BIL always so mean to my DS. Don't know how to handle it.

[Blubunnie]

My BIL (DH's brother) has two sons. Both are slightly neurodiverse but high functioning. Like some parents do he likes to show off about their achievements eg one is a maths genius and one is really artistic. They struggle in other ways eg communication, eye contact, obsessions etc but neither have a diagnosis. Their parents treat them like babies in some ways eg they still have their food cut up for them (they are 14 and 11), don't dress themselves, parents brush their teeth for them etc. whereas they are perfectly capable of doing this (and have done so perfectly happily when parents aren't around) so it's a really weird vibe in general.

What is upsetting is that BIL (but not SIL) takes every opportunity to criticise or put down my DS who is 13. DS is polite, mature, kind and capable so it does stick out when he does "normal" things that his cousins don't do. Like he would offer to make others a cup for tea while his cousins are having their dinner cut up for them and eating it with toddler cutlery. BIL criticises my DS or "jokingly" pokes fun at hin all the time. In the past I've just put it down to BIL being a bit overprotective of his sons and kind of wanting to even things out by praising his sons for doing basic things like put their shoes on (which they are more than capable of doing) while saying that DS's shoes make him look like a clown - just one example.

But my DS is starting to get really upset about it. BIL ignores my DD who is 8 as presumably he doesn't see her as being in competition with his DSs. Anything DS says he gets made fun of or criticised for. My DH has spoken to BIL about it but he gets all defensive and starts huffing and puffing and saying he's just joking. But he keeps on doing it and it's clearly not a joke and has a malicious undertone.

I don't really know how else we can handle it. It's sensitive as I think BIL clearly feels like my DS "shows up" his DSs differences and it makes him uncomfortable so he goes out of his way to praise his DSs while pulling down my DS. If it was just my feelings being hurt I would ignore it as I think he's not worth engaging with. But DS has to spend time around him and I don't know if I should be stepping up more to protect him from it or just accept that is how it is. DS is really mature and is aware of why BIL is behaving that way towards him but it doesn't stop him feeling hurt by it.

Unfortunately there's no escaping BIL as we are visiting family from overseas and DH and BIL's Dad has terminal cancer so we are having an extended "holiday" in thr UK to spend time with him.

Not really sure what I'm asking here as I don't think taking to BIL again will make any difference, and I can't remove DS from the situation as he is spending time with his Grandpa. Just wanted to see if anyone has any words of advice I suppose.

@NCfornonly

I am sorry you have had misfortune in life to have an Arsehole of Brother like that,

I totally agree with your post 💯 per cent,

Good post you did,

You totally nailed it on the spot with your insightful comments. 👌

You’re going to have to be a bit more blunt with your bil. If someone in the family was behaving like this towards my son I’d blow my top! This isn’t the time to be passive, tell him he’s a dick and to stop or get out! Say whatever you need to say but don’t be passive about it. Be the lioness protecting their cub as your son needs you to be!!

Definitely step up and protect your son.

You don't need to be rude or nasty back to him - just correct bad behaviour every time.
"That's not a nice thing to say BIL"
"You might have meant that as a joke but we don't find it funny"
"That's a hurtful thing to say to a child"

Stop using “functioning” to describe autistic people. It’s extremely offensive. All autistic people are functioning, some have higher needs than others but they still function.

And stop subjecting your DS to a bully while you’re at it, why would you ever tolerate that?!

BIL: it’s just a joke
YOU: it’s not, it’s nasty, and in no way funny. Stop it.

Please don't follow the suggestions to use profanities or insults or to attack his children or his parenting. That puts you in the wrong and does nothing to help the situation.

Instead just call BIL out calmly but clearly each time with "That's hurtful and not funny". Just say the same thing every single time. It highlights the harm and removes the option to call it a joke while also not escalating anything.

This

I'd say something now, every time. Not funny. Not appropriate. I don't think that's funny. Not kind. Nothing wrong with his shoes. Just say something. If only so that you and your DS knows it's not going unnoticed.

What an arsehole. Sadly I have one of these in my family. I don't spend any time with him.

"Jokes" that aren't funny, that are targeted at one person with the intention of making them feel bad are usually known as bullying.

Your son would not be allowed to behave like this in school, why is an adult allowed to behave this way in a situation where your son should feel safe and loved.
Either the fact this is bullying needs to be made abundantly clear or contact needs to end. "If you will not stop bullying our child, we will no longer spend time with you.

I know the cousins are ND but surely they can understand that saying things to make other people feel bad is wrong? Would they miss the relationship with your son if you cut contact? What about their mum - what's her place in this?

All bullies say that.

Your ds sounds like a great kid. The most important bit is that you’ve explained to your son why it’s happening and he seems to get it. I’d follow this up with another chat when you’re alone explaining that in the future you won’t be spending extended time with bil because you’re not happy about his behaviour and you’ve asked him to stop and he hasn’t, but as you’re away and because of the illness in the family it’s unavoidable on this occasion. I think it’s important to limit prolonged time together in the future as your ds is only going to get more advanced and your nephews won’t (as they are babied) and I can’t see that making the behaviour of your bil any better. If the family question the reduction in time together you can highlight that you’re not happy with bil’s behaviour and as he hasn’t taken your concerns on board you don’t feel you have another choice.

I had murder with my ex bil, you have my sympathy. He was a horrid cold peice of shit, and I opted out and kept him at arms length from me and the dc as much as possible, and let DH deal with him.

Plenty of incidents, but the first and last time they came to stay he started openly criticizing his wife around the table where we were all eating lunch. Before I'd thought too much about it, I said loudly and firmly with warning, "Be nice, BIL". He stared at me shocked and said "what do you mean?" I replied, "You be nice, or you will take your lunch and eat it alone in another room".

Silence.

I was so aware that not only were my DC watching and absorbing what was going on, but his were too and I needed to call it out so they would know it was not ok with me.

There is only one way to deal with a bully and that is head on, the children are watching. Over my dead body would I keep my mouth shut and keep the peace for people who are hell bent on destroying it.

The ‘only a joke’ defence does work- but just the once. Since BIL has been told his words are causing hurt then he knows his ‘jokes’ aren’t landing well and are causing hurt to a child and alienating his brother’s family. No-one but him is laughing. At that point, his observations (or whatever they are) are no longer what anyone understands to be jokes, are they?

They’re just hurtful comments the speaker doesn’t have the courage to stand by - so he hides behind a defence that’s been made unavailable to him by prior conduct. Everyone can get it wrong once, but the repetition makes it bullying.

Since he knows where everyone else stands re: his comments, and has had the position made clear, why does he feel the need to continue to hurt a child? Is it more important to him to say what he wants than to interact civilly with those around him?

Questions for him to answer!

Yes, you absolutely need to protect your son, that's priority one so if you need to step in then do it.

However, I think you're completely right about BIL doing this to try to level the playing field. Bringing your DS down makes his cousins look more equal.

Therefore the best response is going to be to do something in response that actually widens the gap, so it defeats the object. It depends on what your DS is like, but can you teach him some witty/cutting "jokey" responses? If he can pull these off in quite an 'adult' way, then it will make him look even more mature compared with his cousins and the behaviour is likely to stop.

Can't guarantee it won't be replaced by some other behaviour designed to do the same thing, which may be worse than this one, so pick your battle

'BIL, give it a rest and before you say it no it's not a joke nor funny'

I would call them out each and every time the says it’s a joke. It is only a joke if everyone is laughing and you, dh and your son are not laughing.
You’ve tried the ‘nice polite’ way but that isn’t working. He needs a verbal punch in the face.
Say to him this “Stop this bullying behaviour towards him, don’t ever make fun out of my son again. it’s despicable that you, a grown adult think it’s funny to bully a 13 year old child. Yes, a grow man bullying a child, Don’t take your frustrations out on him, he’s not your verbal punch bag. ” Deliberate repetition of the word ‘bully and bullying’ to drive it home.
As for the grandparents, they need to be made aware of just how much this is affecting your boy. “Why are you condoning this, it’s not funny, it isn’t a joke, my son is hurting and the one who is causing this is your son. Xxxxx deserves as much consideration and care as the other grandchildren.

Why the hell are you tolerating this?

Sod the atmosphere

I would call it out very firmly and if nothing changed then that would be it

Your son might be tolerating this on the surface but don't tell me it doesn't hurt him

For what it's worth, DS is confident and can already see through this behaviour as being based on insecurity and jealousy. We've discussed that he's only targeted as he's seen as a threat and he's not overly upset by it but it's still hurtful and just really annoying more than anything else!

You are clearly doing well with your DS if he can already appreciate why your BiL is behaving in this unacceptable manner. However, playing tit for tat just brings you down to his level.

One hallmark of really, really successful people is that just don't seem to notice when others are being hurtful, out of jealousy and spite. If you can get your DS to see these jibes not as irrelevant but as mere flea bites on the hide of an elephant, it would be a really good thing for his resilience and how he deals with others who show similar jealousy.

This would have the rather pleasing side effect of demonstrating to BiL that he simply does not have any power to hurt, upset or annoy you and your DS.

I'm not suggesting that this is easy, but it really is very simple. I wish your DS and you all the very best with this.

This, if you haven't got your childs back, who has?

Instead of letting your DS defend himself you and your DH should do it for him and be extra critical to BIL and see how he likes it.

separately you DH needs to step up and privately tell his brother to pack it in. If he can’t say anything nice he should say nothing.
If he won’t… I would have the conversation.

if it’s ineffective…
I would either go with a firm but polite “enough!” “Please don’t say that”. “Stop being unpleasant”

Every time he does this, the three of you need to look at each other and snigger, as if sharing some private joke. Every so often, mouth “Bingo!” at each other. When he asks what’s going on, say, “nothing, nothing!” and collapse into fits of laughter.

This is horrible. You absolutely need to remove yourselves from this situation and protect your son.

Please don't allow long-term emotional damage to YOUR CHILD just to avoid a bad atmosphere.

Exactly this

your parent in laws ignore what your bil does and want everyone to do the same to keep the peace and pretend it’s all just a joke. It’s damaging to your son and needs to be stopped, I would leave and go home with your family if he ignores your boundaries as just rolling your eyes at each other is not having your sons back at all. It’s showing him you all are too scared of bil and trying to pass it off as a joke as well.