Feel that Dh friendship with woman is destroying our marriage

[gruffalo5]

Dh and I happily married for over 15 years, 3 dc. 2 years ago a woman joins dh workplace and they gradually become very good friends. She has Dh and dc. Last year I asked to borrow his phone for a number and saw her name (he hadn’t mentioned her at that point) to my shame I looked and saw their messages and there were so, so many, day and late into the evening. They weren’t particularly flirty but what hit me like a punch to the stomach was the obvious closeness and fondness they have for each other. Things they were both interested in going to see. My dh and I have always had that great friends kind of relationship as well as being married so I think it especially hurt. I owned up and asked him about it and he was really angry I’d looked and accused me of coercive control when I asked him to reduce the messaging. They see each other at work so why she has to send him photos on a Friday night and of what’s she’s up to at the weekend I don’t really understand.
He has other female friends which I’ve never thought twice about but there’s something about her that feels as though she’s pushing the boundaries and it’s creating such a wedge between us. Admittedly I’ve been very upset and over emotional and it was suggested I go on ADs which has helped me a bit but I still feel really upset as though she’s always there now, in the background. He says I’m destroying the marriage by being like this and nothing is happening with them, they are just mates. Just don’t know what to do, it all just makes me feel very sad and that maybe I’m not enough anymore.

This. If it’s a totally innocent friendship then he will be happy to do this, to reassure you. If she’s such a wonderful person then you can all become friends and you can stop worrying.

Its a win win. He gets to continue with his friendship and you and her husband gain a whole new couple / family to be friends with.

Tell your husband you have realised that he is right , it’s totally innocent and you are wrong to be jealous about it . So when are they coming over to your place for dinner / drinks ?

His reaction will tell you everything.

Thanks all, good to hear different views. He has definitely cut back on the messaging now. I do think he’s faithful, he’s a good man but what hurts is the bond they obviously have. But according to dh unless there not sleeping together then I should be fine about it. I can’t make him see why I’m upset, just does not get it at all. He thinks I’m just depressed and menopausal so this is why I’m like this. Feels like a no win which makes me so sad as we’ve been great together.

Nah some people just give off bad vibes…trust your instinct. If it isn’t trouble now, it could develop - and that is exactly what you are afraid of I think. Things can be innocent…but if he gives it enough attention (her) then who knows. Glad that he has cut down the messaging but if his theory is right - why did he feel the need to cut back on messages?

I'm so sorry that's his attitude @gruffalo5

I often wonder if a one night stand would be easier to deal with.
For me, the emotional betrayal was far worse.

You look after yourself and take time to work out how to deal with this.

It’s hurtful that the husband has an emotional bond with this woman. I certainly wouldn’t be prepared to put up with it.

He’s having an emotional affair with another woman. And doesn’t give a shit how you feel about it. I wouldn’t put up with this. If you left him I am pretty sure she would be leaving her husband around the same time..

He might well be a (previously and otherwise) good man, but he's a good man doing at best an incredibly stupid thing that risks his marriage, and at worst, a thing he knows is bad.
Unless he has the emotional intelligence of a brick, he can't genuinely believe that this level of intensity is normal and should be acceptable to you just because they're not having sex.
I think he knows full well it's not, hence his desperate (and pretty despicable) attempts to make you believe its your MH and/or hormones that's the problem. If he can get you to believe that, you'll get quietly back in your box, leaving him free to carry on prioritising his 'friend'. Practically I think there's little you can do to stop this, so unless you're prepared to leave, your options really amount to whether you want to put up with it quietly and keep your fingers crossed it doesn't progress further, or if you want to make a stand for your happiness and the respect you deserve and issue an ultimatum and be prepared to leave.
Its easy for the rest of us to tell you to leave, insist he stops (he won't) or whatever, but its your life. And only you can decide if you prefer to live it like this or would rather be out of it. One thing you shouldn't do though, for your own sanity, is let him convince you you're wrong. You are not wrong. Not even close.

I’m just thinking why it sits well with him that you are on Ads due to his actions. He should be bending over right now to make things right with you @gruffalo5 . As a pp said, he is no longer a good man.

OP, he's not a good man judging by what you write ...

I know the answer to that one! It's because "Even though he's doing nothing wrong, he accepts that OPs mental health and menopause are causing her to imagine things, and so because he's a great husband, he will (pretend to) cut down contact to make OP happy. Obviously because he's (pretended to) do this thing for her, he's put himself in the right, and OP in his debt. So next time he wants to go out with drinking in a (non existent) group with the woman, OP will feel she can't ask him not to, because he's curtailed so much freedom for her already".

This is such a delicate subject. What boundaries do we draw with other women and our husbands?
He should neither be chatting her at night or messaging her so frequently.Is she married or has she got a partner?
This is a brewing recipe for infidelity.I am sorry.

I wonder how he would feel if it was you doing this with another man @gruffalo5

His anger is a BIG red flag! If it was genuinely innocent he would show you the messages and be open with his phone. The secrecy is thrilling for him and he is angry with you for spoiling his fantasy.
Whatever action you take now he will blame you for - if you demand to see the messages and ask that he stop this inappropriate relationship, then he will accuse you of being paranoid and ‘pushing him into an affair’. If you ignore it and hope it all goes away then he will accuse you of being cold and uncaring. I’ve been there and got the T.Shirt. My dh had an affair with a colleague at work, he was so blinded and dazzled with the excitement that he could/would not stop
Your dh is prepared to let you take ADs rather than stop his behaviour??

Maybe it's time to get out by yourself more, start some new hobbies, join a few groups and maybe strike up a close friendship with a nice man! Purely platonic of course so your DH can't complain 😏

Guaranteed the other woman knows all about your “anti depressants and menopause”, she probably feels like a great catch in comparison to the way he has painted you. It’s doubtful he’s cut back, he will just be more careful. You wouldn’t even know she existed if he’d had a choice in if. I suggest what a previous poster said, suggest her and her husband come for dinner, hey even suggest a group WhatsApp so the banter can be shared with you and her husband, say to him it’s a shame he’s made such a great friend and you can’t develop this as a group 🤣

He is some kind of self-centred narcisstic bastard. Can't you see that?

Well I am not surprised you're on ADs, because he is emotionally torturing you.

Can't you see what he is doing to you?

Kick him out and let her have him because he is not worth your tears.

I understand that gruffalo. If it’s got so bad you are needing anti depressants and he still persists, I’d be wondering why too. Marriages should be able to handle normal interaction with thd oppositd sex, but when it’s got to the point it’s upsetting you so much , his insisting on it is bloody- minded stubbornness. I don’t know what to suggest. Do you want to let her ruin the marriage? If you go, she essentially has. What do you feel you want to do?

Do you have a male friend you could develop a similar interaction with ( provide you are careful not to lead him on)? Or better still a female friend who could masquerade? That would give you a bargaining chip ( I’ll stop if you stop)/ opportunity to paint the scenario from your perspective.

The thing is I honestly don’t think he would mind if close had male friend in the same way but I don’t feel the need to have one. He doesn’t really ‘do’ jealousy. If I was that close with a man I want dh to be that person. That’s what makes me sad. I want him to want my friendship not hers.

I understand that too. I’m sorry: it’s not an easy situation. Ultimately you can’t control him I guess. But I’m very much on your side - if that means anything!

Its not a good idea anyway OP. Its a daft game that involves using an innocent other party, and would probably backfire anyway, as it would give him grounds to say he didn't care about your friend so you shouldn't about his.

Yes that’s true oP. I honestly don’t see what you can do. You are relying on him to be decent and sadly it seems he isn’t.

OP I'm so annoyed on your behalf.

You said, he is a totally relaxed person and the last person who would be described as (gaslighting and controlling) by anyone who knows him.

Gaslighting: Psychological manipulation of a person usually over an extended period of time that causes the victim to question the validity of their own thoughts

Here's some things he's said to you:

He says I’m destroying the marriage by being like this

We have had the emotional affair conversation and he refuses to believe such a thing exists

I’ve spent the last few months being told I’m paranoid and controlling

He says I’m basically destroying our young family and marriage because he has a friend who happens to be a woman

It was his suggestion I start the ADs

A week ago I asked him to make an excuse to her about not replying to her texts and he refused as it would be embarrassing for her and upset her

(He's) saying I’m being erratic and off my head and he won’t be told who he can be mates with.

He thinks I’m just depressed and menopausal so this is why I’m like this.

You are having a completely normal reaction to a friendship that seems inappropriate. He should be bending over backwards to make you feel loved and secure but he's not. In fact, he's only concerned about upsetting her.

He's gaslighting you to make you think you're off your head and it's you that's controlling. It's all your fault because you're paranoid, depressed and menopausal. Classic gaslighting.

I'm so sorry OP, none of this is your fault and you deserve so much better.

You are upset OP because your husband is asking you to deny your feelings. It is not unreasonable to be upset that your husband appears to have feelings (of any sort!) for another woman. It is not unreasonable or mad or menopausal or bunny boilingly jealous to question this situation.
i went through exactly this and I so wish now I had said “why are you spending so much time and energy with X?”.
i couldnt understand why my husband was so irritated and cold to me all the time. I too was on anti depressants and started seeing a psychiatrist at one point.
all the time I was accepting of his “best friend”. My dh even told me that they had been to the cinema together after work one evening as her husband was away and they were both at a loose end(!). I felt a bit odd about it but pushed any feelings away as of course it was ok for him to have a “friend” at work.
They ended up sleeping together (usually in our house) and had a long affair. They were both utterly callous about me and my unhappiness.
If this relationship is so wholesome and innocent why is he angry at all with you? Why isn’t he saying “oh my god I am so sorry this upset you” and why does she think it ok to be so inappropriate with hiim?
you are allowed to be upset OP. And to tell him about it. And to ask for reassurance and whatever he needs to do to put it right.

When he says their relationship is nothing for you to worry about because they are not having sex it comes over to me that actually he WOULD like to have sex with her. But he is not having sex with her because he knows if he does he will be crossing a line. That if he has sex with her then he can no longer claim to be the good guy who isn't doing anything wrong.