Husband is done with UK

[Prendo]

Met husband 7 years ago. He's from another country and came before Brexit to study and get work opportunities he couldn't in his own country.

Over past few years we've done well, improved careers, bought house, had DC. He was always not a big fan of UK climate and aspects of culture but figured it would improve with time and getting more established/ settled here.

We bought our house post lockdown moving from overcrowded urban area to nicer quieter countryside town and thought this would be positive change after feeling caged in concrete during lockdown. However, it's been hard to make friends, no family nearby (although mine visit every 6 weeks from 4 hours away) and neither of us are super extrovert with making friends so not the fairy tale we imagined. I was optimistic we could still make the best of it and keep trying but I feel like his mind is made up and he's done.

Long story short, 2.5 years on from move and one year post DC, he's not happy and ultimately wants to leave UK for a sunnier EU country, ideally with us as doesn't want to break family up but accepts it could be without us. I feel like this has been brewing for a while, I do wish he'd been more honest earlier rather than post mortgage and DC. Maybe I was ignoring signs too but we did make the plans with the best of intentions.

He's an EU citizen, so is DC (but born in UK) so in theory I can join them as spouse if we were to move. However, I'm reluctant to up sticks and start from scratch and possibly end up in similar predicament elsewhere- I don't have the appetite for it at nearly 40 and grass not always greener (I haved lived in EU previously in 20s for a year). I thought we'd built something here but it just feels like it was for nothing. Plus once his settled status in the UK expires after two years, we can't return to the UK unless we fork out thousands for spouse visas so if my parents got ill a few years down line etc, I'd struggle to help.

I feel like I'm basically faced with being a single mother in UK or exiled from UK in an EU country far from family. He's not giving me that kind of ultimatum or anything yet - he seems to want to muddle on a bit longer and see how it goes. But I feel like the writing is on the wall and I'm not one to faff around, I like ro make a plan and know where I stand.

Sat here crying trying to think of solutions/ what to do. We do love each other, he's a good man/ dad but I have the self respect not to beg/ plead him to stay if he doesn't want to be in country anymore.

I hope you'll be kind in your replies, thank you

We are 2 years post the decision now, and he has taken some steps to "own" his own happiness since - he was very much depending on me to "make" him happy and this made him realised there was only so far I would go. He changed job to something that suits him better, got more into a hobby. We have also spent more holiday time in his country.

He has settled to the idea of staying now, and talks more about maybe having a part time home out there for retirement, which I'm on board with.

I'm not saying he will never have this notion again, but he very much knows what the decision would mean if he does, and he knows himself well enough now to know that he doesn't see himself starting a new life alone. Going quite close to that being his decision at one point, and really thinking through what his day to day life would be, took the shine off the idea, and he stopped romanticising it

Can you try to buy a flat or timeshare in that country and spend every school holiday there?

If its a Southern European country isn't the extremes of heat from climate change a consideration? No-one dies in grey and drizzle.......

I was going to suggest this. Could you get a bolt hole and go out all summer hols, and then he could go out ad hoc through the winter? Depends if he can WFH.

This is very tough, but I’ve been in your DH’s position and if you have no nostalgic childhood connection to miserable weather and general cultural insularity / unfriendliness / extreme difficulty of meeting new people / insane slowness of progressing friendships beyond the superficial, it’s hard to see why anyone would choose to live here. I’d give it a go in a sunny country, for a year or 2, and see how you feel. You might discover a whole new capacity for happiness when you have the sun on your skin every so often.

It's difficult if you love him and you want to keep your family together. I assume you have family, friend and a full life here. Is it not possible to spend a long chunk of the winter in whatever country it is you are talking about? Or does work stop that being an option?

For me a lot would depend on what country you are talking about. It could be a lovely adventure for both you and your children.

I understand him not wanting a British passport. He's not British but has his own identity.

No easy solution as one of you is going to be unhappy sadly.

I’m not exactly in your position, but I’ve lived in southern Europe for 4 years. I love it, the kids are almost fluent, and it’s been a good move. Him not obtaining a British Passport, which would effectively close the door on you all returning as a family would bother me. A lot.

@BMW6 makes sense. We cannot stay during the summer. We’re gone for 2 months of the year.

I also factored my parents’ needing me into my decisions.
Their need lasted 30 years.
I wish some wise old woman had told me to
put my immediate family unit first and that they would always need me.
Hindsight is wonderful. You have a lot on your plate. please don’t burden yourself with choices on your parents’ behalf until you reach at least 50.

I think this has been a slow realisation, I really don’t think he wasn’t honest earlier. I get you though. We moved to my DH’s country for 4 years. I didn’t want to go, but he had a point about the DC getting to know his side of the family, living in that country & culture and knowing their heritage.

The DC decided they preferred England and started saying they wanted to “go home” and so we all came back :) DC slotted back in nicely and all is good.

DH also had his eyes opened to the fact his home country had also gotten worse in the time being, e.g crime was a lot worse and it’s one thing to live there as an adult and another to think of your DC growing up in that.

As it is, I am glad we went because otherwise he would have gotten resentful and built up this huge fantasy in his head of life there.

I started a similar thread earlier this evening, about considering leaving the UK (as someone not from the UK but who is long term settled here). It does feel different and TBH quite depressing. I just have a sense of hopelessness about life here and it feels such a struggle to have a decent standard of living. It's not an easy decision for anybody but I really feel for you having to consider the needs of your children in this too, and knowing any moves you make may become permanent if you can't move them back. I don't know what to advise really, but you will be amazed how much better the quality of life is in many European places than in the UK now.

You say he wants to go to southern Europe - so Spain, Portugal, italy, Greece? But those countries ae mostly facing big, big problems with very hot summers, forest fires now every year, water restrictions and illegal mass migration. Even in South of France I understand new private pools are not allowed and water for them costs a fortune (eg the Var) etc.

I am from a Southern European country. Spain/Italy/Greece are great for vacation but living there is a nightmare.

Mind you ex husband and me moved to a Northern EU country after Brexit. We are both still UK citizens though. To cut the long story short do not move out of the UK. It’s an amazing country and even after Brexit has more to offer than the richest EU country. And I am saying this being a remainer. I miss it terribly and I plan to come back within the next year.

lol. The UK has really long NHS waiting lists.

Teachers leaving in droves.

Potholes everywhere.

Train service costs a fortune and is shit.

It really really doesn't have more to offer than the richest EU country. What twaddle.

Yes but @Slavica both parents don't want the U.K. so it's a real conundrum.

Come and live in the “richest EU country” and then let’s discuss:

1. efficiency
2. organisation
3. cost of life
4. racism
5. integration

Still 200 behind the UK even after Brexit.

This is similar to my situation. I was the one staying and regret it because it took a toll on my mental health and marriage. Finally I am leaving soon and also divorcing. The culture and the weather are very hard for people who grew up in sunnier places but also it is so difficult to have meaningful connections. We are just very different and less reserved. I find the whole socialising thing here very hard work.To this date I know my kids were affected by my unhappiness but who knows the extend of it. They want to leave too as they love to be in a better place in terms of weather and got to experience this a lot on holidays. I basically escape as often as I can and my husband does not come with us anymore. It is expensive and not ideal. We also feel where we are is like another country after Brexit. I feel for your family and hope is better for yours but for us love was not enough everything broke and the love for my husband died out. I feel he was selfish to want to stay here when I was so miserable. 🙁 In our case he knew from the beginning I wanted to move asap but somehow got into a trap and many years later wish I hadn’t marry him.

He is willing to abandon his child because he doesn’t like the place he lives. Tell him to get some mental health treatment or to get the hell out of the house. Do not uproot your life for someone who would do something so despicable.

you also have to consider that moving means your rights to residence and work are linked to your marriage and your child. You would be putting yourself in a precarious position for a relationship that clearly isn’t solid. The risk is far too great.

It is an absolutely huge, MASSIVE deal if they make the move, the OP tries her best but ultimately is miserable, but by that point the DC are habitually resident in the new country and the DH refuses to let them leave with her and return to the UK.

I feel for the DH because quite frankly I find living in the UK incredibly depressing.

Although the fact that the DH is considering leaving his children behind in order to follow his dreams doesn't paint him in a very good light. Men tend not to get trapped in these scenarios because they are often willing to sacrifice their children for their own happiness.

It is tough moving to Britain from elsewhere. I miss my home country's culture and weather and I miss my relatives desperately. I would love for them to be just a short (10miles) drive away for an easy, quick visit and for more regular contact.
But having moved to my DH's country, I could not conceive of imposing that existence on my DH so I can imagine your DH's despair.
Now recently widowed, I feel keenly that I am maintaining relationships with his family but my children are lukewarm with them at best and simultaneously not building closer links with my relatives. Since my DDs are teens, I don't feel I can uproot them. They need to finish their education.

As a dual citizen myself, I agree with PPs that he should complete his UK citizenship and acquire a UK passport, especially since he already can. When I did it, mostly it was providing paperwork and repeated lashings of cash until it was finally done.

I think that if he wants everyone to move to his home country he should be willing to complete his citizenship in your and your children's so that you all have options. Are your children citizens of his country? How would that work? Could you become a citizen of his country?

[I understand his reluctance. I was happy enough to become a UK citizen and swear allegiance to the (late) queen but I very much resented the implication at the ceremony that UK citizenship was an amazing improvement over being a citizen of my original country. I did not feel 'grateful' and I was insulted that it seemed I was meant to.]

I think this is a little harsh. He is sort of in an impossible position. If he speaks too soon then he hasn’t given it a try. If he leaves it too late then that’s also wrong.

I think a lot of EU citizens have left the UK post Brexit, and there are quite high levels of disgust amongst those who have stayed - perhaps like your husband because they have children who anchor them there. The U.K. isn’t what it was in the post-Brexit world. He’s actually right!

I think his crisis is absolutely normal for long term emigrants. I’ve certainly experienced it, and I think compassion would go a long way. Is his language spoken in the house, and the culture celebrated? Do you all as a family visit his country during school holidays, can your children talk to their grandparents?

I also wonder if he is “just” depressed and blaming the UK is the displacement activity.
You know, it’s actually hard to accept you’re never going to live in your home country again- especially if you feel you have downgraded, and maybe can’t go back. Regardless of what you want.

OP he just doesn't sound like you want to do it and it is completely understandable as it seems the move would benefit him, rather than the whole family.

Countries in Southern Europe are already extremely hot in the summer and it is likely that it will get even hotter so it is a factor as well when considering a move.

Yes, we get a fair amount of rain but there are also places in the UK where you can get some decent weather. I live in small seaside town in the SE and we have some good weather up to today (I was swimming in the sea and enjoying the beach yesterday...).

So maybe there is a compromise about moving to a location in the UK where you feel less isolated and have some better weather.

Or maybe if finance permit you could buy a holiday flat there and live part of the year in that country.

But don't feel like you have to move if everything is telling you that it is not the right thing for you.

On the passport, aren’t Dutch people only allowed one? Or has that changed? Maybe it’s true for other countries too.

Difficult situation. My DH and I met and married when we were both living in a third country. We mutually agreed to come back to the UK before starting a family but dh has never liked it here. In the beginning, we both thought that it was just culture shock and getting used to a new environment. Then we had dd and we assumed it was all about adapting to being parents. It took us a good few years before we were both ready to admit that he just doesn't like the UK very much. And I can completely understand his reasons, but it's different for me because it's home.

By the time we both realised that things weren't going to change, we faced the question of whether we were going to uproot dd from everything that she knew and from the grandparents who adored her to go back to the country where we originally met, or another third country, with no family connections in either. (We ruled out going to DH's country fairly early on.)

We talked it through at great length and decided that it was best to stay where we were. Dh wouldn't have dreamt of leaving us, though the compromise is that he does travel for extended periods for work. I think he would have gone insane otherwise!

More than 20 years since moving here, he still doesn't like it but I think he is resigned to it now. We'll probably spend a bit more time abroad when we're retired, but for the time being, this is where we are. I hope that you can find some sort of resolution for your family, even if it isn't the perfect solution for everyone.

We speak his language at home, I've spoken his language for over 20 years.

@Christl78 I do live in one of the richest EU countries.