Sneaky family behaviour? Or normal?

[JustLaura]

Any advice appreciated!

I am the middle child of 3 and the only Daughter.

Throughout my childhood, it was made known to me that my 2 male siblings were more important than me. Just a couple of examples: my Parents did not go to my parent evenings at school as it was "pointless" and "girls just have children". I was openly discussed in the 3rd person at family gatherings: "I don't think she will amount to anything" and "no-one will be bothered about her" etc ... I could go on. All this was in front of me.

Even when I attained a good job, I was constantly compared to my siblings and others, and told what they had more than me.

My elder Brother and Wife catastrophically fell out with my Parents years ago, then they moved away and have not spoken to any of the family since. It all stemmed from my Parents repeatedly asking leading questions to their children and prying into their relationship/financial situation.

My younger Brother is now 'the golden child' and can do no wrong in their eyes.

I am now the person that cares for them and takes them out. Youngest sibling will visit them once a week to eat a meal that my Mum has cooked for him and then he leaves. He does no household chores for them when he visits and tells my Mum that I need to do x, y, and z.
We are not in contact with each other and he recently has been saying to my parents that he's seen me or my car in different places, implying I'm not at work or I'm on leave and haven't told my Parents that I'm on leave. My sibling even constructed a situation where he said to my Mum I'd spoken negatively about him to a relative (I hadn't) and made out he was upset. My Mum then questioned me about it (I was oblivious) and she said if she found out I had lied to her that I would be cut off from them. (Again implying he is more important).

I now try to raise any issues as they happen but they continue to try to twist anything I say to the point where I can't speak openly as I know whatever I say will get distorted. It was even commented that there must be a 'lot of dirt to find out' as I was defensive.

I'm now being 'checked on' too - even at work I get a 5/6 phonecalls a day for no reason as well as calls when I'm not at their house.

Recently when I've been doing chores for them, I've overheard my Mum specifically asking my children probing questions or suddenly saying something to try and prompt them. Is this normal behaviour?

Mum either says I'm making her upset and feel ill or ignores me when I raise any points.

What do I do?

I'm increasingly drained by all of this and it's starting to consume me.

Here another sticky note for you: only do nice things for people who respect you.

The sausage rolls things was insane; nobody NEEDS sausage rolls, especially in the evening. It could have waited for the next weekly shop. They have got you so mixed up that the only reason you wouldn’t have gone, is if you knew they were for your brother. They shouldn’t have asked and you shouldn’t have gone, end of.
They are miserable people and you cannot make them happy. If you are going to carry on doing stuff for them then cut it down to a couple of visits a week. If they carry on being abusive cut it back to once, for one hour. Tell them you will not tolerate abuse.
I had therapy for years to deal with my childhood abuse from my father who also made me feel like I was ‘pure murder’, his words when I was four. The last time I visited him he insulted me within five minutes of me arriving. I left and I never saw him again. He died 20 years ago, I didn’t cry then or since.
Courage, you can do this!

Thanks @Yougetmoreofwhatyoufocuson trying my best to regain control!

@JustLaura so when your mum was in your position, 3 phone calls a week and one visit were absolutely fine, but seeing her parent every day was too much for her…?

There’s a very obvious double standard there isn’t there?

OP, you haven’t pleased your parents for all of your life because they don’t want to be. This is how they control you. Whatever you do you won’t be right because they’ll just change the narrative to suit themselves. Do not let them come between you and your children. You are not the only one to help them, you are the only one they demand to help them. There is a huge difference…..this is so toxic OP and always has been. Please withdraw.

So your mum phoned her mum three times a week, yet she wants YOU to go round there three times a day, take them out for a whole day every weekend, do their shopping, chores and all cleaning and she thinks that’s reasonable?

You are never going to please this woman.

I don't go there 3 times a day any more but I think that's what she wants as that's what I used to do for a period of time.

Now it's chores, food shopping, full day at the weekend and ad-hoc appointments.

I do question if I'm doing this to myself or doing it for them? It's so difficult.

Now it's chores, food shopping, full day at the weekend and ad-hoc appointments.

Do you ever say you can’t?

If my mum phoned me at night asking for me to do an hour’s trip to bring them sausage rolls I would ask them what on earth they needed them so urgently for when I had already done their week’s shopping! I would then tell them to add it to next week’s shopping, say bye and get on with my evening. I wouldn’t have got in the car.

With any phone call/texts about chores, say ‘write a list and either brother can do it when he comes for dinner or I’ll do it next time I’m there’

Set up internet shopping.

Tell them you can’t/wont do their cleaning-it’s enough to work full time and keep your own house clean. Did your mum work full time plus clean her parents’ house?

I’d stop the day trips out every weekend NOW. Take your husband and kids out for the day instead.

Gently, OP, you’re being a total doormat. Why on earth would you do an hour round trip to get sausage rolls? Do you see how crazy that is?

Not so gently, are you doing this for the inheritance because I reckon they’ll give it to your brothers and if you’re doing it to be a ‘good daughter’, you’re on a loser.

Stop answering their calls at work! The amount is ridiculous. Are you in an office where they don’t mind lots of personal calls?

Laura

You've had the special training that practically all adult children of narcissists receive from childhood. No-one else bothers with your mother I daresay apart from her golden child (itself a role not without price but he is unaware of this) and there are good reasons why that is (she is really not worth bothering about). The sky will not fall in on you if you cut all interactions right back to zero sum. It is not possible to have a relationship with someone this disordered of thinking.

You've been trained and otherwise conditioned by your family of origin and nowadays your mother in particular to put their needs first with your own dead last. You are mired in fear obligation and guilt; three buttons these people installed in you. They're taking you away from your own family here.

Be tired of being the last person who matters here.

No matter what you do and how well you do it, it will not change your main assigned role within this family i.e scapegoat for all their inherent ills. They will not respect or appreciate you more, probably even less because you're actually empathetic (unlike them) and therefore easily manipulated in their view. Drop the rope entirely; your mother will manage, these types do. Let go of all and any residual hope that any of them will change. You will also need to adopt the position your eldest brother has taken i.e no contact.

Ultimately you will need to grieve for the relationship you should have had rather than the one you actually got.

I would also suggest you look at Dr Ramani on You tube and read "Will I ever be good enough?" by Karyl McBride along with "Children of the Self Absorbed" by Nina W Brown. Do also consider reading and or posting on the current "well we took you to Stately Homes" thread on these pages too.

@JustLaura you should just order an online food shop for them and have it delivered. that would be one more job off the list! just make sure she pays for it

This is a great idea - was going to suggest it.

look after your health, and your family.

"Now it's chores, food shopping, full day at the weekend and ad-hoc appointments".

All of this now needs to cease; your efforts are not appreciated at all by her (more like expected) and you as her slave daughter need to revolt.

What are your children learning from you about relationships?. This is not what you want to be teaching them; for them to be suck ups too.

I would also not count on it that you will receive any form of inheritance from her going forward.

OPs mother is likely to be more than capable to pay for a supermarket shop on the net and if not her own golden child son can do this for her. OP should not do any of it.

Feeling Guilt | Daughters Of Narcissistic Mothers This is also an article you should read.

Enough OP, you’ve got to stop running around after your parents, they have zero respect for you, and you sound lovely. Please please stop helping them, as you are getting no thanks, and they, and your nasty brother, continue to speak horribly about you, you do not deserve this.

And I can see in the future when they pass, then golden child will inherit everything, they won’t care about you and your family. It’s now time to put your DH and kids first. They must be sick of you always dashing off to your parents house!!! You have got to get out of the mindset that daughters only should look after elderly parents. And the fact they are digging for information through your kids is very wrong. Please be strong!

@JustLaura I didnt receive any inheritance when my mother died after me going no contact! It didnt bother me in the slightest that it all went to the golden child who died within 10 months and the golden grandaughter got it all including the house!

Oh no, they either need to pay for their own cleaner, or perhaps Golden Boy with his Very Important Job could contribute.

Just to add to what @Fraaahnces has said, my experience of my dysfunctional family is that you can influence the dynamic by withdrawing. You don't have to end up burnt out and resentful but you do have to leave.

I was the same as you, scapegoated female trying to be the good daughter to a toxic mother who favoured my golden child brother. Turning myself into a pretzel desperately seeking the approval I never received as a child from her.

Long story short, I bowed out, my brother was last man standing, (other sibling went years before) probably assumed he was getting the inheritance. Ten years later he's estranged from our 'toxic mother', now wants to play happy families with me having thrown me under the bus umpteen times. I'm not interested.

If I'd stayed I would have ended up wiping her butt whilst he waltzed off with the money. It's not been easy, I've had to drop my entire family because 'scapegoat' is for life but I'm proud that I've got my daughter away from the mess and live a peaceful life with my darling partner and her.

One thing I would add is that you will never change your family. I've had a lot of therapy to recover. Everyone else thinks they're normal. I have no doubt that contact with my brother will not do me any favours. He's always treated me with contempt, he was well trained by our mother.

@Fraaahnces I'm so sorry to hear your story and wish you peace and happiness.

OP this sounds awful. It is really really hard to put boundaries in place. Years ago I lived with my parents and was similarly running around like you are. I came close to losing my chance for a career and a family of my own.

I now speak to the one remaining parent once a week and see them 3-4 times per year. It's taken years to get to this point but it's so much healthier.

I can recommend the "Do not disturb" feature on your phone. Mine is set up so parent can't get through during work or commuting hours. Your job is equally busy and important, isn't it?! so you can no longer take calls or receive messages then. If you don't hear or see the call/msg arrive it's a lot easier to deal with. The one time there was an emergency during work hours goldenballs sibling (yes, I have one too!) had to deal with it!
The feature works in the opposite way too - so calls or messages from DH or DD's school will always be allowed through.

Because priorities.
Good luck!

can recommend the "Do not disturb" feature on your phone. Mine is set up so parent can't get through during work or commuting hours.

Good idea.

This allows you to do the,

’mum, you have phoned me 13 times today-this is bordering on harassment. How many times have you phoned GB?’

@JustLaura "..but then she said you're obviously not busy as you'd have something to say? I just said I was busy but with nothing that would interest her.

What could I have said?"

This would be a good opportunity to tell her that you've got no news as your life is actually a bit boring with the usual routine of job, husband, kids etc and nothing noteworthy has happened so let's speak at the end of the week/Tuesday/Sunday eve whatever and just cut down on the phone calls straight away. I mean, what could you both possibly have to say?

I'd also like to say that despite their despicable behaviour toward you, you are possibly getting a little buzz thinking you are saving them, keeping them going etc. and without you they will deteriorate and die.

I can guarantee you that if you stop what you're doing for them they will very easily figure out someone else to do these things for them. It will make your head spin how quickly they will replace you.

You sound lovely and it's very obvious you are a good daughter - far better than they deserve.

Please take time for yourself and your own kids and family. Life is short. Don't waste yours on these people.

This would be a good opportunity to tell her that you've got no news as your life is actually a bit boring with the usual routine of job, husband, kids etc and nothing noteworthy has happened

I wouldn’t be saying my life was boring as it sounds like they are going to try to fill your boring days with their chores.

I would be busy.

I can’t do your food shoo in person every single week, I’m too busy-do an internet shop.

Sorry, I can’t take you out every Sunday, I’m busy with my own husband and kids.

I can’t answer 11 phone calls every day, I’m busy at work, like brother.

I can’t drive an hour to bring you sausage rolls for dinner with my brother, I’m busy. Why don’t you ask him to bring them with him?

Adults are allowed to make their own choices, whether it is in their best interests or not. They have the money to have help, so if they choose not to, that is on them. It is not on you to fix everything for them, and you can never achieve their expectations.

When you start to refuse, they will get angry because that is what they have always done in the past to control you, so it has historically worked. They won't have any other techniques, because they haven't needed to. As an adult, you can also make your own choices and can decide not to give in this time, no matter how vile they get.

My DH was the same, when he was introduced into my family he couldn’t believe how different things were. He had had a couple of longterm relationships but when he was younger he didn’t really spend time with the parents. He struggled with the concept of unconditional love for a long time no matter how much I reassured him. I think his previous relationships ended because he could never commit to the level they wanted.
We have just celebrated our 25th wedding anniversary and still happy.
DS was not exposed to MIL enough for her to do any damage. And has made his own mind up about her. He sees the change in DH when a visit has been planned and has observed how MIL talks and treats DH. He sees right through her.
She has a habit of giving him large amounts of money if he does anything for her. He realised a while ago that she is trying to buy his love so avoids visiting because he’s not comfortable with it. And I know she has interrogated him in the past.
I once had a big row with him when he was early teens, he stormed out and went to grandmas. She rang us up to tell us then laid into me for being a bully and a rubbish parent.
I thanked her for letting us know and then picked him up. DS was very sheepish and apologised profusely.
He admitted that she totally blamed me even when he explained what he had done. I actually can’t remember what it was but it would have been a boundary breaker.
The other problem with DH’s family is they can hold grudge for years. Learnt behaviour from MIL. If you upset her she will treat you like shit but you will have no idea why. You are expected to work it out.
one famous one for me was her not speaking to me for 6mnths because we decided not to spend Christmas Day with the family. I struggled with recurrent miscarriages and SIL was pregnant ( full term). I had had a miscarriage a couple of months earlier and Both DH and I just didn’t want to spend all day surrounded by baby talk. SIL had the baby on Boxing Day and we visited the following day. The miscarriage wasn’t common knowledge only MIL knew, she didn’t tell anyone but she did moan to everyone about it. Of course we were the villains because we had upset “mother”.
I thought she would understand our reasons but 10yrs, yes 10yrs later she brought it up and claimed that I should have known how upset she was.
The following Christmas she cancelled last minute because golden child had split up with his longterm girlfriend and she felt it was unfair for him to be surrounded by happy couples.
You really cannot win when you are not the golden one.
Grey rock is the way to go.

Thanks for sharing this @Angrymum22 I was starting to think this is just how families are and it's only when people say something about theirs that I thought my Mum/Dad/Brother aren't like that.