What do I do about dh's temper?

[stressedmummy]

I have changed my name here, so that dh does not find out that I am starting a thread about him.
Basically I live with a man with a terrible temper & it is getting to the stage where I am not sure that I want to be with him any more.
He has never hit me, but he kicks things, throws things, smashes things & generally scares me to death when he gets very angry.
I have 2 ds's aged 5 & 20 mths who are also seeing Daddy acting like this when angry & I know it is not good for them.
Last year we nearly seperated because it was getting so bad that I was dreading coming home from work, because I knew what I was coming home 2.
This was also shortly after he had got angry about ds1 shouting out in his bed, yelled at him & then on charging down stairs fell down the bottom steps, resulting in him bounding back up the stairs & kicking the wicker basket in ds's bedroom, which obviously terrified my poor ds.
Anyway, he swore he would change & for a while he did seem to calm down.
He works long hours & I am often stressed, as I work & then have to come home & deal with the boys (which I am not doing very well at the moment)
He is very house proud & if he ever finds a bean or something on the floor he goes mad.
Anyway, yesterday he actually returned home early for once (4pm) & I had a friend round with her young children who were playing with my ds & making a little mess as children do!
When they left, dh went mad about the state of the place.
He first started shouting out "for fu*k sake"
because he could not find one of the bin bag holders.
He then came in & discovered that a ball had fallen from the christmas tree & got really angry throwing the ball hard on the floor, resulting in it shattering to pieces.
He shouted "Get upstairs NOW" to the children & then started to throw all the presents around.
I followed the children upstairs & ds1 said " Daddy was not very nice to me then"
I spent ages crying & wandering what I should do after, but dh does not think he was wrong & said that if the ball was not on the floor & the house was not a mess it would not have happened.
I just don't know what to do for the best for my children.

here's a link to the home office leaflet on domestic violence - afraid its a very fiddly adobe photoshop document

here: domestic violence leaflet

as you can see, the government considers domestic violence as being other than someone actually hitting you:-

quote from the beginning of the leaflet "as well as actual physical violence, domestic violence can include a wide range of abusive and controlling behaviours, including: threats, harassment, physical attacks, financial control, emotional abuse"

IMHO if someone is deliberately scaring the hell out of you - that is definitely violence.

I know. That is what really scares me.
The ball he smashed because it had fallen from the tree was a glass ball.
He has also smashed a drinking glass in his temper & thrown ds's highchair across the kitchen, although ds was not in the kitchen at the time.

The time that he was kicking the wicker basket in ds's room was one of the worst memories I have.
My ds was not even 4 at the time & was curled up in a ball on his bed.
I actually said to my ds that evening "Do you not want to live with Daddy any more."

The BBC have a good website section: www.bbc.co.uk/hittinghome.

Has lots of info about DV on there.

SM, I know you are scared and I am worried for you (as if you were one of my clients), but I also know that only you can make the decision about whether you will stay or not.

He will probably not change and so the 'power' so to speak will be in your hands. I understand how scary it must be for you so please get advice about your options.

Take care

I am going to ask to speak to my hv in the new year. She knows a little about what he is like from her visits to the house when I was suffering with depression after the birth of ds2.
She may be able to advise me in the right direction.
I know that something must be done for the sake of the boys.

Stressed mummy - have read all of this thread and have the following comments to make!

The decision as to whether to leave this relationship is a complete no brainer (as an outsider) why would you stay???

Asking a 4 year old child whether they want to live with daddy anymore is dodging the issue! You are the adult - you decide for the welfare of your family. No passing off the difficult things in life to a 4 year old!

Equally what do you think the HV is going to say? Again I'm worried that you are trying to pass of responsibility for the decision to others (poss including mumsnet) - you are in an awful situation and you need to take action. All this prevarication will get you no where in the longer term - you need to act and you need to do it NOW

You need to take legal advice - you can do this in advance of splitting up this will help you straighten things out in your mind before you act- W&R is giving you an excellent hand up here FGS take it!

I do think you should try and stay in the house if at all possible - but W&R/solicitor will be able to best advise of the legal aspects of this. The children will be disorientated enough by the changes without losing their home too.

I'm sorry if this comes across a bit bossily - but you do seem to be searching for someone to almost give you permission to leave - well believe me you've got that in bucket loads here!

In summary GET OUT AND GET SAFE - NOW!

I'm worried that his behaviour appears to be getting more erratic - he may be building up to something nasty!

You say he doesn't hit you - does he ever hit the children??? - does he ever physically intimidate you - you know pushing, shoving, etc etc???

SBD, I can see why you are getting annoyed, possibly.

But working with women on a regular basis who have been/are being abused, it never is a simple as seeing it for what it is and going (as I'm sure you can appreciate).

Yes, if SM wants to get legal advice go ahead. However, if she WANTS to stay, perhaps against her better judgement, we have to support her in her decisions and ,ake her aware of the possible consequences of staying. As well as arming her with escape startegies, such as anorak suggested.

Living long term with an abuser can affect the decisions one makes as well as women not really knowing where to go or which support services to access (I see this on a daily basis, as women do not know what is available in their area or where to go). Also, the stigma that refuges carry and the fact the family and friends may see this man differently and therefore not give SM the support needed make leaving very difficult.

Maybe W&R can give advice about housing, but I am led to believe that SM cannot legally throw her H out of the house without evidence of physical violence or intimidation (ie, that she is willing to stand up and report these incidents to the Police). So if he won't go willing, her only option is for her to leave IF she feels threatened. Which in turn means moving her children from everyithing they know (good or bad).

Sorry if I have gone on, but I deal with the fallout of this on a daily basis and can fully understand why women do not up and leave, despite the possibel consequences.

Poshpawa - don't get me wrong - I've supported a friend through exactly this situation and I do understand how hard it can be to finally make the break! I am just trying to stress to sm that she has all the 'knowledge' she needs to make this decision - waiting around for more incidents etc is not going to make a difference.

I am assuming from teh tone of her posts that she is almost ready to go - and if the posts on this thread help edge her towards the 'right' decision for her and her children then that is good.

SM will have my support and the support of others on this site whatever decision she makes and however long it takes her to make it

He rarely hits the children, just shouts a lot & uses punishments like making ds1 stay in his room all day if he does something wrong.
I feel powerless to step in, because he gets cross if I try to take over when he is punishing them.
He can be a good Dad sometimes, in that he takes them to the park sometimes & has even made cakes with ds1.
I think that up until now I have made excuses for him, or genuinally thought that he would change.
I also worried about the effect it would have on the boys to no longer have Daddy around.
I have realised since starting this thread that our situation is far from the norm & do intend on doing something about it, but not until the new year as I don't want to spoil Christmas.
I am really gratefull for all the advice given.
Please don't think that I don't intend using it.

Thanks SBD. Sorry if I came over a little preachy. Had a client this morning similar to SM so a little raw (very unprofessional of me )

Also as I said earlier I feel pretty pathetic & gutless around him, in that I rarely stand up to him.
Mumsnet gave me the confidence to stand up to him this weekend & tell him exactually how wrong his behaviour was.
The other thing is that despite everything I know that he really loves me & leaving is going to take a lot of courage on my part, but I will get there in the end.

sm - I think you are incredibly brave and strong!

You will do this for yourself and your children. Life will improve immeasureably once you are away from him! Yes it will be tough in the short term and I can entirely understand why you want to wait until after christmas!

Please do keep using this thread as a sounding board and a place to let off steam!

A more pleasant life is only a short journey away

Thanks sbd

Stressedmum, you do as you feel best and in your own time. The main point is that you realise this is not a nice way to treat someone, it is NOT your fault and you can be a loving mum to your children in other ways than conjuring a 'happy family' from what sounds like impossible ingredients. A good partnership takes 2, 100%. Not occasional concessions like making cakes once! if you dread being with dh what does that say about your relatoinship? As a mum you want whats best for your children and in some circumstances that involves bringing them up without dad.
Anorak, respect to you! what a struggle it must have been but how well worth it to end up the person you are today. I can relate to quite a lot of what you are saying. On occasions ds was like this with me albeit he never actually threw me out just came close and I always felt it was in some way my inadequacy but now I think blimey if someone can throw anorak in the street it can't have all been down to me after all.

crossed with sbd!

Stressedmummy, I've just read the whole thread and it's made me cry. It doesn't matter that he doesn't hit you - you are living in fear and so are your children. You are worth so much more than this and so are your boys. You're their Mum and you need to take care of them - which means giving them a secure, safe, peaceful home environment. They deserve it and so do you. I think you're there - I think you know things have to change, so I just wanted to wish you all the luck and strength in the world to make 2005 a new start for you all. Take care, hon xx

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Hi stressedmummy, I haven't been around much so haven't seen this thread before but my word, this sounds awful. You say 'he rarely hits the children'? (my italics) - but you have to stand by and watch this happen? Sorry, but that's awful. You also say you're worried about 'the effect it would have on the boys to no longer have Daddy around' - please believe me, the effect of having daddy around and seeing him bully you and them is far, far worse than the effect of your leaving and having a happy life away from violence and abuse. I'm wishing you the strength to deal with this, well done for realising you can't live like this nor bring your children up in this atmosphere.

I agree with soapboxingday, you are very brave and strong.

I know you are worried about the effect on your boys of leaving, but it will be better for them to be without their daddy than to be with a daddy who is physically violent around the house, throws and smashes things and intimidates and scares both them and their mother at the drop of a hat.

I wish you the best of luck whatever you decide. xx

And I agree with W&R, he should be the one on the street, not you and the children. The law is on your side, as are mumsnetters.

Agree with what W7R has said re housing. If fleesing DV, local authority has a duty to rehouse you.

Does this apply when you co-own the property, W&R? A client told me today that her solicitor said that it would be illegal for her to throw her H out as they co-owned the property.

Thanks to w&w also, for all your great advice.
I have to say, before starting this thread I always used to be at a loss as to where I would even start if I wanted to get out, now I am wiser.
Must go & tidy the house now, as dh has gone into town & wants it tidy 4 when he gets back.

sm - just hold onto the thought that one day soon the house will be bloody tidy as all his belongings will be out on the pavement and won't be cluttering the place up any more!

More importantly the house will be permenantly cleansed of his vileness

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I can't believe he makes a 5 year old stay in his room all day if he does something wrong. That's terribly cruel. Poor little mite.

My mother was violent and bullying; my father stayed with her because he didn't know what else to do. I and my sister and brother wished every day that he would chuck her out. She was forcing us to do all the chores anyway. We wouldn't have minded doing them without being beaten as well.

Stressedmummy, you are the only person who can save your sons from having a nightmare childhood.

Wild, thank you for your kind comments. The road we have travelled makes us the people we are, I guess.