Am I being entitled or is this a red flag?

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Sorry it's long, wanted to include all important details.

Partner (of over a year, no kids or shared finances atm) has a business trip to Asia and was thinking of extended it for a week and having a holiday. Invited me. This would use up the rest of our annual leave this year so last chance for holiday just us. I've never been to this country and he's never explored it properly but been for business and goes usually annually.

He will get business class flights paid for. He'd obviously have to pay for hotels and everything extra over there after the trip ends.

I can't afford the direct flights there and back (in economy basic) although family have suggested they could help as they think it's a great opportunity to go to this country.

Partner said they would pay for the hotel (which they'd be paying for anyway as they said they'd be extending their trip anyway with or without me originally).

There are indirect flights which I could afford in economy on an airline with poor reviews and changing in China. I'm not keen on these flights and a bit anxious about flying alone anyway let alone changing in China etc...

Partner feels like it's entitled that I have suggested maybe he could contribute additionally to the flights so I could come on the direct ones (and get same plane home as him). He says he cant afford this (although no figures have been discussed so he has no idea if I would need £200 contribution or £500). He is high earner and earns approx 4 or 5 times more than me. He does have building work he is spending money on though- but nothing that couldn't wait in my opinion if he genuinely can't afford it (cosmetic items). Different interpretations here on if he could "afford" it I guess and what he is choosing to prioritise. I have also suggested he could let me use some of his airmiles to reduce my flight cost. He did agree to this when pressed but as we've been arguing nothing proactive has happened about this as now he's decided if I can't afford to go then and the trip is causing an issue then he'll just cancel and won't go.

His suggestion is that as a "compromise" he'll cancel the extension to the trip, spend a few days annual leave on the building work and then we can go away somewhere cheaper in line with my "budget".

I feel like he should want me to go on this trip with him, it's a great opportunity to do this in a cheaper way and we need a holiday together.. I'm also annoyed that if we don't go then he won't just keep the full week's holiday so we could do something else for a full week's holiday that is cheaper (although my preference would be to make Asia work).

I should add that he recently changed it from being he'd pay for the accommodation only to I wouldn't have to pay for anything there.. but then in the next discussion he'd decided that he was cancelling the trip! Obviously if I had to pay for my whole flight and he was paying for everything over there then I'd accept the money from my family and make that work but it seems that offer has been rescinded.

As an aside, I've made comments about being concerned about the future if we were to have kids and how it might work on maternity leave as I don't want to be with someone who'd be like "well you can only afford x and I want to do y and we need to both pay evenly" etc and he said that was spiteful and it wouldn't be like that etc but if we were a family unit the finances would be pooled.

I think this is much bigger than the Asia trip and is really about the fact that you are making life decisions on the basis that you are "in it together" (staying in his house to be there while work happens although this creates a commute for you, for instance) and he is not. You are quite right to be thinking carefully about how things would work if you were to have children with this man but what isn't clear, probably deliberately on his part, is, from his POV - are you not in it together YET, or does he intend to increasingly merge lives with you where it suits him, and not when it doesn't?

At this point, in your shoes, I would walk away from the Asia trip, book an altnernative week with a good friend that you know will be a good time, move back to your own place and say that you need to take stock. It's fine for him not to want to pay but it's fine for you to think maybe he doesn't think of you as a partner. And if he doesn't now, when will he?
Maybe there is an answer to that. Maybe he wants to marry you when you qualify in whatever you are studying for (hedging his bets vis a vis your future earning potential - very careful, how do we feel about that?) Maybe he never wants to marry you as he will keep everything if you split. Who knows. The time to find out is now.

Have a good holiday, one you really enjoy, and have a good think. I think this guy sounds difficult, selfish, over careful / over strategic seeing you as a potential drain on his resources rather than his partner in everything, and no fun

So, he was paying for the accommodation, then you wanted him to pay for your flights (partially), and I'm guessing you'd have no spending money either. Sorry, but you are the red flag here. You want a holiday to Asia, but you can't afford it. You talk about marriage and kids, but it doesn't sound like you are financially stable enough for any of that, given the huge costs involved. Flights to Asia are cheap, FAR cheaper than a wedding and the cost of children. I would be very concerned about that, if I was him!

I would be careful with him. It sounds like you both want children together soon so I don’t think you are being entitled as you are expecting at this point for there to be more of a team effort with finances.

I would think long and hard about whether he will really be combining finances and support you if you were to have a child with him as he seems to not be in that mindset at all at the moment and it’s difficult to see when that would switch for him?

If he earns much more than you but doesn’t want to put his hand in his pocket at all it’s a red flag for you being left skint on maternity leave while he’s sat on all his money. So no I don’t think you are being entitled as clearly this is a serious relationship for you both if you are talking about kids x

what @Blondiebeachbabe , how much money do you need as an individual to get married and have kids? Where is the cut off as far as you are concerned? If you are say, a nurse, earning 29k and paying high rent and have never saved, are you allowed to consider it if your potential husband earns 150k and owns a house outright, or must you personally independently be ready for anything before you take that step?

The point of marriage is that the child has TWO parents

I think he’s shown what he is willing to offer . It doesn’t get any better , I would end the relationship .

I agree @Flextime

The thing is when you get into a pattern like this you can spend a lot of time hoping that things will get better and not even realise after a while it doesn't have to be like this. You don't necessarily keep having to prove yourself and earn your keep - but while you are doing it, it can seem "fair" because you came in as an individual and were prepared to take care of yourself as an individual. One day you look up and you realise you are ALWAYS on probation and it will never end. Don't waste too much time before the looking-up moment

If he is broken hearted and tries to win you back, he might realised he fucked up. He might look around at the couples he knows with loving adult relationships and realise he wants that, and realise that they don't get that by penny pinching. He might change his mindset and offer to have you fully in his life for good on terms of trust and openness.
I wouldn't hold my breath though

A lot of people giving Op a hard time over this, accusing her of being a sponger, but if you just read her contributions it gives a different picture. Op has paid for trips, and used vouchers belonging to her for both of them. The sum we're talking about for her to join her so-called partner isn't huge when you consider that he's a high earner. There are also enough red flags in the relationship to suggest that Op should be very careful before having kids with this bloke, or going forward living together rather than having the commitment of marriage. I bet he's not keen on marrying, because he'll already be totting up how much money he'd 'lose' if they divorce.

He doesn't sound like he has a generous spirit or that he particularly values you. So what if his paving stones and new sofa were slightly delayed? I am very sorry but he sound like a thoroughly unpleasant miser and having children with him would be a nightmare. My husband and I have paid for various things together over the years and we're not keeping track. I would be inclined to end it in your cirumstances.

Do you think its significant that he's in his forties and has never married (I assume) and had children before now? Is it because the previous candidates who got to know him left because he was a penny pinching scrooge? They can't all have been gold diggers. I am rather wondering what his relationship with his parent was like. I tended to avoid men who had unresolved issues with their parents and especially their mothers which may have been unfair to men with dreadful parents. However, in terms of how I was treated I was prepared to take the point. I married a man who got on well with his parents and especially his mother. That was over 30 year ago.

We had children because I wanted them. Your boyfriend won't stump up some money for a a plane ticket. Does that make you think?

Most people I know who take a partner for a holiday at the end of a business trip swap their business class tickets for two economy tickets. In agreement with their employer.

doesn’t sound like he’s prepared to shift much to accommodate you!

my DH funded lots for me when we were younger (though we see it as paying to do stuff together!) and I was studying a professional qualification. ….. he’s now reaping his rewards!! 😂

I'm afraid it does sound a little entitled OP.

If you're not living together and aren't yet at the stage where you have shared finances, you can't expect him to pay for you.

This doesn't mean things won't change if you get married/live together.

It would be good to find out for sure though so you don't get any shocks.

Now that I've read the update, it seems there are some warning signs that you shouldn't ignore.

Don't stay with someone who feels the need to punish you.

You’re not in the same place when it comes to the relationship.
I do think it unreasonable for you to expect him to contribute to your flights on the basis that you think he can afford it. However, he did not approach discussions about the holiday as a ‘we’ question — as in, it’s a great opportunity: how can we achieve it? He presented one solution, albeit in the form of an invitation, and when that didn’t work for you he presented another solution, which was to cancel the trip. But then you also presented only one solution — which was for him to contribute to your flight. This is not how functioning couples act. You lay out the challenges and discuss between you how they can be overcome.
I’m not saying the relationship is dead, but you both need more practice in communication and joint problem-solving before you can even start to think about children.
fwiw, my DH and I still have separate bank accounts after decades together. But we discuss finances as a joint project.

I'm a higher earner (and female) and TBH, I would have reacted similarly to your DP. He made a generous offer which already significantly subsidised you and you still couldn't afford to come along. He then offered the alternative of having a cheaper holiday together at another time and you turned your nose up at this as you wanted the more luxury experience and you "need" a holiday.

One of the reasons why I have savings is because I haven't had a holiday in forever. I don't think anyone "needs" a holiday abroad, especially if they can't afford it. Your attitude would be sending off alarm bells for me. You don't "need" expensive things when your budget can't support it.

I think part of the problem is you want to escalate your relationship so you can try for a baby, so you think he should effectively be treating you as if you're married rather than just boyfriend/girlfriend. But even though fertility reasons say you should commit quickly, you cannot rush feelings. It might make sense pooling finances when you're on mat leave, but you're not even pregnant, so again, you're trying to escalate the timeline for something and that feels offputting.

It takes time to feel comfortable that you're not being used financially. I'm actually very generous financially but I would be cautious with a new partner of only around a year or so. I would have been planning to treat you to nice meals out etc when on holiday, but your 'you must pay for my ticket AND my accommodation!' reaction would have put me off altogether.

I think you're just both in different places right now, TBH. If having a baby is important to you and you're worried about your fertility... I'd strongly consider ending this to find someone else with more similar attitudes. I worry when you want to start trying, he will have changed his mind and want to delay things. And that won't have been him stringing you along, that will be putting a pin in things due to all the red flags you've raised and his friends have warned him to stop and reflect on.

OP I don't think either of you is right/wrong but I think especially at this age you're possibly looking for things to be more commited than they are after a year. I think if you're genuinely in this for the long run and looking at marriage/living together/kids then it's not about being entitled or 'grabby' You should want to share nice experiences and if one of you earns significantly more than the other then absolutely they foot more of the bill.

As pp have said what happens if you get married and want to go on a honeymoon? What happens if you have kids and you need money for clothes/clubs/school trip? You shouldn't expect to be treated like a 'princess' and sit on your bottom and demand expensive gifts whilst he works his butt off but it really doesn't sound as if this is the case. There is a fine line between you being entitled and him being mean and controlling.

I would decline the trip. Tbh it doesn't sound like he's really gifting you the hotel even as he would surely have to stay in one anyway. If he's being that mean about a comparatively small cost of funding better flights then can you really trust him to adequately fund a decent trip whilst you're out there? A foreign country with presumably very different culture to our own and that you presumably aren't familiar with is really not somewhere you want to end up if there's doubt about how you're going to financially support yourself whilst there. Is it really worth the hassle or risk? I think you then really need to talk about where things are heading though when prince charming returns and don't let him gaslight you into thinking you're being a gold digger. I don't get that vibe from your posts tbh

I think you should cut your losses here and move on. I don't know who is right and who is wrong in all this but if a possible holiday/£300 outlay is causing so much contention so early in the relationship it's an indicator of deep rooted differences in values and attitudes. That doesn't bode well for a lifetime together or for parenthood.

What I don't like OP and what I think is definitely a red flag is the way he chooses to talk about things with you.

You should be able to have an adult conversation, and if it doesn't work for him he should say that rather than saying 'well I'm just going to cancel then' without working towards a compromise. It's not good in relationships if people can't talk things through. It's not about giving in, it's about listening to each other's concerns. I also don't like him calling you names (you're being spiteful) rather than saying that he feels it's unfair to extrapolate that to maternity leave, which might be a fair point. When you have kids and you can feel under pressure, you need to still be kind to each other and I don't think this man sounds like a good option for that.

I also think it's clearer from your other posts rather than the OP that you have treated him in the past and so it's not so much that you are always expecting him to cough up which is what a lot of posters seem to have concluded, and tbf your OP sounded a bit like that.

if you can’t afford it don’t go OP. I can’t tell from this how the rest of the relationship is but I think until you’re on a more long term basis you just have to cut your coat according to your cloth

Get a 0% credit card and put the flight on it.

You are not married yet and you are still defining future financial arrangements.

Mentioning ‘family money’ at your age in this context is very immature too.

In your posts you also come across as manipulative, entitled and self serving.

You are an adult. If it is a once in a lifetime holiday get yourself a 0% credit card and pay for the experience.

Mate he’s your boyfriend. You don’t live together or share finances, so no you’re not entitled to him paying for you to go on holiday. 😂

I find this so bizarre.

"Only" a year? A year is a committed relationship in my book. And if I earned 4-5 times more (btw what is your reluctance to share the numbers?) I couldn't in good conscience allow my boyfriend to get the cheapest most exhausting flights - especially for a week's holiday. Nearly two days travel each way isn't worth it.

Of course he has no obligation to do this. It's his money. But I'm really struggling with this mentality that is so prevalent that even if incomes are vastly different, the wealthier person shouldn't consider lightening the financial load for things like this. I mean, presumably he quite likes OP and actively wants to spend time with her?

I think it’s absolutely fine to have standards/expectations of what you want in a partner. Plenty of men in this situation would have purchased your flight for you, as a romantic gesture. It’s okay if this is the kind of relationship you want and it’s really not up to anyone on mumsnet to tell you you’re being entitled. Based on some of the threads here with women being asked to transfer their boyfriend’s £3 for a coffee it could be argued that the average expectation for romance should be increased!

Maybe you just need to find someone who is able to meet your expectations for paid travel etc - this might come with its own baggage though just be warned! Often more financially egalitarian partners are better partners and the romantic “I’ve booked you a first class ticket” types, who often turn out to be massive philanderers in the end.

Regarding your issue about what he would be like on mat leave etc. I would gently point out that if you can’t afford a flight and he’s only earning 4-5 X as much as you, I’m guessing he’s not actually very wealthy - eg if you’re on 30k and he’s on 120k, 120k isn’t really a high enough income to be buying business class flights for other people.

So it is probably that your expectations for financial generosity are not realistic for his level of income rather than a reflection of what he would be like once finances were pooled or how supportive he would be once you’re parents etc.

Hi OP
You seem to suggest that your OH doesn't feel that you are managing your money wisely and so is reticent to take up the slack.
You live together now in his house but you say you don't share finances. Is there an agreement that you split bills/ groceries. There will be an increase in bills with you living there. Do you pay your way in that regard? Does he feel that he is already subsidising you?
If you have moved in together as a permanent arrangement why are you wasting money paying for an empty property? Properties deteriorate if they are left empty (also attract a 200% council tax charge after a year here). Does he maybe think that you should be renting your property out and making it work for you?
If you both want to live together and progress your relationship why would you choose to live in a building site when there is another property that reduces your commute and so would reduce your working day and travel costs?
When you decided to move in together did you not sit down and discuss all the details and expectations? Did you move in by stealth, going home less and less? It just doesn't make sense that two successful adults would make a huge life decision without discussing the differences in income and the difficulty it would bring.

Not entitled!
He is though!
Honestly, I do not get this 'fairness' shit. If you are earning 4/5x more than your partner or even a friend and you wanted them to join you and knew that they were unable to afford it...then surely, if you are heartfelt and kind, you would help them cover the cost. ?
If you are earning similiar then it is a different story of course.

By paying for the accommodation, he was already significantly subsidising her. He was already 'lightening the load'.

The OP says she's paid for trips before, but she's also said those are city breaks for birthday/Christmas, so for set occasions. It's not her birthday. It's not Christmas. It's not an occasion where reciprocal gift giving is expected. He just happens to be going away for work and there's a chance to do something together. The cost of a holiday in Asia is very different to a city break somewhere cheap in Europe.

Also, re the vouchers point... she didn't spend those on him. She spent them on a friend. I'd be more generous with an old friend than a new partner too, as we'd have a history of being there for each other at different times. I treat my old friends like family and I don't quibble over money with family. A partner of a year wouldn't have reached that status for me.

It's so easy to say 'well, if I earned more, I'd pay more' without actually being in that position.

Trust me, once you've lived with a cocklodger and been utterly burnt, you get very cautious about people wanting to blend finances earlier than feels natural!

I'd also echo the frustration over the OP not sharing any numbers. She may well have unrealistic expectations of what's affordable on his salary when he's paying to renovate a property....

The impression I am getting is that you see him as a life partner and he sees you as his current girlfriend.

I've paid for us to go away for example on city breaks for full weekends flights and hotels for birthday/Xmas etc.. this trip has just come at a time where I don't have the money..

Has he reciprocated these fully paid for weekends away? Or has he just happily accepted them and not reciprocated?