Parents giving me the cold shoulder over house buying

[DAISYBELLAxx]

Hello. Looking for some advice if possible please...

Myself and my partner (28 and 30) are looking to buy a property. I have equity in savings from a previous property I sold, and once he sells his flat (currently on the market) he should get a good amount of equity too.

We have seen a house we both really like in Surrey (where our families both live) and are wanting to do a second viewing. The house is offers around £500,000. We plan to put down a £100,000 deposit, which will also leave us both with £20,000-£30,000 in savings each. The house needs some modernisation and renovations, so this should give us some funds to do this (although we would need to pay people as we are not good at DIY!)

We have spoken to a mortgage advisor, who says that the monthly mortgage would be around £2,000 per month. I am a teacher who takes home £2,444 per month, and my partner takes home around £2,800 per month.

We have no children currently, but plan to within the next three years. I am also not very happy in my job and plan to go self employed (dog groomer) within the next few years.

My parents are giving me a bit of a hard time every time I bring up the house. They want us to buy closer to them, as they are saying that if we have children, it will make things easier for us (especially when I plan to go self employed) which I do understand. But they have told me that if we move over 20 minutes away, we are on our own with childcare and dog care (they currently look after my dog whilst I am working). However, they do not seem to understand that when we look closer to them, the house prices are so expensive (hence the £500,000 for this house). They showed us around a family friends house at the end of their road (which is for sale for £460,000) It was quite pokey and needed so much work - it wasn't right for us.

Our requirements are that we are looking for a forever home, with plenty of space for a family to grow and a decent sized garden for our dogs and also the groom room.

My parents view is that there is cheaper housing around. There is - but it just doesn't fit what we are after. And when it is cheaper, it is further away from my parents. They have said that if we go along with this house, things will go wrong and we will not be able to pay the mortgage. They are just being very negative in general (I do understand their points and know that they are only looking out for us, but they do not understand my arguments).

Myself and my partner currently have no credit (other than my car loan which is £222 per month).

I am feeling 50/50, as I always have valued my parent's opinion. And with children coming up and a change of job, I am worried about the bills being paid. My partner reassures me that all will be fine and that this is the perfect house for us, but I am feeling unsure due to my parents views.

Any advice? Is £2,000 per month too much? I used to pay £600 for a three bedroom house, but that was back in 2019. I just don't want us to struggle but I know something has to give. Thank you. :)

Initially I thought the 20 minute limit sounded insane, but I actually think they’re using this to stall the whole plan because you’ll now have to factor in £1500+ per month nursery fees, which you simply can’t do. I have a high mortgage compared to salary but I think you’d be absolutely mad to do this - you’d be left with beans on toast after the first month never mind thinking about kids!

How does it make you feel to consider that for the foreseeable future- maybe for ever- you are having to continue to teach and the dog-grooming is a weekend and evening hobby? If you are OK with that possibility, then you'll probably just about manage.

If that thought fills you with dread, and take a big step back.

There's no guarantee your dog-grooming business will take off, and you can't survive (let alone pay childcare) on your husband's remaining £800 after paying the mortgage, so by taking on this house, you may be trapping yourself in teaching for a long time.

It sounds like you wouldnt pass a stress test. I earn your combined wage and i wouldnt take on a 2k mortgage

I'd be wary of paying so much on the mortgage. The issue is that childcare just costs soooo much even for only 1 child. I was paying £800 a month after 20% govt. help for 1 child, 3 days per week. I'd really crunch some numbers carefully with large contingencies and see how things look. You could get a cheaper house, pay down the mortgage as quickly as poss and plan to upgrade when your DC start school.

However, your parents shouldn't be giving you the cold shoulder or trying to force you to move closer to them.

OP, you definitely need to look at nursery costs of the area and factor that into calculations.

My partner and I are very similar pay to you guys and we simply could not afford that mortgage along with childcare and all other bills.

2000 mortgage, 1000 nursery (at least, and in the near future it sounds!), car loan.

Utilities, council tax, internet, phones, food. An unexpected bill for MOT. House repairs. Any rise related to COL. I think you might be overstretching yourselves.

Our Mortgage hit 2k at the last interest hike, having previously been £1,600 and it has been tight. Council tax, insurance and life insurance for the mortgage means that our housing costs are just over half our take home pay, and that's before adding on any other bills.

Fortunately, we no longer have to pay for childcare, but I think we would have really struggled if we did. I think your parents are right. If you want to enjoy your children and relationship, think carefully before putting yourself under that sort of financial pressure.

Bonkers... as said up thread, you cannot do all of those things on that income.

Buy a much smaller house, ideally that does not need significant work.

If you are dead set on the dog grooming thing (a tricky industry as the first thing people stop doing when money is tight, is taking the dog to the groomer!)... then buy a property with a garage you can use as a dog grooming room and sufficient drive space that visiting clients do not piss off the neighbours.

Do that as a side-hustle weekends and evenings.

The first couple of years as a dog groomer, your clients will pretty much all be everyone elses 'discards' ie the people who show up every six months with a dog matted to the skin/who bites the groomer/is terrified and pisses/shits everywhere... that no other groomer wants OR is aware they're not taking care of the dog so hopping around groomers to avoid comment/being reported.

Shaving down matted dogs, bitey dogs, dogs that haven't been taught to stand still will not give you a nice portfolio, lovely insta content to promote your business. It will take a fair old while before people come to you because its you and you're very good at it.. vs 'you'll do because no one else will see Fido'.

There are ways to take this line of work in a slightly different, more niche direction, however they require you to have some dog training/behaviour skills rather than just grooming and then developing a client base by snagging people at the 'tiny puppy' stage but again this will produce a low income and take some time to kick off and really needs a strong working relationship with local dog trainers which again... doesn't happen overnight.

TLDR - dog grooming is going to take a fuck of a long time before it pays for itself, never mind pays a mortgage.

As somebody who lives 20 minutes from her mum and dad and did not think it was that big of a deal, after children I now realise it is a huge deal and is the difference between childcare and support with child, to none at all. I am looking for something closer to them, 5-10 minutes away instead. It is a chore, dropping my child to them then commuting to work then picking up child again then going home. We are absolutely shattered by the commute. Your parents are right.

This

It is perfectly reasonable for your parents to tell you they will not be driving for childcare support and dogs.
That is a big morgage and until you have children you do not realise how expensive they are. Childcare being a second morgage when you have two.
Any help makes a massive difference.
How will you pay your morgage when you are establishing your business?

Agree it's too early for a forever home.

A piece of advice that may be too late - do not fall in love with a house until they give you the front door keys. Make decisions on which house to buy on as business like approach as you can. That way when things fall though, and they do, you're not too disappointed.

And half your current joint salaries is too high for a mortgage if you're planning to become self employed and have a child. You'd be better off having the child first then going into dog grooming as you would at least get some maternity pay.

£2000 a month, plus bills/car etc and full time childcare is too much IMO

In my opinion it’s too expensive, especially as you will potentially need to factor in childcare in future as you’ve not had children yet. It’s so expensive in Surrey, I’m moving out completely to buy and up north as I’m on a single salary. I’d get something that’s got potential, you can always then extend in future or buy something else. I wouldn’t let your parents bully you into getting something near them, but if they take care of your dog, you need to factor in dropping off / picking up and in traffic you’re looking at more than an hour out of your day. Same for kids, too long for them to pick up from school regularly

Another thing I don't think anyone has mentioned - some mortgages, deeds specify that you can't run a business from the property

Your plan to go self employed sounds crazy when you combine it with wanting to start a family because there will be no maternity or sick pay (or pension) so you'd be relying on partner's income and savings

Especially in an already saturated market.

Op something I'm really struggling with why will you be on your own with regards to childcare or dog care if you move the extra 20 mins away... surely they would just say you need to take the kids to them or the dog to them... instead of saying you're on your own. My own parents hate the drive to me so I always just take the kids to them if I need child care and if it was an emergency or a one off they wouldn't hesitate to come to me... it's not hard to make compromise especially as they seem keen to help with the kids .

In this case, the OP plans to give up work to become self employed and also have a child.

Not being married is fine with two working adults with similar income and all assets shared.

If the OP’s partner left her 10 years and 2 kids down the line (or worse 20 or 30 years down the line) she would get half the house plus child support. No access to his pension, no adjustment of assets to reflect her stepping back in her career for child care and no alimony (never long term these days but I’ve seen wives get it for X years to get back on their feet.)

If an ex-P is clever and plans things out, a lot of assets will end up in his sole name before the split.

It’s not being judgmental or some weird Victorian morality (something I was accused of on another thread), it’s that marriage is a legal contract and the best way of protecting women (or men but it’s usually women) who end up doing the majority of child care.

I would never get married myself but I’m too old for kids and I have various assets that I don’t want to split. I’d have a very different view if I was 20 (OK, OK, 30) years younger.

The giveaway is that they’re using future childcare as a lever to control your choices and independence rather than from the motive of wanting to know and have a relationship with future grandchildren.

Obviously distance may affect what they can offer but there may also be ways around if indeed you want their help with childcare!

Don’t forget to factor in pension you probably don’t think about it as you get a good one as a teacher but to buy similar privately once self employed it’s £££.
My groomer stopped and went to work in an office, one before that closed her shop as not profitable (and she had baby in pen in shop so not paying childcare) despite high charges I don’t think it’s a particularly well paid job.

Please do NOT have children without getting married. In your position it would be beyond foolish from a financial and security pov. You would be doing yourself and your children NO favours.

In terms of your parents...

Yes parental help is invaluable BUT the language you use and your parents use is alarming / a series of red flags.
Their support is suppppper conditional...

And pikkumyy77 is spot on - we did this knowing we would have children and things could happen (they did....CoL crisis) we opted for a mid point and are just about okay now

If we'd gone to our max budget we would be VERY uncomfortable right now.
Unless your boyfriends salary is going to dramatically increase in the next 2-3 years your numbers are very tight / there is no real fat.

@Boredandborder I'm not reading this as an "is this affordable" problem but a controlling parents issue. You're both adults and sound entirely sensible enough to make this work

It would be great if you could detail exactly how this will work as you don’t consider it to be an affordability problem. Two adults, salaries considered low when considering debt ratio. Mortgage will basically be 50% of joint income when taking car repayment into account. Allowing for economy to go to shit even further, cost of living pressures to get higher, how do you consider this affordable? Then add in a desire to pack in one salary for a start up business that will likely take several years to generate profit when factoring in business costs and possibly children on top of that. I’m all ears on how you don’t consider this an affordability issue.

As a parent to adult children, I’m guessing the parents have this at the forefront and are trying to get this across and it’s being perceived as controlling by OP? Luckily for me I have a few in finance - still at home because of this exact issue, the minimum deposit is easy peasy, the monthly mortgage is a different matter so it means a HUGE deposit to make monthly repayments affordable. So I don’t have to ‘subtly’ try and guide them and be seen as controlling, they understand the basics of finance themselves. In turn they guide their siblings accordingly so DH and I are free of having to get this across ourselves and copping the backlash😆.

I feel this is over your budget. You need to consider your bills as well as the council tax. Everything is really expensive nowadays. Have in mind the mortgage rates can go up so next time you remortgage may be even higher payment.

If you both earn around 5k and spend 2k only on the mortgage no bills included this is way too much in my view.

Good luck whatever you decide. :)

Exactly. The desire not to be married should never trump your financial stability, especially adding children into the mix. It is woefully naive to give up a job and live with a partner. I did it myself for a short period of time to follow my now dh to another part of the country. But we planned to marry before we did so.

I think the mortgage payment is too high for you sorry. If you wanted to remain child free and had a solid, realistic plan to increase your salaries in the next couple of years then maybe you could take the risk.