Affairs

[Theanswersalemon]

People who begin new relationships by cheating on their spouse/paerner end up "trading down" from their spouse. Often way down. Do you agree, or not?

No one is above you and no one is below you

This. It's weird to be categorising people in this way.

You have a scale of human beings?

Yuck.

@DontStarveAGirlOfAPalaver all your posts are spot on. 👌
I'm in a happy long term marriage. But that doesn't happen by accident, you can't drift that, you have to drive it.
The people you meet along the way may be a temptation (physical, emotional or both) at some point, for a host of complicated factors, both internal and external... Your response to that is what decides what happens next.
As much as affairs are common and humans are often weak, each affair is also the story of someone's life, how they got there and what they did about it is always personal, there are patterns of course, we're all human at the end of the day, but also everyone's experience is real and specific to them.

Thoughtful posts, @DontStarveAGirlOfAPalaver.

OP, no, I don’t think this is true as any kind of general rule. I think it’s it’s the kind of truism people say to someone who feels hurt and betrayed to make them feel better. A bit like people continually tell people on here, on zero evidence, that someone’s unfriendly behaviour towards them ‘is just because they’re jealous of you’.

Affairs are as varied as the people having them.

I’m not sure about trading up or down.

I think the main reason people have affairs is related to how the OW/M makes them feel about themselves. It generally has nothing to do with their current or affair partner. It’s purely about them.

@DontStarveAGirlOfAPalaver 👏🏻 Probably one of the most succinct responses I’ve ever read on mn!

Absolutely agree, nothing to do with erotic needs met nonsense!

Well would you be kind enough to explain it to those of us who don't have a degree in Psychology?

What does this mean for a start? "To own and control our partners erotic experiences"

And if the desire for erotic experiences is "hard-wired into our psyche" why did I and most of my single (divorced) girlfriends all have the same complaint - that our husbands weren't that interested in sex, turned us down repeatedly, and had all sorts of excuses not to engage in any sexual activity?

It all makes no sense to me.

I'm glad you agree with me that it's all some kind of psychobabble !

"For example a guy who is running away from his responsibilities as a husband and father will trade down to a woman who is less hassle, less demanding of him and most importantly of all, willing to put up with his bullshit."

Now this makes a lot of sense ^

We read about it all the time on these pages 🙄

What does this mean for a start? "To own and control our partners erotic experiences"

I presume it means that monogamy comes at the cost of compromises - if your libidos are different, if your sexual fantasies are different, you're not free to shag whoever, you're answerable to another person if you flirt (or 'like' the wrong pictures for some people 🙄), people say things like "I don't mind if my partner masturbates" or whatever as if they ought to have a say on it.

Obviously I think I'm nicer and prettier and generally better than the people my ex cheated with - but I would, wouldn't I? 😂

@category12 "I presume it means that monogamy comes at the cost of compromises - if your libidos are different, if your sexual fantasies are different, you're not free to shag whoever, you're answerable to another person if you flirt (or 'like' the wrong pictures for some people 🙄), people say things like "I don't mind if my partner masturbates" or whatever as if they ought to have a say on it."

OK.

But if the desire for erotic experiences is "hard-wired into our psyche" as our resident sex-therapist claims, why do we even get different libidos ??

Because we're all different?

@Tangerinedreams3

Tangerinedreams3
To me yes they do trade down.
Not necessarily with looks but to do with how "easy" the affair partner is to push around and manipulate.
For example a guy who is running away from his responsibilities as a husband and father will trade down to a woman who is less hassle, less demanding of him and most importantly of all, willing to put up with his bullshit.
So in summary it's not about looks. It's about trading down to someone who has poor boundaries, poor self-esteem, often low earning power and who is easy to push around.

This is so true in my ex DH's case. The OW is a 40 year old who has no money, a shit job (which she then got sacked from), lives in an awful rented flat and owns nothing. Her father had numerous affairs and she seems to see nothing wrong with what she's done. She puts up with all of my ex's shit as she literally has nothing else. Her bar is on the ground.

OP, what is your theory then as to why people have affairs? Why would someone "trade down"? That doesn't make any sense to me.

But according to our resident sex-therapist "the need for erotic experiences is hard wired into all of us".

So why the differentials?

Trust me, there was nothing hard about my exH (apart from his heart) !

I totally agree with this. I have known a few married men to have affairs , and all the affair partners werent as good looking as their wives.I have personally found, that those who disagree with this are either having an affair, is the affair partner or has been in an affair in the past.

Totally agree

All I know is from talking to divorced female friends I learned that their DHs weren't that keen on sex, and repeatedly rebuffed the wives. The affair partners were totally different to the wives.

(Can't say too much as don't want to identify people)

eg. Professional women wife, high earner, degree educated - husband also degree educated, lecturer - OW = biker chick, unemployed, lived in a squat. (Wife ended up with an STD)

Businesswoman wife, high earner, - husband manager for charity - OW = no qualifications, 10 years younger, worked sorting old clothes at charity shop.

Wife healthcare professional, degree educated - husband businessman - OW = no quals worked in a fish shop.

Husband s/e tradesman high earner - wife business owner - OW = hospital cleaner.

I would say Madonna/whore complex but then I'm not a psychologist

Lots of things are "hard-wired" into us but we feel them differently - drives/needs/wants differ between us.

Heck, Maggie Thatcher was reputed to only need 4 hours of sleep, which wouldn't suit many of us - why would you expect everyone's libido to be identical?

So by traded down you meant in more working class jobs?

What happens to the wc men who have affairs? Do they trade up to the posh tottie?

@Theanswersalemon your friends experiences of affairs is interesting to me. I've heard (from generally misogynistic men!) that women have been 'sold a lie' about having it all, and actually, a lot of men would prefer a wife at home or in a low pressure job so that they can be looked after and available to them. This helps these men feel as though they are true providers as their career is much more 'important' = huge pride & ego boost. I kind of scoffed when I heard it, but it could explain the situation your pals have found themselves in.

Not read the full thread but I had an affair and would say, without trying to be cruel that I traded up to an extent. AP was better looking and younger than my ex husband though similar in terms of intelligence, level of success etc. I think my AP traded sideways if I can put it like that. His ex wife was and is very good looking, stylish, successful, driven etc. I would probably not match her on any of those criteria but I think I am more fun and loving and more of an all rounder maybe. But no one traded anything really because we didn't end up together

Sounds like it was all a waste of time and effort tbh