Friend always late

[TaraMoon]

I have a friend who I often meet for a dog walk. We live fairly close to each other and tend to meet at a certain spot.
So, for example, we’ll agree to meet at 4pm at the park gate and so often she’ll turn up at 4.10. Not always but mostly. I think it’s getting worse … and I’d just love to know what goes on in the mind of someone who does this? Is it about control, is it disrespect, is it just sheer disorganisation?
She’s a lovely person in every other way but this is so rude and inconsiderate (to my mind), I just don’t understand why she thinks it’s ok to make me stand somewhere for 10 mins.
Yes, I could do this too but somehow I can’t bear to play the same game.
I’m not a confrontational person but last time I said ‘I see you like to keep me waiting’ quite sharply. She looked surprised but didn’t comment.
We’re meeting again this afternoon and already I feel irritated at the thought of her thinking her time is more important than mine!
Are you habitually late meeting people, and if so, do you think it’s fine? Why do you do it?!

I think some people get '4 o'clock' into their heads and use it as the time to set off rather than the time of the meeting. Not very bright perhaps but usually the explanation which is the least plotting, sinister one is the right one. I don't believe most people sit their tapping their fingers together until the last minute cackling to themselves gleefully about being controlling masterminds.

If it's a mate, the next time say '...and don't be fuckin' late!' no need to sit them down under the guise of concern with a walking on eggshells approach like some are suggesting!

I think 10 minutes is fine - I wouldn't worry about being 10 mins late or worry if someone was 10 mins late for something if I had arranged something informal with a friend at 4 I would aim for 4 and arrive somewhere close enough.

You seem more worried about being on time if she is your friend let her know how you feel and she may become more on time for your meet ups - i'd struggle with close friends with whom I needed to commit to plans within 10 minutes

Oh lord, I have a friend like this. She asked me to help her at her fleamarket stall as she was desperate.

I was in a wheelchair as I broke both femurs. I got up at 5 am and was ready for her to collect me at 6. At 6:10 she phones to say: "oh, I've just gotten up." After the 3rd Saturday of the same thing happening, I said I won't help anymore.

She was always for everything (apart from doctor's appointments).

She now lives on my property in a separate cottage. She texted me the other day that she was popping over... still took her 45 minutes to actually get to my house (about 25m). I have given up waiting for her.

In my friend group, 10 minutes wouldn’t really register with any of us for a casual meet up.

My mum is the sort to always be a few minutes early and go on about someone being even slightly late. She passive aggressively looks at her watch if someone arrives even 2 minutes late or says things like ‘I thought you’d had an accident.’ 😂

I think I’d struggle to be friends with someone who was really bothered about being 10 minutes for a casual meet up.

Have had quite a few friends like this over the years, and far far worse than 10 minutes! Lateness is annoying but 10 minutes is really not a big deal, it bothers you though so I'd always turn up more towards 4.10 if I were you, rather than sticking to said time and setting yourself up for frustration and just trying to let your annoyance go.

The only thing I've noticed poor timekeepers turn up bang on time for is employment! I'm not suggesting you pay her to turn up on time lol but sometimes it seems that's what it takes!

See that's why I could never be friends with on time people.

I think it’s unbelievably rude and I think people who do this are indulging in passive aggressive behaviour.

I had similar friend. We started meeting every day at the local arboretum for a good 1 hour walk with our dogs, she was always late. While waiting I met many other dog walkers and we all decided to meet at car park, walk at 2pm on the dot. 10-15 of us every day, anyone late could catch up as we walked same route each day, my friend was always moaning that we didn't wait, was out the loop of the conversation, no one interested in her drama/excuse for being late. One walker was an ex headmaster and used to ask for a parents letter excusing tardy time keeping.
Over the years I made some really good friends, we supported each other through stuff, collected dogs on route if someone unwell, we've been through births, deaths, marriages, divorce, puppies etc for just over 30 years. Had my friend not been so tardy I may never have met such a brilliant group of people.
It is a choice to be on time, I am autistic and it was important to me as my dog enjoyed the canine company as much as I enjoyed the company in rain, wind and sun.

It’s not a “casual meet up “ though is it? Sure 10 minutes is no biggie if you’re sitting in a warm coffee shop catching up on emails but standing with your dog in a cold and windy place waiting is a different matter. Particularly if you’ve rushed to get there on time. It’s very rude.

I'm quite curious how it works for people who want looser arrangements. I mean, I explained how I handle one friend upthread ( see her less often/invite her to mine etc.
I wonder how it plays out if, taking OPs example, you want to dog walk, and you have agreed to meet around 4. Do all parties assume 4 is really 4.30, or 5? Or might one arrive at 4, and be content waiting for 10-30 mins?
It's kind of wobbled my brain really.

So would you and your friends all turn up late? I guess if it works for you then fair play to you.

I’d definitely call a dog walk with a friend a casual meet up.

If she's late today why not just say something like "I've noticed you're always struggling to get here by 4pm, is it too much of a rush, shall we change it to meet at 4.15 now the evenings are longer? Otherwise I'm always standing around like a lemon."

Gets the point across without being confrontational. Then of course if she says no sorry 4pm is fine but continues being late, or agrees to 4.15 but doesn't get there until 4.25 you can escalate but if she's otherwise a good friend and you don't want to get into an argument about it its a hint.

Just be late - I'm not the best at time keeping but a long shot but even when it's going well I know which friends it's not worth showing up on time for. As in I'll be ready to go but won't leave as I know they'll be late.

I think these discussions get a little heated sometimes and stop being about 10mins or so lateness.
Personally I'm fine with someone being a bit late. Like 10 mins. It's irritating to have to wait much more than that, particularly outside in cold or wet weather.

So for me my brain will go -

Right your meeting X at ten you need to -

Have breakfast 20 mins
Dress 20min
Do pots and tidy 15 mins
Walk 15 mins to park

So I need to get up at 8.50.

But inevitably everything takes slightly longer or I don't allow for extra stuff. So I'm late.

Also my brain has a habit of going - ok you're ready, you have 20 minutes until it's time to leave why don't you sit down and relax. Then 20 minutes later it goes - ok time to go but you haven't let the dog out, packed snacks or changed babies nappy.

I am never late on purpose, my brain literally works against me.

I'm a bit of a late person, usually no more than 5 minutes. I've found it helpful to ask friends if we can meet at a time that allows me to leave the house on the hour. So in your example OP I'd ask to meet at 4.10/4.15 so I can leave the house at 4.

I find leaving the house at 3.50, 3.51, 3.52 etc really hard to stick to for some reason.

I try really hard not to be late and I get anxious and worked up when I am late. It's not through lack of trying. That's me anyway.

I am diagnosed ADHD and I HATE seeing people use this to excuse what is nothing but RUDE behaviour.

For example: I thought my gym session was 6.10pm. It was actually 5.50pm. I went to the gym and apologised profusely and explained in future, I won't rely on my memory, I will set a reminder in my phone.

Similar thing, I double booked something which meant I would be late meeting friends. Instead of just turning up late, I contacted my friend, asked them what was the latest it would be ok to turn up and explained what I'd done wrong. I gave them the option of me cancelling my other thing and not be late at all. Both options were valid. They chose to wait for me.

I thanked them for their kindess. The problem is mine to fix, not for other people to endure.

I have a phone which can set reminders for things, there really is no excuse not to use the function! It is a disability aid for ADHDers. It would be like having a sight problem but refusing to wear glasses, and then blaming others for not making writing big enough to read, or some shit like that.

Please DO NOT use neurodiversity as an excuse for poor human behaviour.

You can’t control other people only yourself
you know she’s going to be late
you know you don’t like it

so arrange to meet 10 mins before you intend to show up, stop meeting her, or deal with it.

it’s not about you at all, some people struggle with time. Lots of people find it to be a moral failing and understandably don’t like their own time wasted.
But if she’s otherwise lovely and says sorry I don’t think I could get worked up over 10 mins

I am diagnosed ADHD and I HATE seeing people use this to excuse what is nothing but RUDE behaviour.
mm because everyone experiences adhd the same way.

I have ADHD. I’m completely time blind.

I would be very cross about this, as others have said it’s not a typical casual meet up where you can spend the 10 minutes waiting somewhere warm and comfortable. I would be utterly mortified if I left someone standing in a field with their dog waiting for me without having told them I was running late.

My two closest friends are very relaxed timekeepers and for a long time I said nothing, just accepted the copious apologies for them being up to an hour late each time. I found it a bit upsetting, the assumption that I would wait every time. Eventually I decided I would wait for 15 minutes, and then leave if they still hadn’t arrived. They’re both much better now, though I still do have to leave occasionally - but it’s better than feeling like I’m not worth making an effort for.
One of them sent me a definition the other day, for the word ‘tidsoptimist’ - a person who is overly optimistic about the amount of time they have to get somewhere or prepare for something. I’ve always found that factoring in 20% extra time for travelling/preparing takes care of most things. My mother was chronically late when I was a child, and i remember frequently being embarrassed by it. She was super-organised, she just didn’t care about how we would be perceived by others.

Yes, this is it… the assumption that I’m ok with standing in the cold and wind, and not to even message about it. I find it weird coming from someone who is otherwise kind and considerate.

I mean, once in a while, fine… but to make a habit of it seems so rude. And the bubbly ‘Soooorrrry, the Tesco delivery came’ - and a casual laugh’ (or whatever the excuse is.)

I could start being late myself but as she’s not always late, I feel like I’d just be getting sucked into some silly game. And I find the thought of doing this weirdly stressful!

Really interesting to read all these different views, I’m genuinely interested in what motivates people to behave like this!

Some people just can't seem to plan the amount of time it takes to leave the house and arrive somewhere. My DH is like this, drives me mad. If he'd arranged to meet someone locally at 4, he would leave the house at 4.