How am I going to get through this :( (long post sorry!)

[MyHeadIsSpinning]

I've been with DH for over 10yrs, married for 1 and have a new baby. LO was born prem and we have been going through hell but she is home now and doing well.

DH has always been indecisive and before each major milestone, getting engaged, a house, married etc he has had a panic and discussed splitting up as he doesn't think he loves me enough to get engaged, buy a house, get married etc.

However once we have talked things through and he has had his stress he always decides that he does love me and wants to be with me.

Surprisingly getting pregnant was one thing that he didn't stress about and was really happy that we were expecting. When I delilved LO early and it was touch and go for me and LO - apparently cos I was out of it but have been told by various people - DH was a bit of a mess which was understandable, ie couldn't speak for crying. However he won't talk about this and although has been supportive during the weeks LO was in hospital on SCBU I feel he could have been there for me more than he was.

Over the weekend things have come to a head. We've been having a few niggly arguements and he has said over the past few weeks that he isn't sure if he loves me enough (again) and has been thinking about us splitting up. Yesterday I made a real effort - did my hair and make up etc and tried hard to make an effort - we had agreed to do this the night before. However DH didn't notice the effort I had made and was sullen all day only speaking when I spoke to him etc. When I cracked and said that his behaviour was upsetting me and I was upset that he hadn't commented that I looked nice - he said that he hadn't noticed that I'd made an effort and didn't think I looked as though I had particularyly

We had a 'discussion' during which he told me that;

He feels it would have been easier if I had died when havign LO as this would have ade things easier for him ie wouldn't have to decided to stay with me or not - this really hurt and he knows how bad it sounded.

He doesn't feel that he loves me enough and wishes that he's 'had the balls to leave me before marrying an having a baby'

When I asked why he married me he said he thought it would be a solution to how he was feeling about being not sure about the relationship and everyone else seemed to think it was a good idea. He was NOT pressurised into marrying me or indeed even staying with me.

The arguement went on until I said that I wasn't prepared to share our baby and him be a weekend dad. That isn't why I brought her into the workd to be passed about between two homes etc. I told him that it's all or nothing he either has us both or looses us both cos I'm not beign a part time mum and our daughter needs a full time dad.

He went to walk out of the room and I asked him how he felt right then - he replied like he wants to die

I left him to cool off and then went upstairs to see him. He was sat on the bed crying. He Said that he loves our daughter and doesn't want to be a part time dad but isn't sure that he loves me enough etc. He broke down and cried so hard he was howling and holding on to me - this is not like him he cries but only a little. This was a major breakdown kind of cry.

We have decided to see how things go for a couple of months and both make a real effort to make our marriage work He has said that he would rather fall back in love with me and make it work but at the moment isn't sure that this is possible.

I just feel so empty and don't know what to think. Part of me feels so sorry for him cos I love him and he is hurting and I want to make things better but can't) I have suggested that maybe he is depressed after the birth and the general situation and he said that he doesn't think so cos he just feels the same way as he has previously.

On the other hand I'm so angry with him for what he has said and that he is taking away this precious time with my new baby cos I can't enjoy her as much as I would cos I'm worried about the future and being on my own if he does leave us.

He finds talking difficult so I'm off to buy a couple of notepads for us both to write our feeligns in about the relationship and anything else over the coming months - I feel for me it will be cathartic and help when I really want to talk and he doesn't, for him I hope that writing down his feeligns and fears will help put them into perspective and help him to work through how he feels whatever the outcome may be.

I just feel sooo sad and can't stop thinking about what he has said and also part of me thinks that maybe we shoudl just call it a day and I can move on and find someone who does love me although not sure this would work as the person I want to love me doesn't Also I really don't want to be a single parent.

raggety, I think that post goes EXACTLY to the heart of the matter, you are very wise.

"now that you have a small baby, you expect him to be more of a man, to look after you for a change, to look after the baby with you. This is not what he wanted, too much responsibility. He wants to go back to coasting"........that is IT.

Never forget MHIS that this is a man who started sleeping with another woman while his wife and premature duaghter were in special care in hospital.

I mean, that really is despicable.

I understand that you've always wanted to be with him, make it work etc and I'm not saying you SHOULDN'T, if he shapes up - but never forget to have that fact of what he did at the forefront of your mind because I think it will make you stronger.

He's a weasel at the moment. Don't be too keen to have him back - look at what he's done RECENTLY. If you can seperate that from all the history it will make you stronger.

I still think you are doing so well and I take my hat off to you for your dignity!

Feeling strangely calm atm....even tho I think that he has gone out either with her alone or with work - which means she will be there and he will no doubt take her home....

Think that the way I see it at the moment is that I don't have any control over what he does. But it isn't my worry or problem anymore. If he is seeing her that just proves he is not worth my thoughts or time.

The damage has already been done when he was seeing her over the past 7 months.

Is this the start of me accepting the relationship we had is over?....

Or am I going to be hit by yet another tidal wave of grief tomorrow

QUOTE
Is this the start of me accepting the relationship we had is over?....

Or am I going to be hit by yet another tidal wave of grief tomorrow

UNQUOTE

Maybe both? You are doing really well IMO and you deserve much better than this.

mhis - wanted to post on your thread too. our situations are so similar - me being the strong one and h being carried until birth of ds, when I wanted him to be more of a man and he couldnt do that. he went off with ow - actaully lived with her for a couple of weeks. dithered about who he was going to go for. needs to change a hell of a lot if I am going to have him back.
If you find a way of blocking out the sex images, please let me know. That part is really hard.
and I dont know if I want him back or not - dont I deserve someone better? but, well you know where my head is at right now.
I think all we can do is coast it as 'friends', demand openness, and wait for a change. I am finding it SO hard not to commit to him immediately OR not to throw in the towel immediately. But I know I need to wait, that is the hardest thing. in the meantime I am going to get on with my own life, and if he changes he can join me in it. If not, well then I have my own life sorted already.

thinking of you ((mhis))

((((ratbunny))))

I feel exactly the same as you
Not spoken to him since last weekend apart from when he picked up dd on Tues. He is due to take dd for a few hrs tomorrow morning but txt earlier asing what I was doing today and asking if he could come and see me and dd.........I didn't see the txt until a few hrs later and had made plans anyway so txt back saying that.

I'm fluctuating like you are, re what I truely want.

His constant swapping re what he wants doesn't help.

I'm not doing too bad on the sex images tbh somehow notthinking about it too much but anyhthing remotely sexual even a couple kissing sets me off thinking about them together

I agree the images are easier to block if you dont think about it at all. Like you say, even a couple kissing spurs them on. I hate to think what it would be like if anything happened between me and h...

Well done for saying you had plans already. Dont cancel anything for him. Just try to carry on your life. I know its hard. I was always really strong until I saw him, then crumbled afterwards. Even had to get my mum to be the go-between when he came to see ds. Its easier now, only because I know he's not with ow anymore. But I still dither...

That's exactly what I plan to do ratbunny. I really did have plans and there was no way I was going to cancel for him. He didn't txt til midafternoon wanting to see us today ! = he had a lie in and did his own thing, wjilst I was up early with LO, looking after her, sorting her feeds out, doing the food shopping etc...then when he was at a loose end he thought he could just pop round!

I gave him the opportunity to see DD yesterday evening but he couldn't decide if he wanted to/was free etc when I suggested it on Tues.

So difficult to know what to do for the best isn't it

This probably isnt really relevant to your situation, but I'll tell you anyway - a friend of mine suggested writing an access arrangement for h when he was arsing about, trying to cancel / postpone then complaining he wanted to see ds more.
I wrote down all the times in the next 4 weeks that he could have access, and asked him to confirm they were ok with him. when he next tried to rearrange the access time (about 2hours before he was due, he wanted to change it for the next day - I had made plans ffs!), i said sorry we had an agreement. and so he came at the prearranged time. At least then I couldnt get accused of not letting him see ds when he wanted to rearrange (though he did accuse me of that of course, but I knew I was being reasonable and he wasnt), and he couldnt call me out of the blue wanting to see him either.
just wanting to drop in on you and dd isn't fair. personally, I needed to psyche myself up for the fact he would be coming round.

Is it different for men? If someone told me to make appointments to see my children.... well I couldn't bear it.
I know your H has behaved extremely badly to you and therefore to your DD too as he's endangered her parents marriage which is the very thing that makes children feel safe and I know how hard it is for you to see him, and how you have to try to salvage your life from all this, but if I was separated from my children in this way it would just break me in two.

Quinne I would feel exactly the same. When he takes her for a couple of hours I ache to have her back

I can't understand how he can do it.

Hmmm for the first time yet he has picked her up on time. No conversation. He asked no questions about DD. I just gave her a kiss, said bye bye and handed her over.

He was pleasant enough despite no really conversation.

Wonder if he is starting to grow up and realising that I'm not the bad guy here. The only person loosing out on him not arriving on time is him. Obviously I'm not stupid and I'm not reading too much into it but compared to the other time she has collected DD he was on time, polite, not forcing conversation etc. I relaise that he could still balls it up and bring her back late, be an arse when he does etc.

Seems kind of sheepish.

well, so he SHOULD, MHIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Never did a man need to feel more sheepish than your H!

Anyway, hope he's sensible on the return visit too and that you get through it all ok today

Quick update.

H brought DD back 20 min late. I politely pointed out (again) that this is not acceptable. He agreed but didn't offer any explanation why he was late.

He stayed for an hour and half during which we chatted - sometimes just about normal stuff and sometimes about 'us'.

Basically he has said that;

He is fluctuating re what he wants but says he isn't ruling out trying again, this is what he wants but isn't sure if he wants it for the right reasons, ie because he loves me and wants to make it work or because it is the easier option, past history etc.

He has stopped seeing OW because he doesn't want to jepordise this...but admitted when I asked that she is still txting him and he has replied.

OW wants to continue with a relationship and has offered for him to stay with her. He has said no because it doesn't feel right because he isn't sure if we are going to get back together Would have preferred him to say he has said no because it's over and he wants to make his marriage work.

He was talking more towards trying again. He said that he isn't a bad person but realises what he has done is wrong. He said that he is still the person he always was. I agreed that his character is the same BUT he has done and said some very hurtful things and in this way he has changed. I pointed out that I too have changed because of this. I said that I can't take the chance of making a go without being certain he wouldn't do it again. He said that he wouldn't do it again because he wouldn't want to go through this again.

He asked for a hug. I said I couldn't do that. He respected it.

He asked about DD and what she has been doing etc.

He knows what he has to do if he wants to make a go of things. I suppose I have to just wait it out and in the meantime get on with my life, so if he does become the person I want him to be I can decide if I want/need him in my life.

I struggle really hard not to tell him what I think he should do. I know that this is one of the problems that has got us where we are - me acting like a mother. However other than saying that I need him to prove that he is tackling his issues and that I thought counselling would help him do this I refrained from saying what I thought he should do.

This really isn't a 'quick' update is it

He asked for a hug again before he left - I declined again. Said it didn't feel right ( although tbh I so wanted to but I know that is just because it is habit and that's what I would normally do to make myself feel better)and I didn't want to give him the wrong impression.

I am really confused about what to do, what I want, whether speaking to him is the right or wrong thing to do....this is all so difficult I just wish it wasn't happening.

mhis - I really feel for you during all of this. you've come so far. and your X - well tbh, don't think about what he wants and his choices - focus on you your DD and what you want - think honestly do you want him back, deep deep down.

him dithering to me (from my POV) is about him keeping his options open, and testing if you still have feelings for him - v unfair of him to do tbh.

You take the control & charge. as I say you've come so far already, you're doing fab.

might want to mention to him about bringing DD back on time as well as this seems to be a reoccurant thing?

Thanks

I have said that he has to bring her back on time. Especially next week as I have plans so need him here on time.

He has said he will do.

Thing is I am second guessing what he is doing nad hwy all the time. Think thta he may be doing this so that I will say he can't take her and to only see her here - that way he gets to come and spend time at the house......

I really don't know.

mhis - your relationship with you h was the same as mine.
He said that he wouldn't do it again because he wouldn't want to go through this again.
I struggle really hard not to tell him what I think he should do. I know that this is one of the problems that has got us where we are - me acting like a mother. However other than saying that I need him to prove that he is tackling his issues and that I thought counselling would help him do this I refrained from saying what I thought he should do.

EXACTLY what is happening here.
I talked to him about 'us' again today, and he told me he didnt want to talk about it anymore. It does his head in apparently. Well, if he isnt going to talk about it, I certainly am not going to sweep it under the carpet, so it will be over. He just looked sad and pathetic when I told him that. He resents that I dont trust him. Which makes me angry at him - HE is the reason I dont trust him!!!! fgs!!
I bought a book today - after the affair, a RELATE book. I flicked through it and can see that I hvae never really trusted him, as he let me down so much, was unreliable etc. So perhaps that isnt going to change and I need to move on.

Sorry for ranting on about ME, instead of your situation. Try reading that book. I am going to ask h to read it, then I will read it after. Bet he doesnt read it , but I think it will help him see why I have such trust issues with him.

((mhis)) this is so hard isnt it?

I say well done for not hugging him too! That bloke does not deserve HUGS - bloody hell!

I must say that from what he's said today, if this was me, I would really hope that I'd be strong enough to simply decide to end it and move on. After all this, he is STILL fluctuating about what he wants? Not sure he might want to come back and whether it's for the right reasons or not?

I'm so sorry to be brutal MHIS but this man does not love you

I wonder if he's capable of really loving someone TBH, he sounds way too self involved to REALLY be a decent partner. I still think he may come back and you may well make a go of it, and of course if it works that will be great for your dd to have her two parents BUT you sound such a lovely person - I want you to experience being married to someone who wholeheartedly loves and adores you. It is very different from what you've had so far.

ratbunny - are you me! I too bought the same book last week!

I remember saying to you that, IMO, if he was going to leave, it should be his decision. In the end, he drove you, by his disregard (texting the OW on holiday), to chuck him out. He is now trying to get you to ask him to come back so that he is, again, absolved of all responsibility. In fact, I suspect he'd rather you told him it was over, once and for all, than take a (any) decision himself. You are doing well not to fall for his little boy lost act. Given your feelings for him, you need to have the patience of a saint. I would have wrung his neck by now. (!!!!!!!!)

mhis - I wonder if our h's are actually the same person?! You're not the ow are you?!?!
so now h resents me being needy and needing reassurance, and me asking him questions. Now ALL the times we have spent with ds have been awful, when actually it was just today. And he is dithering again. Says he keeps thinking of ow too. apparently HE needs time out. I make him feel bad apparently - he worries that if we got back together then I might not get over it and so make hims feel bad again. Not about how I might not get over it and so I would feel bad!!!!

Fucking self absorbed aresholes arent they!

I am thinking of giving myself a deadline to decide - like if he cannot prove himself in 6 weeks, off I go. Not sure if that would be a good idea or not..

Its funny, I think all the advice other people are giving you totally applies to me too...

dittany - i agree but it is very hard to just kind of switch mindsets from single mum getting on with her life to wife working things out with her husband.
I mean, I swithch those mindsets several times each day (as I'm sure mhis does too), but not on demand!

Thanks for your comments.

I've been having a think since I last posted. I do think that he is trying - however minimal - to make changes and really decide what he wants. The problem is until I see some real improvement and commitment I can't trust anything he says. I think he is finding this frustrating as he may well be telling the truth now but I don't believe him. However he only has himself to blame for this.

However what my DH and Ratbunny's husband both say is that THEY wouldn't want to go through the experience again. When really what they should be saying is they don't want to put US through it.... Think that one scentence says a lot about how they both think and shows that they are thinking of themselves first when they need to think of their wife and family before they can truely change. When he asked for a hug today it was because he wanted one not becoasue he wanted to offer me comfort....what about all those times I needed comfort ??

I'm going to try really hard not to get into conversation with hi I think we need to keep our distance. That said the conversations we have had have been calm and I don't regret having them.