Is this financial abuse

[Liliana2323]

Hi, ill try to summarise as it's a long, 18yr story!

• met when I was 22, hubby was 30
• I had no assets, he had 2 rental properties
• he got made redundant and suggested a move to Europe, I gave up my career and followed him
• have both worked online for the last 15yrs
• he bought house we're in outright. Not a million pound villa but a 200k huge renovation project. Both funded the renovations, he has done a lot of physical work on and off over the last 10 years
• married with a prenup for his rental properties and the one we're living in
• I started new business 7yrs ago, doing well
• he hasn't worked for 18 months so far, nor done renovations (until a couple of weeks ago)
• house still needs a lot of work, still dont even have 1 fully functioning bathroom!

So the main issue here is that he is quite financially controlling. We use his personal account for day to day bills and expenses, or my business card. my business dividends goes 50/50 to our personal accounts (as he set himself up as a 50% shareholder), then I have to immediately transfer mine to his account. If I go to the supermarket (rare, as he took over that role), or away for a family visit in the UK (twice a year max), he gives me a spare card in his name. He has a couple of loans we effectively both pay + savings, pension, investments and the 2 cars are both in his name.

This arrangement never felt quite right but whenever ive tried in the past to broach the subject it turns nasty and nothing ever changes, despite promises to have a joint account, him to invest money for me, me to have a pension etc it never happens.

It has come to a head for me really as we're 5 months pregnant with a first, long awaited baby. For the first 4 months he didn't seem interested at all, in fact he was quite difficult to be around and we had a lot of arguments with him saying quite horrific things about me/us. I felt terrible, had to sleep on an ancient mattress in the spare room (he snores) and generally uncared for and unsupported. Since Christmas he has in general been quite nice, despite a couple of nasty arguments.

I am thinking of whether to leave or not because i'm panicking about the future, whether we'll stay together, will I end up a single mum in a foreign country with an unfair custody situation and struggling to make ends meet, or should I go back to the UK and my family and friends. If I stayed abroad and we then divorced, I wouldn't be allowed to move back to the UK with my baby, unless he agreed.

I suppose i'm just wondering if this is really classed as financial abuse? Or just a stupid situation which has developed over the years, unintentionally?

I think i'm a bit of a pushover with him and I hate conflict. He's quite loud and aggressive so I have avoided the issue but enough is enough now, with a baby and our future to consider. I tried to talk about my concerns a few nights ago, he shouted a lot, told me he paid for this house and I should be grateful etc but nothing has changed since financially.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts!

Yes, can't wait to meet her! She is wriggling around as we speak ❤

Well he's basing his view on 'fairness' on the prenup but that was 10 years ago and im not even sure it was fair at the time, let alone now, with a baby on the way and having been left in a precarious financial situation despite 18 years together.

He wants the case heard in France and there was a chance it was possible and i'd come off quite badly, but I was told by the French solicitor today that he thinks its very likely we'll get it thrown out of the French court, which is reassuring!

You are right about the solicitor's, I didn't intend to speak to him today. I sent him an email with a question about my business account and he asked for a call. It was nice to speak to him but actually very upsetting, so will definitely avoid that from now on! Stupidly I do still care about him and hate the thought of him being upset but it's misplaced affection probably, as if he'd really cared about me, he'd have listened and made changes.

Remember OP if he really cared he would have signed over all your personal business accounts etc and stepped back from that. But he hasn't. No more calls, chin up and keep moving forward you can do this.

but I still feel selfish for putting myself and my future security first
You are putting your child first. She can not and should not grow up in an abusive household, and no matter how you try to minimise it, your husband was and still is, being abusive, controlling and manipulative. You are being a good parent. Hold that thought.

He wants the case heard in France
Avoid that at all costs. France still put men first. If you think they don't please read up on another posters divorce hell. Look up jamaisjedors threads, they are heartbreaking (but with a good ending) for the hoops the French system made her jump through.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/3448545-Confronting-DH-about-his-sulking?reply=83247560

Thinking about you OP. Hope you ok.

You are putting your child first - your husband is putting himself first all the time. I wonder if he even asks about his child. He is manipulative and trying to control you still with his talk of "anxiety". He maybe genuinely anxious about losing your business and having to pay some money to support his child - but a decent man would have signed your business over to you well before you left.

He wants to keep control.
He doesnt want to support his child.
He strung you along until he could file in France and became abusive again when he realised you'd already filed here.
You cant believe a word he says.
He is not a good man.

@Loveallaroundyou thanks for asking, I'm ok thanks. So busy sorting stuff out. Divorce process is a bit of a headache. My husband is playing games by ignoring the UK proceedings as he wants to have it heard in France (much better for him!) but is simultaneously being very nice. Asking about me and the baby fairly regularly. Offering to drive a car over for me in June (he cant afford to keep and already has the other but he knows I need one). He's trying to keep his foot in my business by continuing doing the bookkeeping which is annoying as I vant get him off it (although it is reducing my stress levels admittedly!) but I suppose it will all be sorted in the eventual settlement.

I still feel guilty for leaving so suddenly after 18 years. If it wasn't for the risk of being stuck in France once baby is born, perhaps id have tried to give him a chance to fix everything although an ultimatum wouldn't have gone down well!

Is it stupid to miss him (the good times)? I feel so sad that we won't be bringing our baby home from hospital together. Instead ill be going back to my parents and he'll be staying at his mums. Not the happy little family we had envisaged after trying for so many years

It isn't foolish to miss the good times. You care/d about him and in his way he obviously made you feel cared for at some point. But he is still trying to screw you over with the divorce proceedings and still refusing to fuck off out of your business. He's still trying to control you and you would have felt so trapped with the baby and him calling all the shots. You've made a really tough decision, but it was the right one and you will raise your child in the right kind of family, however that family may look with love, care and respect.

The happy little family only ever existed in your imagination. In reality he
would be dictating everything you did with the baby, who was allowed to visit and when, how much work you had to do in YOUR business, how much you'd be allowed to spend on the baby.

You gave him 18 years, he didnt get better. If you hadnt left suddenly he'd have found a way to stop you leaving at all. He wants to divorce in France, he'd like you to have the baby in France -it's all about his wants not about you.

He's nice when he wants something, when he doesnt get it he'll be abusive again. Tape his rants and play them back when you weaken. Let him deliver the car to a relative, wouldnt put it past him to force you into it and drive you back to France.

Thanks both. I know I must sound like im falling for it all but im not really, just feeling quite emotional/hormonal at the moment and sad for what could have been. It's a shame he didn't show me that he cared whilst I was pregnant and in France. Bit late now and im sure there is an ulterior motive as he's still playing games. Him and his solicitor are claiming he was never served UK papers properly so we're having to use a process server equivalent which is just dragging everything out. I just hope and pray that the French Judge chucks the case back to the UK, although I bet my husband has paid top whack for a solicitor

Hi ladies! Just wanted to update you after a long call with my ex yesterday. We have a French court hearing on 20th June to determine jurisdiction (France or UK, my solicitors think we have a strong case for the UK but its by no means definite).

Since he finally had no choice but to accept the UK court's documents last week (after ducking and diving in France for a few months), he's now offered to drive one of the cars back to the UK next week so I no longer have to borrow my parent's car. I think its also as he doesn't want to pay to renew the insurance or tax which are due!

When he originally booked the trip he said it was too upsetting to see me so would leave the car and hide the key but yesterday he called me as he wanted to check the baby was ok (scan showed possible slowing of growth) and mentioned on the call that him and his dad had come up with an out of court settlement to avoid capital gains, which apparently i'd be very happy with. I imagine it will be less than the proposal my UK solicitor gave him 2+ months ago!

As far as I can tell, he intends to remain in France and visit our baby a few days per month.

Every time I speak to him I end up feeling upset and anxious. I'm frustrated as he has still taken no responsibility for why I had to leave and goes on about how anxious he feels and how his family are so worried about him etc.... however im the one pregnant, homeless and living with my parents at 40 and working hard to survive, whereas he is swanning around in the south of France not really working and living the good life!!

Get one of your parents to take the car off him tbh you don't need the stress and unless he is a Dr with access to your medical records he will just be verbally told baby is fine no need to see him

Stay strong!

You agree it would be upsetting to meet up and more stress in your already difficult life might be bad for the baby. So someone else will accept the car keys for you (relative, friend, anyone available). You'll get your solicitor to look at his proposals as you are concentrating on your health at present.

Get parent or friend to accept the car from him. You do not need to meet him.

His proposals can be emailed directly to your solicitor. You do not need to meet him.

He cannot check on the baby as it's physically impossible as it isn't born yet. You do not need to meet him.

Remember - Stress can have a huge negative impact on a mother's pregnancy, both physically and mentally. An abusive man causing unnecessary stress is actively harming a baby. Therefore DO NOT MEET HIM.

Stop communicating by phone, it is utterly ridiculous that you are still accepting his calls - why isn't he blocked?? Communicate only by email or your solicitor.

Last but not least. You have not emotionally disconnected from a very abusive man and are still letting him manipulate and control you. You still consider him to have caring and decent qualities but you seem to have forgotten that you were so trapped, so desperate, that you had to secretly flee with the aid and support of a "rescuer". That is not how normal people leave a partner but it's how a seriously abused person does. STOP COMMUNICATING DIRECTLY WITH HIM.

Dear ex, please email details of your proposal. I'll update you with any pregnancy info. I'd find it very stressful to meet up and there's no need. Leave the key in x place.

That's it. Look after yourself.

It's all about him. Still. But realistically these men don't change. No matter how much you want them to.

Good Lord. Do. Not. Accept. Anything.
Do. Not. Speak. To. Him.

He is playing a game.

Someone else gets car.
Proposal (which will be shit) through lawyer.

The quicker you accept tgis the quicker it will be over. The car is bargaining for his "proposal" it is all STILL financial abuse.

I want to remind you of this from your OP. Not a man to meet up with when you're pregnant and stressed.

It has come to a head for me really as we're 5 months pregnant with a first, long awaited baby. For the first 4 months he didn't seem interested at all, in fact he was quite difficult to be around and we had a lot of arguments with him saying quite horrific things about me/us. I felt terrible, had to sleep on an ancient mattress in the spare room (he snores) and generally uncared for and unsupported. Since Christmas he has in general been quite nice, despite a couple of nasty arguments.

He is a despicable man and preying on you while you are most vulnerable.

Do not meet him face to face because he will attempt to manipulate you. Get someone else to pick up the car or if you absolutely must go bring someone with you and stay with them.

Do you want a French left hand drive car in the uk? Tell him to sell it - or you sell it remotely - is it in your name?

cars aren’t sentimental items unless it’s vintage - get rid and buy a uk car
stay cool OP 😎

Thanks everyone. I totally understand why you think I'd be stupid to meet him but i suppose I just want to see if he will acknowledge his behaviour has put us in this situation, perhaps he has had time to think but can't say it on record? Also intrigued by his proposal. Also I miss him which is stupid I know. I'm stressed about finances and also my mum just got taken away by ambulance this morning with a post-op infection so all very emotional!

Ps of course there is no way I would agree to a thing, I purely just want him to tell me what it is and see what else he has to say. With our baby due in 6 weeks it would reduce the concerns I have over seeing him for the first time when she is born

Why is he 50% shareholder in your business?

but i suppose I just want to see if he will acknowledge his behaviour has put us in this situation,

He has, and still is, abusing you. He will never admit it, but he will twist everything and make it all your fault, that you are the unreasonable one. He will upset you and stress you out - which will flood your body with stress hormones which can harm the baby. You've said the baby might be struggling already so put her first. Don't let him abuse her via you. Six weeks is still enough time to lose her, she is not safe yet. Block him until she is born. Let your solicitor deal with any paperwork.

I was too cross to post earlier. What @AutumnFroglets said ^

You really, really still do not see what he is doing and you still want reconcilliation or apology of some kind.
You will not get it.
"Offer" straight to your lawyer.

This man does not care about you one jot. You must not see him.