Horrible row with DH, and I don’t know how to move forwards.

[Pinkswans]

DH and I have a three year old and a six month old. The six month old is going through a challenging sort of period where she seems desperate to be on the move but isn’t quite there yet - lots of hair grabbing and grabbing skin on your neck and twisting and squirming. It isn’t her fault but in all honesty spending time with her isn’t particularly enjoyable. The three year old is easier in many ways but is sidelined because the baby is so demanding and he reacts to this.

I have been struggling with DH lately because things feel a bit chaotic. The house is a mess, it feels like we’re treading water.

So to give some context here, we were looking through some photos the other day and I saw a scarf I was wearing and said something like ‘wonder what happened to that.’ DH said it was under the stairs and I said pretty jovially that if he found it he’d get some brownie points. He then completely emptied under the stairs, bringing me the most random stuff - he found the scarf but there are now eleven bags of crap in the corner of the hall. We also unearthed DS’s old pushchair which he doesn’t go in now. This morning, DS was in a silly mood so I suggested he go with DH to put the pushchair in the garage (DH rents a garage in the village) it should have been a ten minute trip at most. Forty five minutes go by and meanwhile I’m dealing with a fussy, irritable baby and I get a photo from DH - he was on the park with DS.

it isn’t that I have an issue with them going to the park: of course I don’t. But what really upset me was the way it’s just assumed he can do what he wants when he wants. We’ve had weeks of this and I got really upset. I feel we aren’t parenting as a team at all, if I try to talk to him about a worry or issue with one of the children he gives me the brush off, anything ‘important’ like potty training and weaning are left to me (and both are going badly!)

The problem is I don’t know how to address it. When I try to talk to him he just gets defensive so how?

I think you need a break and I don't think the pile on here is helping you at all.

You're not sleeping at night, you're stressed when awake and you don't know when it's going to end.

When you feel like that, every little thing is massive. Of course you're not furious he took DS to the park, but it's ANOTHER feckin thing on top of the million things. Of course you're happy DH found your scarf, but now there's ANOTHER job to have to do and all of this is just adding and adding and adding to you reaching the point of just having had enough.

You don't need to explain to DH why the park or the bags of crap in the hall annoyed you. You need to get him to see that you are really struggling and you need to schedule in some time away from the kids.

It's hard for men to understand how stressful it is to never be away. Explain THAT. Then put a time on the calendar where you are going to get to leave the house for a few hours and even if you come home to the house being a shit tip etc, you can be damn sure he'll have a better understanding of what you've been going through!

If you’re still here OP, I really, really think it sounds like you need a proper break, even if it’s just for a few hours. Can you go to a spa or an art exhibition? Or to lunch with a friend? It’s important to have downtime and it sounds like you’re losing your rag because you’re not getting any. I personally become a total shrew without social contact or being able to go outside on my own for a bit, even if it’s just to read a book in a café. I always am a way better mum for having time away. I think you need to work out what you want and state it in simple terms. If he’s a good man he will understand you are at breaking point and do his best to facilitate some time away for you.

I genuinely don't see what he did wrong but appreciate there's more to the story.

It feels like you have a set thought process on how things should go and get frustrated thst your Dh isn't on the same page.

It's hard with a baby and there is a tendency to have set routine la. Things will get easier as your kids age

I think you sound like you are struggling.

I think you are getting a hard time because people can’t see the issue with the example you have given. I am guessing there is resentment for a bigger / longer term reason?

You might find it helpful to take a step back and work out what the real issue is.

It has also made me wonder if you have considered if you might have postnatal depression?

I can see why you think you and your husband are not communicating as a team. I think you gave the impression from your op you were angry he went to the park - but is the real issue that you wanted a text from him to let let you know he had changed his plans?

if it was me I would have assumed my hubby was giving me a break from having both the baby and toddler in the house. It’s interesting you have taken it as your hubby was being selfish.

please hang in there - the baby / toddler stage tries all marriages / partnerships it does get better

1000%.

This post appears to be full of moronic people who can't/won't read but just want to be cruel anyway.

Who goes onto a post like this by someone clearly struggling and starts on her the way some of these posters have. It's awful to read and people don't think about OP being a real human being who is really struggling on the other end of these messages. It's horrendous to read.

Huge drip feeding here. I feel sorry for your baby. She is only 6 months and you have already decided she is miserable and hard work. It’s a lovely age and a pity you aren’t enjoying it. Your husband took your son to the park which is a good thing. It gave you time to spend with the baby. Maybe you should stop feeling so hard done by and resentful and appreciate your kids and a husband who seems to be trying to do the right thing

@Vinrouge4 you are absolutely vile. I feel sorry for YOUR baby, if they are unfortunate enough to have been born to such an unfeeling and vindictive person as yourself

It's tough because the OP has attacked posters genuinely trying to help!!

If you see this @Pinkswans I want you to know that I am both crying and raging for you at the reception you have had from far too many of the PPs on hear today.

I read the whole of the first page of this thread and couldn't take any more of the responses you were getting, they literally made me feel sick, so I switched to just reading your posts - some of which obviously had quotes of what some of what a PP was saying to you.

I'm a grandma now, but I can still at least partially remember the exhaustion of the baby years, and I honestly do not know how you are coping. I thought that my first baby was difficult, but she was a doddle compared to your DD, and that wasn't because I was doing anything better than you are, I was just a lot luckier than you. I was also lucky that my DH wasn't the sort to out drinking with mates, well until he left me for someone else, but that is a different story, maybe for another day.

It seems to me that you have two overwhelming problems, and quite a few other ones, but I think that the two most overwhelming ones you have are obviously for the first one, your utter exhaustion, and I think your second one is loneliness. I think that you are missing your husband and partner so much. From what you have told us here, he seems to have just disappeared.

Yes, you can still see his body, you might even get to sleep beside it for parts of the night. You get to hear a voice that sounds like his voice, but he doesn't seem to actually be there in the consciousness that you knew and fell in love with. To me it seems that the partnership part of your relationship is on hold - but hopefully not for too long, so please don't give up hope about you two reconnecting again. An "after you have had children together" relationship can never be the same as a "before you had children" one. But hopefully if you both want it to, and when you both have the time and energy to devote to it - which unfortunately will probably not be for a little while yet - between the two of you, your relationship can grow into a stronger and closer relationship than you ever had before, afterall you now share the two most precious things in your world!

I think that your DH is being very selfish at the moment, and I also think that he is probably totally unaware of how selfish he is being. It is possible that he is also overwhelmed with having two little ones, and a wife who is too tired to give him the attention he probably still expects to have. I don't like making 'general' statements, but I will risk it here, I think that an awful lot of men do not understand (even after their children are born) that life will never, and can never, and even should not ever, be the same as it was before their children came along. But I am not making any excuses for your man, or any of the other men who have their noses put out of joint because they are no longer their wives main concern.

You quite understandably want your partner and hopefully, best friend too, back. You also hopefully don't expect him to be exactly the same partner that you had before you had your dear children (anymore than he should expect you to be exactly the same as you were bc - before children), but you very fairly should expect him to join you as a supportive double act, who will show his love for you by sharing the care of both of your DCs, and by showing that he still wants and needs to spend quality time with you, which now includes sharing time together with your lovely 2 children as well. That time could be the four of you all wrapped up warm and going to the park together, and then maybe having cuppas - and a hot chocolate for the 3 year old - in a nice café afterwards. If the weather is too bad to go out in, then having an impromptu picnic all together on the lounge floor can be fun, and when the weather gets warmer, and if you can afford it, visits altogether to places like a zoo, can be great fun too.

You sound very strong to me OP, and if you had only ever been a single mum you would have coped amazingly well! But you are not a single mum, you have a live in partner, the babies dad, so of course he should be both considering you, and communicating with you, and also sharing the mental load with you, as well as the physical one. Why só many of the PP's here today don't seem to understand that is very strange to me.

I hope you are fast asleep now OP, and that you can get a longer sleep without so many interruptions tonight xx

You don't sound in the best possible place and I would speak to your hv as a priority. As for your dh I would be having words about how you feel. At the moment it sounds as you do all the thinking and running around after this family. It certainly isn't the end of the world that your toddler hadn't eaten by 8am so I wouldn't hold on to that. Surely if you are struggling with your 6 month old then trying to potty train your eldest right now isn't the best use of time. Potty training requires energy and consistency and you are tired as it is. Why not wait until your dd is out of this phase? Is there a reason why your dh cant take some annual leave and you can both tackle it or he could take the lead? As for the squirming and being unsettled put her down in a safe place, so a play pen or bouncer, use a sling if it helps. At worst she'll cry for a bit, that really isn't the end of the world. Your sanity is just as important.

Be kinder to yourself. You're in the thick of it with two little kids. Be clear with your dh that you need him to take the baby of an evening allowing you to spend more time with your son and then alternate doing bedtime routines.

He sounds very much like a disney dad but you sound quite pent up too. That isn't the best combination in my opinion. You both need to talk calmly without attacking each other and see where it gets you. Best of luck op. x

I don’t think your DH did anything wrong here

OP I'm sorry you've had so much stick on here, when you're clearly struggling enough as it is. It is so hard when babies are difficult and you're exhausted, especially if you've got a toddler as well, I certainly couldn't manage that. My 6 month old is pretty chilled, but also obviously as a baby glued to me, and by the evening I'm desperate just for 10 minutes alone. It honestly does get easier snd this phase will pass, but I know that doesn't help much at the time.

It isn't the best advice, but does your baby sleep better with you? I found I could get twice the sleep if I let mine in my bed, and you'd be amazed how much other things Click in to place when you're rested. I know it isn't a good sleep habit, and might be harder to get out of down the line, but you also can't function on minimal sleep forever. I hope things get easier for you soon

Tbh nothing is very obvious from your posts. You are getting snippy with posters who are trying to help, assuming that everything is clear from your posts when it really is far from it. It strikes me that you're upset with your husband for lack of communication, but judging by your posts it is you who struggles to communicate your needs and then gets angry when they aren't met.

What is it that you want, if not time away from the baby? Family time? 6 pages in and that'd only just coming to light. It sounds like you really need to improve your own communication.

I can understand your overwhelm. This is how it feels to be stressed and burned out.

People pointing out an alternative perspective doesn't mean they're saying you're wrong to feel how you feel. You seem to be locked into the mindset where one of you must be right and the other one must be wrong, but life isn't always like that. Sometimes you're both trying your best and nobody's in the wrong, but you still feel stressed and burned out despite your combined efforts. It's shit, but it isn't anyone's fault. Not yours and not his. To look at it from this angle, those eleven bags were the results of your DH spending time searching for a scarf he believed you wanted. He'll have seen sorting through the cupboard as housework/tidying up. I doubt it was high on his list of fun things to do, but he probably thought it would cheer you up. Because you're so overwhelmed, you don't perceive it this way. Neither of you is to blame for that.

The trouble with burnout is that it does make it hard not to take things personally. I can see this in the post you made about waking up in the early hours with your three-year-old. You wrote that you went into him and then left him because he hurled abuse at you, and eventually your DH heard him crying and went himself. That choice of words does suggest that you saw your son as deliberately being horrible to you, but he's three. Three-year-olds don't have any impulse control to speak of and they're not capable of calming themselves down. If they wake up in the night feeling upset or scared for whatever reason they're quite likely to shout, scream, and generally make themselves unpleasant. If you weren't feeling so depleted and drained, you wouldn't take it personally and you certainly wouldn't be describing it as abuse, but right now it's impossible for you not to feel hurt by everything.

I think you need a proper break away from the kids and the house, even if it's just for a couple of hours each week. If your DH was willing to sort through a packed cupboard to find a scarf I'm sure he'd be willing to make this happen for you. Perhaps he could have spend time with DS and a relative could watch the baby while you go to see a friend, take a stroll, or just sit in a cafe. Try and make it a regular thing. It might also be worth having a chat with your GP. Post-natal depression can feel a lot like what you're describing, but even if it's not that, they might have some suggestions to help with sleep and feelings of overwhelm.

@PinkswansI really, really think you need to go to your GP and have a chat about how you are feeling. PND can manifest itself in so many different ways. Babies can be hard work and some babies can be deemed demanding or difficult and sometimes this can be due to their innate ability to pick up on the mental state of their primary caregivers. You may just be tired which can lead to irritability and irrationality but for your own sake I would urge you to get checked out and explore the possibility of PND. I know that you have bonded with your baby but PND doesn't necessarily rear it's ugly head immediately post partum, it can take some time. Please seek professional help. Everything will be ok.

Oh for fuck sake!!! Have you had a 'difficult ' baby before?? No, you clearly fucking haven't or you wouldn't have posted such a smug comment.

My first baby was an angel, a complete unicorn baby and toddler. I thought it was my great routines and parenting - hahahahahahaha.
Second was a CHALLENGE. But overall, looking back, pretty fucking easy.
My third - well, he nearly broke me. Nothing worked, he was a demanding baby 90% of the time. Didn't mean I wasn't besotted with him, or had pnd. It just meant he was bloody difficult and I would have much rather spent time with the older two than the baby, as it was shit.

OP, ignore snarky comments from others on here. I truly didn't understand the few friends that had awful babies. I thought, it couldn't be thaaaat bad, surely! Until I had one. Then i wanted to give myself a slap for all my preconceptions.

I get it. Your dh wants to swan off with no communication or time constraints, whenever he wants. Yet you are probably stuck on maternity leave with a crying miserable baby 24/7 and a 3yo you feel guilty for not giving enough attention to. Given the choice, I'm sure you'd rather have your dh help support you with the baby on the 2 family days you get, rather than continue the groundhog days of drudgery and loneliness that you have Monday to Friday.

In a not dissimilar situation I was depressed.

I did not "have depression," I was in an extremely depressing situation, and couldn't see a way out.

Depression is not like catching a disease. Sometimes it is a perfectly normal human reaction.

I think I get it OP. My DH is prone to this and just requires very explicit instruction. He would do the exact same thing with the older one and disappear off with her leaving me at home with the baby who I was at home alone with all bloody week already! And then would say “oh well I thought you’d like a bit of a break” ITS NOT A BREAK IF IM STILL LOOKING AFTER A 7 MONTH OLD. I felt like I needed to get that tattooed on my arse at one point I was saying it so much.

he will also still randomly do stuff like if we are meant to be having “a quiet day at home” he will suddenly declare that the garage door needs fixing or he needs to mow the lawn and off he will pop, headphones in, podcast on, under the guise of XYZ needs doing. When I then ask well what are the rest of us going to do he’ll say “can’t you just do some baking with them or something?” And all of a sudden I’m in charge of a preschooler and a toddler trying to stop them bickering while also following a Mary berry recipe to make something that will probably end up inedible. It’s only when I then started saying “it’s ok I’ll mow the lawn, you can bake with them! You’ll have such fun 😬” that it finally sank in. I recall I had to paint a load of fences one summer for it to finally hit home..!

so I agree with pp just send them both and stay at home and have a bath.

OR

always make sure you go out with them as a four.

Plus do not let him pull that shit at home. Do not be the default parent. Force him to step up. And ask for what you need from him very directly.

I understand. He does what he wants, when he wants. He does fun things like taking the toddler to the park leaving you with the not fun baby and the not fun cleaning up. He leaves you to cope with the not fun weaning and potty training which isn't going well. Our children are grown but my husband tells me when he is leaving the house, where he is going and generally for how long and vice versa. He also shared the non-fun things when they were little and tidied up after himself. All I can say is that some other posters have very low standards.

I remember a post on here from someone once about how she'd had a row with her husband on holiday. In a moment of frustration, she'd accused him of eating bran flakes deliberately so he'd spend longer in the loo and leave her with their kids while he luxuriated in the peace and quiet of the bathroom. This was all reported in a lighthearted tone, but the replies were generally along the lines of supportive stories of similar rows and people sympathising with how frustrating life with tiny children can be.

I'm sorry you haven't had what you wanted from this thread, but I hope that you managed to get through to your husband.

I’m really sorry you’re having such a hard time of it- and also that other people on MN are being such D in their comments. I agree with you; for whatever reason they are wilfully misunderstanding you.

Things sound really tough for you right now. Your DD is being hard work ( I have an 8month-old DD who is similar!) and your DH is dipping into parenthood basically doing the easy high-reward bits without even bothering to communicate with you effectively so you can plan your day.

Please ignore those who don’t get how hard that is. Trust yourself in feeling that you DO need and deserve more support, and you are not unjust in feeling frustrated right now.

In terms of resolving things - firstly, I think you need temporary reprieve - is there a close family member of friend who could look after the kids for a few hours to give you some respite?
Secondly, I can only suggest being frank with your DH. He is not pulling his weight and that is having an impact on you and his DD. That is not sustainable. He needs to step up and work with you to make a better plan for day-to-day parenting for the both of them so it’s manageable for you as well as him. You deserve his support and any decent partner would acknowledge that and act accordingly xx

OP, you sound exhausted. It also sounds as if you need a talk with your husband. Of course, he should know everything you've explained here - because he is your partner, and so he should see what the problems are and how drained you are. But you may need to spell all of this out to him.

I hope things get better for you

You seem unhinged

@Pinkswans you need to start letting go a bit. You are overwhelmed, and still trying to do everything. Your daughter has 2 parents. You are dealing with all the crappy bits, and then annoyed that your husband isn't doing any of the crappy bits.
I'm a good bit further down the parenting path than you and I can tell you my biggest regret is not just leaving my husband to it. Stepping in when I thought it was too difficult for him, whereas I could handle it better. Taking over things because I was "better able" to soothe them, or I knew which way they liked to be held, or fed, or i knew which song they liked best. You get the picture.
He can just go off whenever he feels like it? So can you. Get up tomorrow morning and tell him you are going out for a couple of hours. Leave him home with the 2 of them. He mightn't do things the same way as you, but he won't break them either. You'll most likely come home to a messy house and they mightn't even be dressed, but so what? The more you do, the less he'll do. The more you leave him to it, the more he'll figure out.
Women do have a tendency to take control. If you're off and he's in work the lion's share of the parenting is done by you. But you need to let go somewhat. He mightn't do it the same way as you do, but he doesn't have to. He'll figure it out. But you have to let go.

Mumsnet is pure poison these days and this thread is a great example. Cheers for that Daily Mail, sending over all of your numpty readers🖕
The number of posters who have commented that the OP should consider herself lucky her DH has done the bare minimum of parenting today, is tragic. He didn't even feed his child breakfast, he waited for OP to get up.
Thing is @Pinkswans he won't get any better. The kids just get older and easier. He is free to do as he pleases, when he pleases and doesn't even need to take 10 seconds to message you about his plans. That wouldn't be for me. I like that my DH is on my wavelength and is always looking for ways to make my life easier (health stuff going on at the mo) I don't need to tell him I need him because he is there with me.
You do need a break. You need a full day and night to lay in bed, have a bath, watch shit on your phone, eat crap. Then the day after that you need to spend some 1-1 time with your little boy. The weekend after that can be family time. He wouldn't agree to that though would he? Because that would mean proper parenting and he is just not capable.
A sit down talk is needed here, unless he is incredibly stupid he can see how much you are struggling at the moment. See if he has any suggestions to make things a little easier.
Good luck.

He was avoiding difficult baby duty. The bags in the hall shit is passive aggression.