Am I aggressive or just passionate?

[Wormworld7]

When is it okay to police somebody's personality?

This morning when discussing a totally irrelevant fact about babys vs animal intelligence, my interest piqued a little and I got a little passionate in conversation about how I felt about something within the conversation. This may or may not make any sense, but the topic is irrelevant, as it was so minor, to me was light hearted, not that deep, just a passing topic that touched on a subject of unjustness that bothers me.

I was eating porridge at the time and my partner stopped me in my tracks, just a few comments in, to say I was being aggressive, angry, shouting and waving my hands around aggressively. I wasn't. I genuinely wasn't. I have a strong voice. A strong sense of self and I carry my opinions as such, when I have them. I wasn't arguing against any point, simply just expressing my own view excitedly, and passionately, but also in a lowkey not too fussed kind of way, because I wasn't that bothered. It was just a fun conversation.

I was really hurt by being told I'm "too much" and I felt massively misunderstood. I didn't feel anger. I wasn't being aggressive. It was literally just a passing chit chat. He told me I don't know how to chill and have a nice peaceful morning. I was upset with being told I shouldn't be myself. I felt very much that this is what he was saying.

He said that I should respect how he felt, and he felt I was being aggressive. I said that's unfair, because I didn't intend to come across that way, and I meant no harm, but I felt attacked.

He said it being my "personality" is just an excuse and I should take accountability. What for?

I sobbed my heart out. I honestly feel like it should be considered a good quality of mine. I felt like he just doesn't like me and who i actually am.

We've spent all day now with him saying I've ruined his day, but I'm not sure what I actually did to ruin it?!

Can somebody really tell another person to tone it down when they're just being themselves, harmlessly? Can somebody really tell me I'm being aggressive, when I know that's not what i felt?

Why does his right to "peace" trump my right to express myself freely

Why do you think you need to put them in competition?

He has told me he doesn't like how I am. He did within the context of the argument
He told me I should change how I am and that he doesn't like me and he doesn't kniw why he's with me.

That's one hell of a drip feed. Why didn't you put that in the OP?

You sound like my husband. He would describe himself as passionate. When he is talking about a subject he feels passionate about he can be annoying, loud, sometimes rude, talks over people, doesn’t let anyone get their own point across, just likes to kind of rant on, normally insisting how passionate he feels about that subject.

It does my head in and I know he’s had feedback about it at work but he absolutely won’t be told.

OP just consider the fact that maybe, he found you genuinely aggressive. I agree that you have dialled down how you came across in this exchange in your subsequent posts, presumably to ‘win’ your argument even on this thread.

My question isn't actually about whether I was right or wrong. I'm really jist curious on where people stand with being told how they should be or what they should change, when they aren't doing any harm or mean any malice. I know I wasn't being aggressive. I know he was rude to me, instead of asking me kindly or simply saying that he wasn't quite in that mood. He made it about me, not about him. He has the right to feel how he wants I guess. But his feelings, I don't think, should be about my actions. He can ask me to consider his feelings, that's fair. But should he really be pushing it onto me. I ruined his morning. I'm too much. These are the things he was saying. I don't think that's fair. So I was really wanting to understand how other people felt about where to draw the line with calling people out.

I think we would all.agree, if someone were calling you names, you can call that out and ask not to be treated that way. You could even consider that they're part responsible for your feelings.

But what if somebody doesn't lile the way you laugh? Should you change that? Is that acceptable? I don't think so. But where is the line?

Because everything after the initial exchange probably just reads as abusive, because it likely is. I actually don't know anymore. He has no clue how to communicate and this has been an ongoing problem. My question was about policing people's personalities and if that's right

I haven't dialled anything down. I'm very certain of how I came across. I don't talk over people. I'm.not rude. I allow others to have their say. I was literally just making quite normal for me, flippant remarks. I can get super rant and super excitable on topics when the time is right. This wasn't that. I was trying to paint an overall picture of who I am.and how I come across and many people are putting their own spin on it based on people they know, who it sounds like. But I'm.not those people, and nobody here knows me so it isn't an accurate measure of what happened. I'm telling people, I was not aggressive. I was not pointing in the way he made me out to be. I speak with my hands about anything. I don't have a soft tonal voice it's strong. Those things are just characteristics I can't change and i feel added to him finding me aggressive. I wasn't whinging or whining, I wasn't even complaining. I was just having what to me felt like a light hearted chit chat. If it wasn't that to him, then fair enough but I don't feel good when someone is misreading or misinterpreting what I mean.

You say you were going into a set of stock responses like you were almost automated. You say that you were saying things which everyone who knows you know are kind of tongue in cheek responses to that topic. You say you hadn’t really started getting going yet but that you know often you can become too much. Everything that you’ve said suggests you weren’t having a genuine, heartfelt conversation but were beginning a performance about a topic you have talked about so many times you’re automated. Presumably he’d heard everything you e said before (likely many times) and knew where the conversation was leading and wanted to shut it down. I can see why this would be frustrating and why he would feel you weren’t being yourself or genuine and I can see why he wanted to try and stop it. He shouldn’t have exaggerated your behaviour but I imagine he has seen it escalate into being performative several times and has started to find it grating. I understand why that’s upsetting to you, I can be a high-energy and opinionated person and have been described as ‘too much’ but I make an effort to reflect on aspects of my behaviour I know can be annoying and tone it down when needed. I don’t just think ‘well that’s my personality so like it or lump it.’ Not all aspects of everyone’s personality are enjoyable or reasonable all the time.

I think the fact it escalated into a huge row in which he came for your whole personality does make a difference to how you can understand these things. If you read John Gottman on how relationships and marriages succeed (and how some don't), then 'repair' techniques, on how you repair upsets and disagreements is very important, so someone might snap or be a bit intolerant one time, but have a way between you of rowing that back so that it doesn't turn into something huge and very destructive. It sounds like things aren't great- can you get support from anywhere (friends, counsellor, family?) You are pregnant and you say he 'sounds' abusive- is he? I'm a bit more worried about you after what you've said now, it clearly wasn't about this very small initial incident.

I get that and I'd agree, I know I can be a lot at times. But if this was one of those times, then why would he choose to be with me. Because this was just simply me. Being me. Of a morning. Nothing out of the ordinary. I want going to go off on one, I hadn't thought about where the conversation was headed, but I really don't understand why it needed to be seen as so upsetting to him. I didnt get my teeth stuck right in and rub my hands reasy for a full on debate. I would never feel right telling somebody to calm.down, if they weren't hurting my feelings. I didn't mean any harm, or malice, but the way he called me.out implied I'd done something wrong to him. If doesn't seem fair to me. If you love someone, surely you'd want to tell them gently to pipe down. And make it a you problem, not a them problem.

Thank you.im.familiar with the gottmans and their work, they have helped me a lot in understanding some of our communication styles. Idk if you can see my previous posts, but he has a history of stonewalling, name calling and generally not being able to properly communicate. He's been berating me all day, telling me he's done, he doesn't want to be with me, why would he. He is probably abusive yes. But he gas lights me to believe I'm flawed in this. I actually don't kniw anymore. I am flawed and there's much I want to work on. But he's hurt me so much recently with all his behaviour I'm not my best self. This morning was the first morning we've had that we were actually connected in weeks, after finally starting to discuss some big things that had been going on. He thinks I should let go of stuff and move on, and can't understand why I've been affected by things that have happened. I just don't know anymore maybe I'm.just a terrible person to be with.

OP you are contradicting yourself a lot here

I was really hurt by being told I'm "too much" and I felt massively misunderstood. I didn't feel anger. I wasn't being aggressive. It was literally just a passing chit chat. He told me I don't know how to chill and have a nice peaceful morning. I was upset with being told I shouldn't be myself. I felt very much that this is what he was saying

or

He has told me he doesn't like how I am. He did within the context of the argument
He told me I should change how I am and that he doesn't like me and he doesn't kniw why he's with me.

which is it then? Did he say it or did you feel like he was saying.

at the end of the day you’re convinced you’re a calm passionate debater and your husband felt the opposite, he has a right to say how he feels about your behaviour if he genuinely found it too much for a sunday morning, just as you have a right to not change your behaviour.

if you’re fully 100% convinced you and your personality are fine then continue being you and he can either decide if he wants to put up with it or he can do something about it.

Id find you both embarrassing and walk away or get a coffee and watch you both from a distance.😁
I dont like loud or aggressive people i find them intimidating but i am a wimp and scared of everything.

5 pages so far of you arguing with everyone on here, you said yourself you don't know how to dial it down and you don't seem to understand or care that communication skills mean being able to change how you speak to people, depending on infinite reasons, being responsive to the other person without instantly becoming defensive and in denial and always right. Pregnant, hormones maybe yes, but your 'strong personality' doesn't seem to allow for any other opinions than your own and you cannot receive feedback without it dysregulating you hugely, sobbing. Like someone who only jokes all the time, always being the entertainer or its only a joke jokers being dramatic all the time you speak is tiring for other people, hard work to live with. He might well be a twat, you might be in an awful abusive relationship but that's not what you posted about. He might just be worn out by you always needing an audience to perform to.
It is ok to tell your partner to give it a rest if you're not in the mood for it, you are trying to pass it all off as one long tongue in cheek joke I think, but its not funny if you have no control over it it or no self awareness of your impact on people around you, instead focusing on becoming a victim of some sort.
A newborn and being up all night will ruin what is left of your difficult relationship and poor communication skills, for both of you. Get yourselves into therapy, together, or split now before the baby arrives. It is about to get much worse. I almost didn't respond, because I've seen your replies to others and you do come across as aggressive, I dont want to be on the receiving end of that but its important. Save your energy for what is to come, especially if this is your first baby.
I've just read your last post, what a lot of drip feeding.

During the initial conflict he was making me feel that way. He wasnt saying it with love, so as not to hirt my feelings. I fely like he was saying "i dont like this, be different". Which to me is unfair. I wasnt hurting anyone or being wildly different to my usual self. Then I asked him, after it had gone back and forth for a while, why are you with me and he said it outright. That he doesn't like me. And he doesn't know why. And all day has been saying he's done with me and he doesn't want to be with me. He's playing nasty games of course. Which I'm not doing, so It tells me that I'm not wrong in the first instance. He is incredibly emotionally immature.

To big for your boots.

I’m not saying it was ‘fair’ as such but by your own admission you can be too much , you’re trying to describe the situation and personality in a situation where you feel you are right and you are still coming across as hard work, performative and like you can be annoying despite the fact that your description of your own personality is likely biased in your favour! I’m not saying that to be mean, I can be annoying and ‘too much’ too, but I think it is unreasonable that you can’t accept that just because somebody loves you doesn’t mean they can’t find you irritating sometimes. I also don’t think that you should just think your partner should accept you all of the time and can’t ever find you irritating. Most people find aspects of their loved ones personalities irritating sometimes, sometimes the things we love about someone when we’re in a good mood can even be the same things we can’t stand on days we wake up moody and irritable.

That said, no he wasn’t right to say you were being aggressive if you weren’t being or to make out you were doing something wrong. Ideally he should have calmly steered the conversation away and nobody here can know why he didn’t and how unreasonable he was being. It might be that he has tried to steer the conversation away in the past but that once you are on your soapbox it doesn’t stop the performance and this was the time he finally snapped from annoyance and told you in a rude way. Everyone snaps sometimes. That said, obviously it also might be that he was intentionally trying to hurt or undermine you because you are grating on him in general, which is obviously not okay. It’s okay for him to find you annoying sometimes and it’s okay for him to ask you to tone it down but there are reasonable ways to do this.

Why are you still with him?

I'm.fully aware of how to communicate and within different settings , times etc. I'm defending myself because I know I wasn't being aggressive. I don't think anybody can tell me I was being aggressive, when they don't know me and wwrent here. I'm a lot more things than just a fiery, passionate debater. I would have been fine with him calling me out kindly, acknowledging that he loves this side to me but HE isn't in that mood right now. But I don't think it's fair to expect me to read his mood. This is a man who behaves in very similar ways, when his mood strikes. He can get lectury and rant about things, and if I'm.not in the mood for that, I might tell him kindly, but not usually. I just allow him.to.let it out. I woild never put him down, or anyone. Or tell.them they're being something they're not

how long have you been together ?

I’m looking at the context here - you are pregnant and you say you’ve had relationship issues and he is verbally abusive and he gaslights you .

Do you think he is fabricating this small issue to give him an excuse to end the relationship? Do you want to stay with him?

How do you see this working when you have a newborn , are recovering from the birth, aren’t getting any sleep and are possibly financially dependent on him ?

If you know John Gottman's work you know this is a dysfunctional relationship which absolutely isn't about the one thing you initially posted about, and even if that had been different, the whole day would still have been shit as he's berating you and putting you and your personality down. I strongly urge you to talk with friends and family or your midwife about how you get support and possibly out of this relationship, it sounds awful and you are pregnant, you are all over the place in your thinking because of this and hormones and you need real-life support.

I get that. I really don't think that we should enjoy every single trait all of the time. Of course we are going to find them.annoying at times. But I'm not a mind reader. How am I to know that that's this time. I absolutely hate being misunderstood. Which is why I'm trying my.hardest on this thread to accurately paint a picture of myself and the situation. Obviously its going to be biased. But i genuinely think I have a lot of skills to be able to reflect on myself when needed and change parts of myself. In this relationship, I'm the only one that can apologise. That can take accountability and can go back and hold my hands up to things I got wrong. I do it often. But I don't like being forced to admit something I haven't done under duress, jist to make the fight stop. He was getting aggressive, because I wouldn't accept I was being aggressive. I was calmly saying "but I wast and I don't think that's fair to say" and he jist wouldn't back down.he was flailing about with his arms as an impersonation of me, when I'd done nothing of the sort. It felt like.gas lighting. Wanting me to admit to doing all this on level.100 when I'd been nowhere near.

4 years. I think he's depressed massively. And taking shit out on me. I don't know anymore. We've got an 11 month old together already and we've broken up before for his lack of communication skills and abusive behaviour.

Thank you. It's hard to leave someone. I hold onto hope that he was once a normal functioning partner who was able to communicate with love and kindness and he seemed to care about the relationship. Then he just stopped being able to suddenly. I hold onto who he once was and every single conflict I'm shocked at his reactions. I can't grasp why he doesn't care when he makes me cry or upsets me. Or doesn't want to work things out. I don't know, I know I sound incredibly naive and stupid right now. I haven't been having my most articulate day today thoigh all this. I'm just sort of spewing things out verbally as they come.

Sometimes people grow apart or get the ‘ick’ or check out of a marriage. I mean this gently but from the way he is treating you it does sound like you are grating on him, a partner shouldn’t act abusively and shouldn’t want to upset their partner. If this snapping was a one off then it’s worth trying to understand why, but if it’s a pattern of behaviour the why stops mattering and all that matters iS that the relationship isn’t working any more. You shouldn’t stay in a relationship which is destroying your self worth with a person who has no commitment to trying to improve communication. If he’s not responding with love and kindness anymore it sounds like he has lost the spark but is too lazy to leave you and instead is just happy to undermine and bully you to try to deflect from his unhappiness. Just because he is miserable doesn’t mean he gets to get through his days by bringing you down too. It doesn’t sound like his behaviour is something you can turn back from to get to how things used to be, especially if there are children in the relationship now. There is a reason people say children make or break a marriage and you’re not going to go back to the way he was pre-kids. It sounds like the best thing to do For your own well-being is to leave him.

Thank you. This feels like the most validating and useful comment I've had here. It feels mostly like this is what's happening.