ones who think their hobby should continue unaffected.

Agree. There are some whose unfitness for procreation is obvious well in advance, but that's the easy bit to spot. It's harder to call the ones who'll do a certain amount, which may well be equitable pre DC, but not step up. I've seen a couple of instances IRL where it was going from 1 to 2 that really put the cards on the table.

I’d tell him I’m quitting work or leaving him, quite honestly.

Keep your financial security OP.
Hire a nappy , get a cleaner and talk to your H about working from home.
Your partner may have grown up in a household of dated role models but that’s not how people live now and he needs to change his attitude.
If he wants to keep his family together he needs to be an active father in his childrens lives

You just need to o to an agency like Imperial nannies and et them to send you their nanny housekeeper candidates - they'll do the housework and laundry and childcare drops or pick ups etc. You'll have a less stressful life and enjoy your children more. Up your hours if need be to afford it but if he can't pay for it his job and hours aren't worth the effort. I once told mine he could stop actin like the chair of ICI until he earned like the chair of ICI - brutal but it worked.

Thanks everyone for your replies and advice. Really nice to have a variety of perspectives to work with! We have agreed the current situation isn’t sustainable and have discussed exit strategies for his job. I’ve contacted a few nanny agencies and will pay for as much help as possible over the next few months as we don’t think his job will be changing imminently, and he’d like to consider an internal move so will need to play his cards right to secure that.

The hardest thing has been finding time to do or think through any of this stuff so being away has been really helpful. E.g. I contacted loads of cleaners over the past month and they either didn’t reply or didn’t turn up, then DS was sick, the “nanny” flaked for 2 weeks running and I nearly exploded. I’ve no idea how to find time to even interview Nannies 🙈 but DH Is going to take a few days off to help and we will get married asap. Conveniently our fake wedding anniversary is coming up so will try and do it then, lol.

& thanks @Therightcoffee , it’s a nice reminder to focus on enjoying this time. They are so adorable and I hate that I’m often too stressed and frazzled to enjoy it. DH organised me a spa morning yesterday and it helped enormously to have some actual time off.

I have earned a 4 week unpaid sabbatical at work (8 weeks once I hit the 10 year mark next year), and with the 4 week parental leave option I’m hoping that I do have some options to take a bit of time out to recoup while we find a solution or the right mix of help that works for us.

thanks again to everyone 🌺

Outsource far more - stop being a martyr. You can't make him be a different person. You have a good employment situation, don't let it go.