To lbecome a SAHM if I don’t want to?

[Yesgojess]

My husband works in finance and works 12 hour days including commuting, and once a week will be out late with clients. The kids (18 months and 3) love him but he’s very much fun dad. I do all the hard graft, everything at home falls to me and I’m trying to hold down a part time senior level professional job that I worked hard for. The thing is I’m just crumbling. I’m burnt out week to week, I do all the meals, drop offs, pick ups, housework, cleaning, organising. He leaves the house before the kids wake up (and they are both up before 6), and then it’s just non stop until they are in bed. If he gets back in time he will stick them in the bath while I clean up downstairs but it’s all just a mad rush and it’s not like he takes over, I’m still just grafting alone all day. He’ll do the dishwasher once a day, make a soup and a few brunches on the weekend and that’s about it. He thinks this counts as being “non-stop” and “doing everything” outside of work. Neither of us ever get any down time. It’s been all go ever since we had our second. Not to mention when he started a new job and I had a 21 month and 8 week old and he said he needed to sleep in a separate room because he had to be on form, while apparently it was fine for me burn out and break down while being made to feel like I was pathetic for not coping.

I’m barely staying on top of my job, it’s impossible to get into the office because the morning juggle is usually so stressful that I’d end up being really late if I went in, added to the stress of being the only one to do pickup if the trains are messed up (which is common). So I stay at home and end up doing a million household jobs and just being stressed out all the time. We had a cleaner who had to leave the country a few months ago and I tried getting a babysitter in to help and she kept flaking, but despite all this think ultimately the issue is I just don’t want to be parenting alone or with paid help and no partner to share the load. It’s just not the same and it’s not what i want. I feel like my own mother who was a single parent and always stressed out doing it all herself. recently I’ve realised that something has to give and I’ve seriously thought about giving up work to stay on top of it all but I just feel so sad about giving up my career to be a skivvy just so my husband’s life can carry on as normal. We’ve talked about all sorts of options but he’s just so intent upon needing a ridiculous amount of financial security at the expense of my mental health. I feel like I just hate him for leaving it all to me and I fantasise about leaving him. Struggling to see what’s best for the kids in all of this because I just want them to have a happy home life with some equality and not a stressed out mom and absent dad. What should I do? Would you quit, give him an ultimatum? Spend all of his money and stop giving a shit? I just don’t know what to do. Things are so bad I’m just crying all the time, still getting support from the peri natal mental health team and just see no sign of things getting any better.

thank you for reading if you’ve got this far. I know it’s a first world problem and people have it so much worse for so many reasons

What a great update! Make some good memories as a family, some untarnished ones.

I agree with minipie you can't really tell - my dh almost seemed to go into responsibility shock when we had each baby and have a massive drive to earn more. It seemed to trigger some sort of biological response to provide more and he became even more mono focused on work. In fact he changed hugely eventually, he realised he couldn't remember a lot of them being small as he was so busy with work, he's an excellent dad now.

What about a nanny? Spend the money you guys have on all things needed to take over the load but it sounds like a nanny would be the biggest help.

@Therightcoffee i can see why some men feel like this. This sounds really stupid but I think we’ve both been in overdrive, waiting for things to get easier and didn’t actually realise that they won’t because this setup won’t ever work. We just kept saying it’ll get easier when DD2 is 9 months, 1 year, when I was back at work and had something else to focus on, etc, etc, forever and ever. Let’s see how it goes x

You're doing better than us, we never took a breath and lurched from one rushed 'solution' to another until the dc hit a crisis and we reset things.

I agree parenting life goes at warp speed, have a second child and you're hanging onto the edge of a Concorde! x

'I can't marry you because I'd have to pay some tax' - how romantic.

You're facilitating him accruing money and pension but currently have no claim on it. That's wrong. I'm sure he's a nice man, but nobody really marries someone they don't think is nice and plenty of relationships end with the nice partner turning out to be not so generous or kind when things have gone pear shaped, a new girlfriend is on the scene etc.

I think a counsellor would get you to look at your underlying values and his - what's important in life. How do you meet in the middle? Financial stability is important but you don't really have that as his job could end any moment, lots of families are perfectly happy on much less, would living on £80k or whatever really be so bad, especially if it was out of London?

I would also make a 5, 10, 15 year plan. What do you want to do, what does he want to do? What will your kids need? Jobs but also travel, learning etc.

And a plan for if he got laid off tomorrow (which let's face it, does happen) how long would it take for him to find another role, would it be the same kind of role, how much money would you need to survive that long?

If he burns out and can't work for a year, what does that do to your family and finances?

Right now you're being taken for granted, all your energy goes on facilitating the life that he wants, not what you want. He's assuming what will make you happy is what made his mother happy. Big no no.

To some extent I think relationships that start in your teens are more likely to have these assumptions as you've sort of slipped from one household to another without breathing space to take scope of all the variety of the world.

One of the main regrets of the dying is having spent too much time at work. Your kids won't be tiny forever. Work to live, not live to work. https://bronnieware.com/blog/regrets-of-the-dying/

In short: fuck his mother and her trouser pressing tips, do what makes you happy.

@Haroldwilson completely agree but let’s face it, there’s nothing romantic about marriage really is there?! The stamp duty was going to be massive so I was in favour of saving some money for the burnout/ redundancy pot. And marriage always was/ is on the cards once we’d decided what to do with the flat. I can’t pretend I didn’t benefit from his career and salary because I did and it enabled me to do a poorly paid job in publishing that I enjoyed.

But yes, things are very different now
with kids. I wouldn’t say he necessarily works because he loves it. He doesn’t enjoy his job, it’s a slog, he doesn’t get down time or ever see friends or anything. He just wants to save up for the apocalypse or whatever catastrophic event he thinks is going to befall us. I absolutely wouldn’t tolerate a partner who took himself off to play golf or left me to it while he did other things. It’s just that this is all he’s ever known since uni, as is my job, so it’s hard to envisage an alternative?!

i am not excusing him leaving it all to me, or his shitty attitude whenever I’ve had a breakdown or needed help or had to drop everything when the kids were sick. It’s been very stressful and i feel like I’ve only just realised how bad and am now filled with rage towards everyone who’s sat by and watched - including me!
i also can’t pretend that I didn’t think I might be happy with his mum’s life… they’ve always been a very outwardly happy family and that’s what I aspired to - turns out it’s not for me, and even if it was 9-5 suburban dentistry doesn’t compare to 6-6 in the city! Even his dad did the school run 🙈

I think if you take some time off consider how you want your life to look. I think this is probably a case of we can’t have it all as it’s to hard. He has a “good” job but is it worth all he is missing out on. I think you need to point this out to him. It could be you both work less and share the juggle more. Even just for a few years. Or you leave until your children are school age and then return. I wouldn’t advise being a sahp for long term as I think financial independence is important. If you carry on working definitely get a nanny from a decent agency. Who can take on some household duties, children’s cleaning, ironing, shopping away etc.

And in case anyone wants to feel a bit of vicarious rage on my behalf. His dad recently messaged him to say that I was clearly disturbed (I politely lost my rag when they took the kids for an ice cream immediately before coming back for a dinner that I was making), and that they were worried about his mental health having to juggle work and me……..

This is such a sad read. Can’t believe you call it a first world problem: it feels like you don’t feel entitled to be miserable in this miserable situation. I don’t think I could make peace with my partner caring so little about my wellbeing. this isn’t your problem to solve alone.
on a practical level, a good nanny will help so much, in that you will be able to share some of the mental load as well as the actual work of the family. Ours is an older woman and like a second mum to me/granny to the kids.
But it’s a sticking plaster if your husband doesn’t want you to be happy and okay. Nothing can fix that.

Just on the tax point. You get a tax free inheritance if you're married that doesn't apply to unmarried couples.

If he went under a bus tomorrow, I imagine he'd leave you a large sum/half a house - would inheritance tax be larger than capital gains?

In the long game, you're facilitating him working and presumably having a whacking great pension etc that you're not currently entitled to claim if you split. So to save £20k or whatever capital gains, you'd miss out on say £500k pension.

I do think there's a bit of romance in marriage. You're pledging to stay together.

His family sounds toxic. I can't imagine messaging someone to say their partner is deranged or whatever. You're trapped in this situation where you're not happy but he and his family are kind of gaslighting you, saying you should be happy and it's wrong that you're not.

If you're not happy, he should care.

Yes gaslighting is definitely the word.
i am handsomely protected if he dies. He has a will and some ludicrous life insurance at work that I’m in line for. I would genuinely be set for life. We thought we’d covered all bases in terms of not being married because we hadn’t ever considered a split..

We thought we’d covered all bases in terms of not being married because we hadn’t ever considered a split..

Sorry but that is very naive - just look at the statistics. Nobody ever expects to split,
every couple is happy, until things go wrong.

It sounds like all your financial planning has been done jointly. This is fine for most purposes. But remember, he doesn’t have to worry about what would happen in the event of a split because he’d be absolutely fine financially. You on the other hand should definitely be considering this and ensuring you are protected. First and main step is marriage. Glad it is in the plan.

Imagine if, say, you had a moment of madness and cheated on him and he was mad as hell. Or if in 15 years he has a midlife crisis and decides he wants to pursue a rock and roll career. Etc. He could change his life insurance and will, right?

I'm not saying marry him as it sounds like you need to work out if your future is truly together.

I am saying that marriage gives you legal rights and entitlements, whereas cohabitation gives you security that's at the discretion of one partner. If the relationship blows up, things can change rapidly.

The saddest threads on here are women in their 50s or so, unmarried sahms for a few decades, relationship breaks up and partner plays hardball, they can't get a job and haven't even paid pension contributions, kids leaving home, basically a bleak scene.

I'm not saying that's you. But things change over time and relying on goodwill can backfire.

Yep. Wills and life insurance are great, and people should have them. But they can be changed without the beneficiary even knowing, much less giving permission.

Get a nanny/housekeeper or both.

His big job can pay for it.

If you can do hybrid working and the children will let you if they're at home with a nanny (some of the time. Lots of activities she can take them to) then you won't have the stress of a commute.
The nanny can sort out their meals and a housekeeper could prepare yours plus all sorts of other household tasks

You could end up with the best of both worlds if you can pay for it

Then you might find breathing space for a proper 'come to Jesus' talk with your husband

I am a bit befuddled

Are you married or not?

If not - get that sorted too!

Of course there is quite a bit romantic about marriage. It is symbolic of your love and commitment. You are much more financially protected as well.

Re his mum's life. She's talking late 80s, early 90s right?

I often wonder if you went back in time, what that mother would have said then if offered the chance to have a career. Much harder and more expensive to find childcare and an understanding employer then. Much more social disapproval of women who didn't stay home at least until kids in primary school.

Women made the best of it and I'm sure they found the upsides, lots would have genuinely chosen it but lots also got trapped in it through lack of choice.

Sometimes older female relatives talk about how it was in their day and it sounds isolating - walking everywhere, having to schlep round shops with toddlers, husbands out at pub or hobbies or work socials, women expected to do everything at home forever, even post man retiring. There's a reason why people used to gobble up the valium.

@Haroldwilson yes I’m sure that’s true, but honestly that’s not her. not to mention I’m his peer and none of our friends were raised like that. Birmingham is very working class.
She’s insufferable. She has said for years that women shouldn’t have kids if they plan on working afterwards, that nurseries are awful, families with Nannies are awful. She has no idea about the value of money, the privilege of her position and that some people actually have to work. I’ve seen it pain her to keep her trap shut since me and SIL both went back to work post-kids, but my SIL had the sense to drag her husband to Australia so she doesn’t have to deal with the judgement directly anymore. DHs older brother also moved to Australia so what does that tell you about her wonderful parenting? Leaving us with the only grandchildren in the country which is a melting pot of pressure (they don’t want to help, just to come down and for us to host them). His dad came down 4 weeks post EMCS and asked me what was for breakfast…. In these cases I just sit back and let DH cater for them as I refuse to, which only plays into their vision of me being lazy and him being overworked. On it goes.
Anyway I guess that’s where a lot of the pressure has come from for me to do it all.
that said, my partner has stood up to them and had some very difficult conversations which have led nowhere as they’re so up their own arses they don’t care what he thinks or feels. I’m clearly quite naive as we were very happy together and I didn’t see any of this until I had my second.

Just to balance the perspective, to his credit he is very hands on with the kids. We actually shared parental leave with DS1 and he did pretty much everything for those 3 months.
Then when he was jobless for 7 months he did it all while I worked full time before DD2 came along. DS was only ever in nursery for 2 days a week until recently because I had them so close together. So I think part of my rage comes from knowing that if he didn’t work so much he would be helpful. He’s not selfish in that sense?

He needs to change jobs bur realistically you've got a bigger problem...

He's scoffing at you. When you are drowning he is scoffing at you.

All the cleaners and nannies in the world cannot fix this.

You need to tell him he reduced his hours and takes on his share of parenting or you are leaving. And then he'll have to do 50% of the parenting then, alone, whether he likes it or not.

Tbh this might be the best plan as im sorry but your relationship is doomed. Its not a partnership now and probably never will be. He doesn't seem to care that you, is wife, is drowning.

But you can try with the ultimatum. In the mean time, until he reduces his hours, do the bare minimum. He does his own washing. Don't put the kids to bed, let them run around until he does it. Don't clean up their toys. Don't hoover.

What I don't get is what his end goal is.

You said his job won't last forever and he'll need to retrain. So he's putting all this effort in knowing it'll eventually flop? I know he's earning mega bucks but how much money is enough? If you pay off the mortgage do you get another one to buy a bigger house?

I don't think he sounds irretrievably awful, but he needs a kick up the arse. You haven't agreed to this life. If you split he'll be a sad banker eating supernoodles and seeing the kids at the weekend. It's not worth sacrificing happiness for the sake of being slightly richer.

You could try writing out what each of you does in the week, and a list of all the mental load you each have on top of work stuff. Then compare.

Yep and we have had all of these discussions and we are working on what we can change…
i think his main goal was to pay off the mortgage before his job ends. He always talked about becoming a teacher after that so it was just a case of riding the gravy train. But now we’ve realised it can’t go on we will figure out a way to make things easier for everyone (mainly me!)

It's quite unusual to pay off your mortgage in your 30s! Presumably you could also live mortgage free by downsizing/relocating, if that's a key goal?

Teaching is also long hours and stress but without the money!

I’m well aware - it’s completely bonkers... his ambitions are mental. We went to a grammar school and have lots of very successful friends, quite a few bankers too. We are the first to have children though which is another thing that’s made it hard I think! One of our banker friends lives in Brum and commutes to London every day… they’ve just had a baby and his wife is tearing her hair out. So I think they’ll all experience it eventually. The thing is most of my friends have encouraged me to quit which is why I’ve valued the opinions on here.

and yes that’s definitely an option. We renovated and love where we live but it’s not worth my mental health by any stretch. But my job is also based in London, I’m not sure either of us want to move back “home”, but I think being closer to my real friends (and not just mum friends) would have saved my sanity. There’s just so much to think about and no time to do it really