Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Am I being OTT? Husband and my best friend…

867 replies

Totalfuckingshitshow · 22/04/2024 10:35

I don’t know why I’m doing this thread. Probably because I can’t stomach telling real life people yet. I don’t know if I’m overreacting or underreacting or what. Please can you help me see through it?

A couple of weeks ago, my closest friend came to stay with us. She’s a long-term friend, very close, visits frequently and was my bridesmaid etc.

I got a babysitter and my friend, me and my H went out for a couple of drinks and to meet some other friends in the pub.

After coming home, I went to bed as it was late and my turn to get up with the baby in the morning. My H and friend stayed up listening to music and drinking some more. They went into another separate part of the house so the music didn’t disturb me or the baby. This isn’t unusual and more often than not, I’d be there too or my H wouldn’t.

In the morning, I picked up on a vibe. I just had a feeling. Never had it before. My friend was overly bright. She came back over very early. My husband very quiet. After my friend went home, I asked him outright if something had happened and he said no.

It niggled me for a couple of days and I suddenly recalled there’s external CCTV that covers that portion of the house, after we were burgled. So I viewed it. And I saw, clearly, that my friend approached my husband and put her arms around his neck and he wrapped his arms around her. They stayed like this, then it became dancing, then it became standing with their faces very close together talking, then they kissed albeit relatively brief and not a passionate one, and then they danced some more and then they separated. My H then immediately text me something inane, and probably guilty in hindsight.

The whole thing lasted around six minutes. It looked very intimate and intense. It makes me throw up viewing it.

Afterwards, they both went to bed separately. I’m fairly certain nothing else happened between them.

I have confronted the pair of them. My H claims he was crying about something and she comforted him, and he enjoyed the comfort. He’s very, very shame faced, upset and apologetic. My friend is trying to emotionally manipulate me into getting over it. Both attempted to rewrite it and minimise it until I informed them I’d seen it on CCTV.

I had expected DARVO from the pair of them due to the creepy surveillance aspect, but neither did. I find that telling.

My H is living in a separate part of the house. Complicated lives mean he cannot leave fully currently. I have ended my friendship. I have asked my H for a separation.

The real kicker here is my H, while very fond of my friend, is twitchy when I go out with her alone because she habitually seeks male attention and he feared I might do similar. She’s very beautiful and very clever and men fall at her feet. The hypocrisy of him lapping it up when she sought his attention is keeping me up at night.

I feel utterly sick and so betrayed. I have lost so much weight, I cannot eat and I cannot sleep. I feel I have lost two of the most important people to me.

But am I overreacting to end my marriage over this? They didn’t sleep together, the kiss was relatively brief, we have very small children, very entwined lives and a very long history.

And before anyone comes at me, I’m not holding her more responsible than him. She initiated the initial contact but he went with it. They both kissed each other. He’s married to me. Not her. Nor am I routinely into surveillance. It just suddenly occurred to me we had a camera and it was sheer dumb luck, or misfortune in their case, that they were visible.

Sorry this is long. I’ve not spoken to anyone about it.

OP posts:
ExcitedButNervous0424 · 26/04/2024 12:44

Poppalina37 · 26/04/2024 11:31

@Rania78

I'm far from a victim! I rarely speak to either of them!

I just wondered if we had counselling at the time whether we could have survived it!

It wasn't easy raising my children alone!

I just think she's knows her husband better than anyone on the internet!

I'm sorry that as I've grown older I don't agree with the.... leave him scenario!

There are children involved.

The fact there are “children involved” wasn’t enough to stop him from cheating though was it?

Why is it the men can do whatever they like and then women have to forgive them “because there’s children involved” ??

It’s such sexist and misogynistic bullshit.

Vive42 · 26/04/2024 12:54

It sounds like he has form for self destructive, self sabotaging behaviour. He needs to understand why he behaves like this and why he can’t be happy in a loving relationship.

He needs to do the majority of the work.

Id be inclined to say his previous therapist didn’t get to the bottom of this self sabotaging behaviour and is therefore not the answer.

I would suggest he needs someone to help him understand his values, his boundaries, his self esteem and self worth and that he needs to do some very hard work on realising why he’s so destructive.

OP he sounds like hard work. I hope he will be worth it.

Rania78 · 26/04/2024 12:58

FinkleFlint · 26/04/2024 11:49

@Poppalina37

You sound chock full of resolve and determination. I would ignore idiotic, bizarre posts arrogantly interrogating your life and making wildly uninformed armchair diagnoses.

This was the same poster who went on and on for pages insisting that the OP secretly wanted the situation with her H and friend to happen and subconsciously instigated it by – going to bed? Despite OP gamely considering the point and politely stating that this wasn’t the case.

I guess it’s a mn thing – one of these eye roll and move on types

Respect and do not attack different opinions. Have a dialogue and constructively discuss. We just have different opinions.

And please do not put words in my mouth. I never said that the OP did this on purpose and wanted to leave. I told her to think If subconsciously this is what she wants and take it into consideration in her decision to accept him back.

You seem to take this very personally. Open up your mind to think outside of the box and not stick to what society has told you the “norm” is.

Quitelikeit · 26/04/2024 14:57

I think conflating his issues whatever they are with this drunken snog is short sighted

Do you k ow people rarely change? If it was easy I’d be at the gym everyday, weigh 8 stone and be the greatest wife on earth!

Sadly it’s not possible

I still think that the alcohol needs to be taken into account - how much did he have? Was it enough in your opinion to blur his judgement significantly?

Im not excusing what he has done but I would be keeping things in perspective.

I mean do you really think he fancies her? and wants to be with her?

Do you believe he is not satisfied with you? And your family?

You mentioned PMDD - in that case I can assume his life is hard for at least 7 days a month - none of us are perfect

For me the key is the alcohol - if he was hammered then it’s not sensible to treat the event as if he was sober

anotherside · 26/04/2024 15:02

The facts that a man wants to stay up alone drinking with his wife’s (very attractive) best friend after his wife has gone to bed should have been all the warning you need. Astounding how naive some women can be. As for the future, if tables were turned would he want to fix things?

Sometimesright · 26/04/2024 16:40

You must be gutted! Don’t do anything about your husband for a week or two while you get your head together. Block your friend she betrayed you but you don’t have children with her so she is not someone you ever need to speak to again.
you will probably want to leave your husband now but you need to be certain first. it’s a big life changing decision. Take your time you don’t have to forgive him or forget.see how you feel but don’t let him get out of answering any questions you have and make sure he knows if you catch him in a lie it’s game over. Do you have anyone you can confide in that doesn’t know either of them?

TheBestEverMouse · 26/04/2024 16:58

I don't know how useful this is OP but I hope you understand my meaning.

A friend died, alone and desperately unhappy because their marriage ended when her husband left her for another woman. As the story unravelled it transpired this wasn't the first transgression, in fact it had happened dozens of times over the years. But she said he always came back to her. Until he didn't. And then she was old, ill and alone. It absolutely broke my heart to see her so lost. She had given decades to him and when she was too old to be useful he traded her in for a younger model.

My general gist is that you shouldn't have to forgive any more times. Once is enough and this time has everything 100X worse. If you keep forgiving he'll keep transgressing and then eventually he won't want to come back. He'll be gone for good. And it will be when you're too old to start a new life with someone and be happy for the rest of your life. Don't think about the years you've been with him you'll be losing. Things of the years of happiness you'll be gaining.

Fae1234 · 26/04/2024 17:35

I'm so sorry this has happened to you. I can only imagine your heartbreak.

Everyone is different, and I don't have children, but I would never see my partner in the same light again. My heart and trust would be broken forever. Please don't waste your life on someone you don't know you could ever trust again. You shouldn't have somebody saying they will put limits on their life for your to be able to trust them again.

Your friend is an awful person. They are both responsible of course but the fact of it is, she is not a friend. Keep her out of your life for good.

BusyJerseyMum · 26/04/2024 17:42

Good luck in therapy. I think trying to save your marriage is worthwhile.

Scoobydoobywho · 26/04/2024 17:46

@Totalfuckingshitshow

He maintains it was the first time, it was an opportunistic lapse in judgement and he can’t explain why it’s happened beyond alcohol. He is very upset, very shamefaced and very desperate to do whatever I want to fix .

If that is his sorry excuse to what happened this time, what did he say was the excuse the previous time he cheated?

Chaiilatte · 26/04/2024 18:05

I can't understand why your husband didn't take over baby duty for the night. Why would he want to stay hanging out and drinking with your friend all night and not offer to go on baby duty? Sounds like they've taken you for a mug. Thank god you have the CCTV. She is NO friend of yours!

sesquipedalian · 26/04/2024 18:11

OP, in your original post, you say, “the kiss was relatively brief, we have very small children, very entwined lives and a very long history” - which makes me wonder whether you really want to throw over all you currently have for a drunken kiss with a friend. I don’t know what sort of person your friend is, but I have one friend who would eat men - any men - for breakfast. And if some woman makes the first move, it’s often difficult for a man to resist. I’m not trying to diminish the fact that what he did was wrong, nor to minimise in any way your hurt or sense of betrayal, but giving up your marriage and turning your back in the father of your children is a very big thing to do. Your husband realises that he has behaved like a “twat” - and I think the reason he did not immediately confess to you what had happened is because he knows that, and was probably ashamed. Your children only get one father, and you will necessarily continue to have him in your life because of this - so think long and hard before you do anything irrevocable. Hugs and good luck.

LuckySantangelo35 · 26/04/2024 18:24

sesquipedalian · 26/04/2024 18:11

OP, in your original post, you say, “the kiss was relatively brief, we have very small children, very entwined lives and a very long history” - which makes me wonder whether you really want to throw over all you currently have for a drunken kiss with a friend. I don’t know what sort of person your friend is, but I have one friend who would eat men - any men - for breakfast. And if some woman makes the first move, it’s often difficult for a man to resist. I’m not trying to diminish the fact that what he did was wrong, nor to minimise in any way your hurt or sense of betrayal, but giving up your marriage and turning your back in the father of your children is a very big thing to do. Your husband realises that he has behaved like a “twat” - and I think the reason he did not immediately confess to you what had happened is because he knows that, and was probably ashamed. Your children only get one father, and you will necessarily continue to have him in your life because of this - so think long and hard before you do anything irrevocable. Hugs and good luck.

@sesquipedalian

surely he should have thought long and hard before kissing OP’s mate.

the onus for this (and breaking up the family if that’s happens) is ALL on HIM

JenniferBooth · 26/04/2024 18:45

TheMerryHiker · 25/04/2024 14:55

Hi so sorry for you, the situation you are in.I would say think twice. You don't want to ruin your relationship with your h over 6 minutes, especially when you have a baby too. It's a human mind, anyone can make mistake (him being drunk mean he has less control over his emotions). If he is apologetic and promising to be the best husband ever, I would give him a second chance. Yes you don't need that friend anymore in your life. But you don't want to lose your happy life because of her. Clean him and take him back. Possibly in future don't leave him with another female friend and go to bed. I wouldn't even invite any friend for drink alone with him. That's my opinion anyway. Even If there was more going on, still he can be forgiven, if he promises to be trust worthy in future. He acted physically there, that wasn't right. So many people in world have those type of things in their minds. Every thing come to mind first then it happens in real life. You need some therapy to get over. Easy saying but forgive and forget. You both might have a happy beautiful life ahead together with your child. I wouldn't ruin it over one silly drunken mistake.

And this is just one of the reasons i am child free by choice. Become a mother and get told to put up and shut up.

RogueSt · 26/04/2024 19:05

ExcitedButNervous0424 · 26/04/2024 12:44

The fact there are “children involved” wasn’t enough to stop him from cheating though was it?

Why is it the men can do whatever they like and then women have to forgive them “because there’s children involved” ??

It’s such sexist and misogynistic bullshit.

It is neither sexist nor misogynistic - my female friend was married to a rich guy with a clever accountant. She had a child with him. He had an affair, she walked out. Years of fighting over alimony, etc. Her standard of living dropped like mad, she had to withdraw her child from a day school, food became rubbish overnight. Yeah, she was helped by Citizens' Advice Bureau, but it took 3 years to get alimony, by that time her child's education, living conditions and holidays and everything else suffered so much, her daughter is now mentally unstable from a drop in living standards. Very often women have to tolerate this because they care about their children's well-being and future.

Emptyheadlock · 26/04/2024 19:05

This would end my marriage.

6 minutes is a really long time to be doing something you shouldn't.

I would make sure any mutual friends and her partner aware of what's happened.

You deserve far far better than these 2 rats.

Zanatdy · 26/04/2024 19:46

Totalfuckingshitshow · 25/04/2024 21:01

I have spoken with him today regarding whether it was the first time. Posters on here had given me some clear questions that I wanted answering.

He maintains it was the first time, it was an opportunistic lapse in judgement and he can’t explain why it’s happened beyond alcohol. He is very upset, very shamefaced and very desperate to do whatever I want to fix it. As you’d expect a cornered man to be.

I’m struggling to believe much of what he says after he lied to me, so I don’t know how to feel. My lovely other friend is amazing and has given me some additional thoughts. She has the video and has watched it a few more times. I’ve also told a couple of close friends so I can have some support. I actually advised him to do the same. He has done it but he admitted he didn’t want people to know what a twat he is.

I think the acceptance that nothing is going to be clear for a while, and I am going to be up and down like a frog in a lift for the foreseeable, is one of the hardest things to accept. I’ll see how therapy goes (start middle of next week). I’ve also told him to go back to his therapist. If he doesn’t bother, that’ll be telling.

I think the impetus he has to fix us is going to wane. I just have a feeling. And I don’t want to be the one doing anything to drive a fix after a PP’s cautionary tale.

I just wouldn’t believe him, not after how easy it happened. Nothing would persuade me it was the first time. I know you probably don’t want to speak to her again, but I’d try getting the truth out of the ex friend. I’d tell her she owes me the truth and then you’re walking out of her live forever. I’d take her word over his

LuckySantangelo35 · 26/04/2024 19:48

JenniferBooth · 26/04/2024 18:45

And this is just one of the reasons i am child free by choice. Become a mother and get told to put up and shut up.

@TheMerryHiker

also are you saying that op should never have any of her female friends round to her house in case her husband gets tempted?

LuckySantangelo35 · 26/04/2024 19:50

RogueSt · 26/04/2024 19:05

It is neither sexist nor misogynistic - my female friend was married to a rich guy with a clever accountant. She had a child with him. He had an affair, she walked out. Years of fighting over alimony, etc. Her standard of living dropped like mad, she had to withdraw her child from a day school, food became rubbish overnight. Yeah, she was helped by Citizens' Advice Bureau, but it took 3 years to get alimony, by that time her child's education, living conditions and holidays and everything else suffered so much, her daughter is now mentally unstable from a drop in living standards. Very often women have to tolerate this because they care about their children's well-being and future.

@RogueSt

read the post you have written ⬆️

how can you say that’s not misogynistic? Women having to put and shut up and dismiss their own needs

JenniferBooth · 26/04/2024 19:52

@Totalfuckingshitshow Remember he admitted that if it wasnt for the CCTV he wouldnt have fessed up

Totalfuckingshitshow · 26/04/2024 19:55

Hi everyone.

Thanks for the new support.

I’ve actually come away with the kids for a couple of days. While we’re living separately, the overlap is too much to fully get space. He’s going to take the kids for a couple of days when I get back.

I’ve told him that he’s not actually doing anything to sort this. Just saying lots of things. A lot of reminiscing. I’ve said action speaks louder than words (original. But hey, it’s true as fuck) and I need more action. But I also need space. And I also need to stop getting sucked into the reminiscences. Ugh. I don’t actually think it’s meant to be but it feels manipulative.

I am almost rigid with fear about it being glossed over and nothing changing and me finding myself just back in the relationship as it was, just minus a formerly best friend.

Those who asked about my previous attempts to get therapy, I first tried about eight years ago. We have had a lot of stresses over the years and our communication has always been shit. I’ve wanted to do it for such a long time. I’m just so pissed off that we’re only going into it now because he’s fucked up. Majorly.

I also feel like if I chose to work through this, then all the sacrifice is mine. He gets to just feel relieved he’s been forgiven. If I went down this road, which I’m currently not able to imagine, then I’d need to see some serious changes.

I’m on the starflower, b6, vit d and folic acid now by the way and heading into the dark PMDD part of the month. Wish me luck.

OP posts:
11oclockrock · 26/04/2024 19:56

I'd be getting into his emails and messages to get evidence about whether this is the first time

JenniferBooth · 26/04/2024 20:01

How old are the kids (i know one is a baby)

Totalfuckingshitshow · 26/04/2024 20:20

JenniferBooth · 26/04/2024 20:01

How old are the kids (i know one is a baby)

Three and a few months.

OP posts:
RogueSt · 26/04/2024 20:28

LuckySantangelo35 · 26/04/2024 19:50

@RogueSt

read the post you have written ⬆️

how can you say that’s not misogynistic? Women having to put and shut up and dismiss their own needs

He was not sexist - he was not misogynistic - he was all pro-equal rights and he loved women. He was just richer, that is all. She walked out on him, there were consequences. That is all. No need to read sexism and misogyny into everything. All I was saying that this is life and lots of women stay with men who cheat because of money, because of being unable to provide for their offspring without men. Richer women can easily dump men who cheat or behave in a way that annoys them. Not everything is misogyny, racism or sexism.