To lbecome a SAHM if I don’t want to?

[Yesgojess]

My husband works in finance and works 12 hour days including commuting, and once a week will be out late with clients. The kids (18 months and 3) love him but he’s very much fun dad. I do all the hard graft, everything at home falls to me and I’m trying to hold down a part time senior level professional job that I worked hard for. The thing is I’m just crumbling. I’m burnt out week to week, I do all the meals, drop offs, pick ups, housework, cleaning, organising. He leaves the house before the kids wake up (and they are both up before 6), and then it’s just non stop until they are in bed. If he gets back in time he will stick them in the bath while I clean up downstairs but it’s all just a mad rush and it’s not like he takes over, I’m still just grafting alone all day. He’ll do the dishwasher once a day, make a soup and a few brunches on the weekend and that’s about it. He thinks this counts as being “non-stop” and “doing everything” outside of work. Neither of us ever get any down time. It’s been all go ever since we had our second. Not to mention when he started a new job and I had a 21 month and 8 week old and he said he needed to sleep in a separate room because he had to be on form, while apparently it was fine for me burn out and break down while being made to feel like I was pathetic for not coping.

I’m barely staying on top of my job, it’s impossible to get into the office because the morning juggle is usually so stressful that I’d end up being really late if I went in, added to the stress of being the only one to do pickup if the trains are messed up (which is common). So I stay at home and end up doing a million household jobs and just being stressed out all the time. We had a cleaner who had to leave the country a few months ago and I tried getting a babysitter in to help and she kept flaking, but despite all this think ultimately the issue is I just don’t want to be parenting alone or with paid help and no partner to share the load. It’s just not the same and it’s not what i want. I feel like my own mother who was a single parent and always stressed out doing it all herself. recently I’ve realised that something has to give and I’ve seriously thought about giving up work to stay on top of it all but I just feel so sad about giving up my career to be a skivvy just so my husband’s life can carry on as normal. We’ve talked about all sorts of options but he’s just so intent upon needing a ridiculous amount of financial security at the expense of my mental health. I feel like I just hate him for leaving it all to me and I fantasise about leaving him. Struggling to see what’s best for the kids in all of this because I just want them to have a happy home life with some equality and not a stressed out mom and absent dad. What should I do? Would you quit, give him an ultimatum? Spend all of his money and stop giving a shit? I just don’t know what to do. Things are so bad I’m just crying all the time, still getting support from the peri natal mental health team and just see no sign of things getting any better.

thank you for reading if you’ve got this far. I know it’s a first world problem and people have it so much worse for so many reasons

I feel for you so much, OP. If I were you, I'd rescind your notice and put him on notice that either he gets another job in the next 6 months or you go.

I think the idea of taking a couple of years to enjoy the kids while they're small is a bit of a mirage. My DH and I took a year off with baby twins and a toddler (he had a part-time contract, I focused on the kids). Honestly it was so tough and that was with one and a half of us parenting. Of course there are moments of joy but god, I've never done so much cooking, cleaning, washing, nappies and general drudgery in my life. I felt like my whole horizon had shrunk (thank god we live abroad so I clung to the fact I was at least in an interesting city even if I never got far outside the parks and playgrounds). We rowed, our sleep was shot, I hated having no answer to "what do you do?". We lasted 9 months then he went back to work full-time, I got the kids in school/nursery part-time and set up my own business.

From what you've said, I very much doubt you would be able to really enjoy that time especially if you are doing it solo and with no support, and resentment building. I think the set-up you have, 3 days, is perfect if you can just get the support you need at home. Then you have 4 whole days to enjoy the kids and 3 days at work to escape/ be an adult/ maintain your career.

Your DH comments would give me the absolute rage. You're taking a huge risk if you ditch your career now - you will be jis mother mark 2 in his eyes.

Yes I get that too - I've done stints as a sahp but my dh never wanted to act the martyr for carrying the sole financial burden for a time, disregard my earning potential, and also not appreciate that caring in itself is hard and worthwhile and someone focusing on that benefits the whole family hugely.

3 bad signs and that's why I'd carry on.

Life is full of small embarrassments - just chalk that one up re work, tbh people tend to like people more when they realise they're actually human and not superwoman.

What is your husband’s salary, OP? My DH, BIL and SIL all work in senior finance roles at high salaries – all of them manage reasonable time at home for their kids and spouses.

You might as well be single but the bottom line is, pricks like him have zero interest in contributing at all to parenthood.
They have zero interest at all, and you cannot force them to be at home when they are 100% avoidant.

You can want and wish all you like for him to step up, but until you are prepared to deal with your reality you are just going around in circles.

Your husband is a selfish disgusting prick.

You need to ask for that job back asap.

You need to throw money, irrespective of what it costs, at a full-time nanny, to 100% cover what you simply cannot do alone with a job.

Focus on keeping your job.

You haven't the luxury of choosing to give up with a prick for a husband.

He could leave you at any time and pay bare minimum CM which wouldn't cover nursery fees and you would be left in virtusl poverty.
He would be keeping 90% of his 6 figure salary and there would be absolutely NOTHING you could do about it.

You need to start boxing clever.
Spend family funds on the best childcare to get you through this time.
Take it out of his hands.
Stop discussing it.
He doesn't care.

Giving up your job has handed him all the power.
Take it back today.
Get your job back.

There is no point in threatening him with leaving.
You have NO LEVERAGE in this situation.
If he leaves, you are screwed financially.

You need to bide your time and pay for best childcare so that you can get complete support to work.

You desperately need your job.
Get legal advice the first chance you get so you realise what your situation is financially.

Put his salary into the calculator so you can see what you would receive from him.

He spends so little time with his children he doesn't really have any connection.

He's the type that would be an afternoon EOW.....and there would be nothing you can do about it.

Wishing he was a better man is a waste of time.
He cares only for himself.
He has zero interest in his children.

Thanks everyone. Asking for my job back
today and have given him an ultimatum. I said if he hasn’t found something else by March I’m leaving. He made lots of noises about looking for jobs but actually hasn’t applied for a single one. He just knows I’ll do anything for the kids and he’s exploiting me.

@Didimum can I ask how much is a reasonable amount of time? He gets back right at the end of the day, usually just in time to see the kids and help with bedtime 4 nights a week. He’s recently started going in a whole 20 minutes later (6.20) and leaving 10 minutes earlier because he is pissed off about his bonus. Nothing to do with seeing or helping out with his family, purely financially motivated. He thinks this counts as him doing loads and “everything he possibly can”.

My DH does the school run every morning and is in work at 9-9:30. Same with my SIL. My BIL does very early starts buts WFH 3 days a week. My DH and SIL get home at 6-6:30 on an office day. DH WFH 2 days a week and does school pick up those days, he finishes at 5 on Friday to take one of the kids to a club. BIL used to work away occasionally but that hasn’t resumed with as much frequency since Covid.

Basically they’ve just made these things a non-negotiable and they get their jobs done well.

Most often men like this just simply don’t want to be with their families. They are second priority to them.

Wow, you should walk out, go stay in a hotel for a few days and leave him with the kids, then he'll realise what 'doing loads' really means.

I think the length of commute may be relevant here. If you live further into London / the city he commutes to, he might have a lot more time with you. Which is a trade off, and why COVID-wrought working from home changes have probably done as much for gender equality as equal pay rules did.

Personally I think that help at bedtime 4 nights a week is an acceptable amount for someone with a major (high earning) job to put in. Just! And if you have a night off a week too.
IF they pull their weight when there and don’t just expect everything to be done for them.
I would always rather have / had have evening help than morning!
I know a few men with jobs that aren’t so well paid who also leave home early. For me that’s not a deal breaker.
The key thing is to get the cleaning and cooking (if you are working long hours) and child care help you need in the day so that you aren’t doing all of these too.

Thank you so much for sharing this.

So I don’t have a night off - one night a week he’ll be out with clients, which coincides with my day off so I end up doing 14 hours alone every Thursday. Then he’s even less “help” the following morning, but apparently it’s ok for him to sleep in and go to work a bit late because it’s justified if it’s for clients.

We take turns to lie in on the weekend so I do 6 full mornings alone per week on top of the rest.

And to a point I agree that well paid jobs are likely to expect the hours put in but it’s more the attitude he has towards me and the load I carry. I can barely find time to brush my teeth in the morning because it’s so full on. The kids are 3 and 21 months. DD follows me around crying absolutely everywhere and DS follows with his monster trucks begging me to do a show with him 🫠

I really appreciate what a mug I must sound like when writing it down.

You do sound a bit of a mug, but not in a nasty way, you've just tried to do what's right for your family. At least you're opening your eyes to the reality of the situation now.

Agree it's his attitude and what he says that really stinks - when dh was travelling a lot of weekends / had really poor weekend availability due to work I've had someone come take the children out for 4 hours on a Sunday am etc.

I took the view that I needed to pay for help that I didn't get from the other parent/other family support to keep my sanity and my dh was fully supportive. It paid off for both of us a few years later.

One of the mums I know who has a brilliant career and happy kids had a nanny 6 days a week when they were under 5 so that they both had flex on one weekend day.

The thing is, one exhausted parent doing it all isn't necessarily best for kids.

I was going to follow up with that. The hours aren’t necessarily a problem. It’s that he makes you feel lesser than him. My DH has always outearned me and now he outearns me by A LOT. But he’s always made sure my job comes equal to his as he knows how important it is to me. He does the school runs so I can get in on time. He took 6 months shared parental leave so I could go back and he takes the kids whenever I need to catch up with someone. If something is wrong with me or the kids, the laptop is snapped shut and he’s right next to us.

You absolutely don’t sound like a mug!

What you sound like is Atlas. If Atlas was carrying two small children on his back as well as carrying a man who thinks his salary means he can be a 1950s dad, while you do your job AND all the 1950s non working mum bit at the same time.

If I sound like I think your life and choices are easy / that you are being a mug, then I have chosen all my words very badly.

I got this phase of my kids’ life terribly wrong and learned the hard way. I didn’t expect enough from my husband, I bought his self-serving excuses (let them lie) and over time all of this kindness / softness / putting my husband’s needs first ate into my own financial provision for myself, then my social status and then into my confidence and more. My husband isn’t a nasty man but nor did he prioritise my career, instead he always put his forward.

I know (and know of) many men who work in the City who have had very, very expensive divorces and developed the powers of a forensic accountant in order to hide their salaries, bonuses, benefits etc from their now ex wives. But now that I come to think about it, I can’t think of any men in the working world that really listened to their wives when they needed them to be around / more available to them, shifted their work patterns around and stepped down a notch before the inevitable marriage implosion happened… if anyone has stories of how their husbands in these big status jobs stepped up when they needed to, please share and restore just a little of my faith in the world.

And to the OP - I’d love to know what your husband thinks your career means to you. Does he really think the value is has is in the number of 000s after your salary? Did it matter to him when he met you that you had a career? Would he want his daughter, if you have one, to be able to carve out a working life once she has babies? I suspect he hasn’t thought it through long enough to form any real (non self serving) opinions on it.

He’s also talking about sticking it out for another 2 years until he’s paid off the mortgage

Ha. My banker DH has been saying “just 2 more years” since about 2007….

For an American bank (assume investment banking?) I think your DH’s hours are pretty standard. I don’t think it’s realistic to expect him to do 9-6.30, that’s not how the industry works, there is a reason bankers get paid ££££ and that is partly because they hand over their lives to be available whenever the client says jump.

However - that doesn’t mean you should accept your set up.

1. as pp have said, even if you could accept his hours in return for the money (I’m glad you are married…), his attitude stinks. He ought to be doing whatever he can to be around more, within the confines of his job, and it doesn’t sound like he is. And he ought to be fucking grateful to you for enabling him to do his job, and he should make you feel appreciated and supported - and it doesn’t sound like he is.

2. The hours may be reasonable for this job, but you don’t have to accept that he does this job. You are supposed to be a team both pulling your weight at home. If the hours are too much for him to pull his weight as a husband and father (which they clearly are), and you don’t agree that the money is worth it, then you are absolutely entitled to say the job must change. Sounds like you are trying to get him to move. Can he go back to what he did for 10 years that had (somewhat) more reasonable hours?

Having said that, I must admit I’ve been trying to get DH to change careers ever since he became a banker with zero success (see above…2007…) so I’m not sure why I’m giving this advice. Mind you I never did the “I will leave” ultimatum. I hope you do better than me.

@minipie thank you. I am a bit afraid that he won’t ever end up quitting either and the only one paying the price will be me. I haven’t quite managed to retract my notice yet because I want to make absolutely sure I can cope before I do.
Can I ask if you regretted quitting, and did you go back to work? Did your kids at least benefit a bit, or would you say it wasn’t worth it overall?

Yes I regret quitting. I don’t miss the job I initially quit from but unlike yours mine wasn’t flexible or WFH - it was another big City job with long hours and an hour commute. With hindsight I should have moved to another more flexible job (like yours) instead of quitting.

I did go back to work after several years into a more flexible job (which I was very, very lucky to get tbh) but by then everything at home was so geared around me being at home and doing everything domestic, it was hard going back. DC was acting up at school (she has some SN), I was trying to fit all the admin/childcare around my work, balls got dropped etc. Also my pay was lower after the break (DH’s even higher by then of course 🙄), my level was lower, I didn’t know anyone and it just didn’t seem worth it. I ended up quitting. I do think it would have been better to have stayed in work the whole way through and insisted DH stepped up more, I would’ve been in a better position work wise and home wise.

Did my kids benefit - somewhat yes I think so, but OTOH I don’t like the model they are growing up with, especially as they are both girls. Also they have loved the nannies we’ve had so I’m not sure me being home has been that much better from their POV 😆

I said upthread that if you have a flexible job you like - don’t give it up. I stand by that 100%.

@Yesgojess

As the other ones already pointed out it’s not helping. It’s sharing the load. Children are joint responsibilty,not just mother’s.

Look at your posts and your “D” H’s attitude to you, your(and his) kids and his work. Selfish and arrogant,smacks of expectation and entitlement. Whatever you/his company will do it will never be enough.

It’s a very common theme here.

Please try to retract your notice and organize the childcare. It’s only going to get worse if you become a SAHM.

Lots of women here juggled absolutely everything for years(including their disinterested in family husbands) only to be shafted later by their high achieving husbands. No pension, no career,no money to speak of.

It doesn’t matter what he says. Look at what he does. Actions speak louder than words. He doesn’t care. He treats you like domestic appliance.

Your kids are tiny and at their most difficult age.It will pass though. Routine is the key.

Life’s much more easier without somebody adding and adding to your load and expecting you to carry it alone.

Speaking from experience.I walked away but sadly not before I burned out.

Thank goodness I didn’t listen to XH and MIL’s expectations that I should pack in my job and be SAHM. At least I had some money. Not a lot but money gives you choices and independence.

Good luck 💐

Thanks so much for sharing this, I really appreciate it. I know my job is a no brainer IF I can get some help at home. I do think society is designed to fuck women over if they take any kind of break, though, and it sucks.

I work in a male dominated area with lots of men with sahw and I can count on one hand the nice comments about wives over 25 years, but I've heard plenty of denigrating comments and seen plenty of affairs and divorces.

My dh did change - we had (still too many) miserable years when the kids were small, and at some point he just got it and stopped fighting me, readjusted his priorities and he still manages the job to nearly the same level.

You're not wrong re society - my career isn't epic due to relentlessly putting the dc first and I did take 18 months off but I'm really glad I hung on overall. I still get tempted to quit when the kids are sick/something isn't going well for them and devote myself to them entirely but I remember that it'll cycle round.

If nothing else look at the tax efficiencies - unless you've both maxed out your pensions, much better to have two sizeable pensions than drawing on one.

If nothing else look at the tax efficiencies

Ha this is true- you’ll be keeping a far higher percentage of your £50k than DH is of his six figure earnings. Especially if you can put money in pension and get tax clawback.

Sadly now at the age where our future pensions have become a weekly conversation topic and I wish I'd paid it more mind in my 30s....the pension market is desperately in need of reform.

I hear you. I’m not particularly fussed about having an epic career but I have recently seen a flood of promotions in my peers and it did make me think, I’d be so behind if I ever managed to come back and it’d barely be worth it to juggle school holidays, etc, etc. My MIL went back (very part time in the NHS) after ten years at home and I remember her complaining about all the useless graduates being promoted above her. I was 18 at the time but it makes a lot more sense to me now.

I do put as much as possible into my pension and if nothing else, I get a 5% pay rise each year which would see me through without putting in a fat lot of effort.

also @minipie I really don’t think it’s the worst modelling if you’re honest with your daughters. Unlike my MIL who frequently tells us that folding everyone’s socks was a privilege and an honour and she was soooo lucky that her husband let her do it 🙄

Remember too, some of your peers will fall back at later stages as they career change, or deprioritise work, nearly every man I've ever worked with has leap frogged me to the point where my linkedin network looks amazing as I know a tonne of senior people but jobs are an endurance game and you will still get interesting opportunities if you keep your hand in, as the kids get older.

Yes, my MIL would say similar things and my goodness it is annoying.