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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

His dad hit him

159 replies

Dany8 · 08/08/2023 16:06

Is there ever a situation where you’d let this go? I am obviously taking it seriously but to throw our whole marriage and family life away for it seems extreme and I genuinely can’t bring myself to make that decision and think I need some outside opinions as I’ve been driving myself crazy over it. My son (12) was hit by his dad for being particularly frustrating with his choice of words and I don’t want to say encouraging because that’s absolutely not what I’m trying to say but just doing everything he can to get him to hit him. This has never happened before. Is it something you’d let go as a one off?

OP posts:
guineacup · 08/08/2023 21:41

.... occasionally gave me the odd light smack when I was a child...

guineacup · 08/08/2023 21:43

Interesting. My mother gave me a good hiding when I severely misbehaved as a child. Personally, it hasn't affected me or how I feel towards my mother. I'm not advocating corporal punishment and I would never hit my child. Just giving another perspective.

Me too...the occasion light smacks I had as a child had no discernible long term impact on me.

Makemineacosmo · 08/08/2023 21:47

IamSaved · 08/08/2023 20:58

Interesting. My mother gave me a good hiding when I severely misbehaved as a child. Personally, it hasn't affected me or how I feel towards my mother.

I'm not advocating corporal punishment and I would never hit my child. Just giving another perspective.

It ruined me and gave me issues I'm still dealing with. I think the worst thing for me was feeling that my mum could have stopped it happening but didn't. So even though she wasn't the one who was hitting me, I couldn't understand why she did nothing about it. I do understand that our experiences are different though.

guineacup · 08/08/2023 21:47

AllProperTeaIsTheft · 08/08/2023 20:13

Aren't most people hit by their parents?

I really don't think so. Not any more. I'm 51 and wasn't hit by my parents. I don't think my friends were either. It was more common back then, for sure. But parenting has changed a lot, fortunately. I wouldn't ever hit my kids. Neither would dh. I'd be very surprised if any of my friends or family hit theirs.

If you're 51, then yes, it's highly likely that your friends would have been smacked. Not saying it's right, but the teachers used to smack very naughty kids sometimes at school - no one batted an eyelid!

guineacup · 08/08/2023 21:49

It ruined me and gave me issues I'm still dealing with. I think the worst thing for me was feeling that my mum could have stopped it happening but didn't. So even though she wasn't the one who was hitting me, I couldn't understand why she did nothing about it. I do understand that our experiences are different though.

I think there's a big difference between a light tap and repeated whacks... you sound like you had the latter... I can understand why that would have been harder to manage.

Zanatdy · 08/08/2023 21:56

ItStopsHere · 08/08/2023 20:22

This.

Some family therapy and parenting advice would probably be a good idea.

I once hit back after my teenage daughter kicked, slapped and scratched my face after calling me all the names under the sun. I was so upset, she was so upset. We talked, I talked to her CAMHS counsellor about it, it has never happened again. I'm glad my husband wasn't baying for divorce.

Agree, we all have a breaking point and I agree completely with earlier poster who mentioned when parents of toddlers hit breaking point and smack them, all met with ‘it’s ok, it’s a one off’. Yet here, totally disrespectful little shit let’s face it, is acting like a little brat and dad reaches his breaking point and he’s a monster and OP must leave immediately. I mean come on. In the real world he agrees that he was wrong, which he’s done, seeks support if needed and they stand together to tackle this kids behaviour problem. I’d be furious the way the son’s reacting and at 12 I’d be taking his phone and any other privileges away. All the people suggesting OP leaves immediately despite having no job etc, how are you proposing she deals alone with this kid who seems to be out of control?

guineacup · 08/08/2023 23:03

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 08/08/2023 18:59

Only on mn would you be a branded a keyboard warrior for stating you’d leave a man for assaulting your 12yo

Only on MN are people so extreme and uncompromisingly black-or-white that they'd advise the OP to leave their DH over this.

guineacup · 08/08/2023 23:15

RedWineRedFace · 08/08/2023 17:18

Honestly I wouldn’t end the marriage because I wouldn’t have to

DH would be 6 feet under if he ever even made our child flinch

You keep talking about how he never did anything to your older son, or how it’ll change you and your daughters lives. Why aren’t you thinking of your 12 year old child who got hit?

Thanks for making me laugh with one of the most batshit extreme posts I've ever read on MN! 😂

curaçao · 08/08/2023 23:36

RedWineRedFace · 08/08/2023 18:38

Exactly! Swap the child with anyone else, and MN would be calling for DH’s blood. But it’s ok to smack a child because children obviously aren’t important enough.

Well one is illegal and the other isn't, your dh isn't responsible for disciplining you , whereas he is with his child.

TossacointoHenryCavill · 09/08/2023 00:10

I would be trying to get your DS into some high energy, somewhat risky sport managed by young men he will look up to but who take no nonsense. Could be something like martial arts but also something like rock climbing mountain biking - anything with an element of danger and physicality but where learning to do things safely and male role models who your son will find impressive who aren’t gang members.

SunflowerTed · 09/08/2023 03:51

Highlyflavouredgravy · 08/08/2023 16:32

I disagree with practically everyone.
Your son sounds completely disrespectful, cocky and unpleasantness and if HE spoke to someone outside the house, the way he is speaking to your dh, he would likely get the shit kicked out of him.

If you end your marriage, then you will be left alone to cope with your sons behaviours and your dh will have to do the same without your help/ influence.

Despite what people say on here, it is not illegal to smack your children in England and while it is not an ideal way to discipline children, sometimes it happens.

Totally agree. Your son sounds like he needs some serious discipline ( not physical btw)

Brightandshining · 09/08/2023 04:05

I honestly don't know. My dad.. who was a wonderful kind man.. once slapped me when I was a teen. He'd never hurt me before and he never did after... was it wrong? Yeah.. but I cant blame him.
I do not know what id do if my husband did this to our kids though.. he'd have to do something about it. Acknowledge what he'd done was abuse and go to counselling/parenting classes.. and apologise to the child.
My dad did none of that he just pretended it had never happened. He was a brilliant father though.. I do remember at the time I was wondering if he would hit me and kind of seeing if he would. Not my fault of course I was just a child. But he was also just a human being... a flawed one. But im still very grateful to have had him as a father. He certainly never thought it was ok to use violence as discipline despite coming from a generation that did think it was ok mostly. Im sure he regretted it.
Id personally want to see the father of my children take steps to address the problem and make sure it never ever happened again though. I wouldn't just accept drawing a line under it.

GeorgiaGirl52 · 09/08/2023 05:27

Kellogg1 · 08/08/2023 17:33

Parents have given their children a proportionate smack for years upon years without it one - having a traumatic effect on the child and 2 - breaking up an entire family. I received one or two in my whole childhood and as a well rounded adult can honestly say deserved it.
If DH punched the child in a disproportionate manner then yes it’s very wrong and should be dealt with but a proportionate slap is a totally different story. It sounds like your son is in desperate need of a lesson and whilst slapping him isn’t ideal it happens. We are human. Learn from it and move on.

Find an alternative punishment and stick to it hard(phone removal and grounding works here). Speak to your husband about it being inappropriate and come up with a solution. I often let my dc think they have won and walk away … when they try to do things with friends or log on to a game the Wi-Fi is off and plans cancelled on their behalf. They react but learn.

This is a very sensible remark so it will be very unpopular here.
Talk to your husband and make some plans. Stand together when your son starts in on his father again. Cut out wi-fi, play-station, i-phone, and allowance.
Replace with chores and earning rewards.

StopStartStop · 09/08/2023 05:40

This is a very sensible remark so it will be very unpopular here.
😂😂😂

GoodChat · 09/08/2023 06:41

Would you stay with him if he hit you, as long as he cried afterwards?

guineacup · 09/08/2023 09:02

My dad.. who was a wonderful kind man.. once slapped me when I was a teen. He'd never hurt me before and he never did after... was it wrong? Yeah.. but I cant blame him.

My mum was also very kind and gentle, and very opposed to violence, yet once or twice (literally just that) under extreme and prolonged aggravation from me or my sister, she smacked us (lightly). Was she right for doing that? No... But to some self-righteous people on here that momentary and slight loss of temper undid all the good wonderful loving parenting that she gave us through, everything... and I should have been taken away from her and placed in care!

The odd light smack in the context of a loving and secure family life shouldn't be conflated with abusive persistent batterings. But then some MN posters can't seem to help themselves in taking things to extremes... Had a drag on some weed once - you're practically a crack addict! Looked at a top-shelf magazine years ago - you're complicit in human sex trafficking!

keffie12 · 09/08/2023 10:18

Blondebutnotlegally · 08/08/2023 18:05

OK but this is entirely different. You said yourself the marriage was abusive. It's not the same situation.

Yes, it was! However, my own experience has taught one thing, once it's happened, once it will likely happen again. I say this has I've seen this happen with my work with woman

Just because your husband hasn't been physically abusive before, it doesn't mean it can't happen again. You need to look at your own boundaries on this. Meaning if it happened again, would you then leave?

Your son has a hold over you all now. He can use this in blackmail, telling you he will do xyz if you don't comply with xyz.

You may need to think about discussing this with a teacher or the like. If you believe the teacher, for example, would go to SS and you're worried about what will happen, then you need to think on.

It may be that you need to take the power back from your son as he might start threatening to tell.

If you're planning to stay, you need to seriously evaluate how you take the power back from your son. He will use this over you if he is as bad as you say.

Wenfy · 09/08/2023 10:26

Have you ruled out drugs? Gangs? This is exactly how my cousin behaved when he joined a gang. It might be better for your older son to have a word with him, get to the bottom of things, as he might trust him more.

DisquietintheRanks · 09/08/2023 10:39

A smack I might get passed a punch I wouldn't.

I will say that my brother was really out of control as a teen and had a great line in running his mouth. My parents never struck him but the first time he tried it on a bloke at the pub (age 15) he got the living shit beat out of him. What I remember most was not the damage done but his shock that he wasn't just treated like a cheeky little boy with no comeback.

Anyway, your ds can learn from this or he can learn the hard way.

guineacup · 09/08/2023 10:53

Your son has a hold over you all now. He can use this in blackmail, telling you he will do xyz if you don't comply with xyz.

He only has a hold on you if let him. If he tried to blackmail me with it, I'd shrug my shoulders and tell him to go ahead. Social Services won't be interested in something so trivial. Even if they were, they're run off their feet dealing with actual abuse and neglect, not a one-off slap given to an obnoxious 12 year old.

It's good that physical violence is seen as unacceptable by society in dealing with children, but we need to get a grip, have some perspective and stop catastrophising.

Dany8 · 09/08/2023 11:35

Going through eldest son isn’t a good idea. He hates coming home because of ds12. He’s only nice to his sisters which has always been surprising as it’s not necessarily a male/female thing as he’s pretty bad to me but then to me it’s not comments like it is with DH it’s more just refusal and little respect for rules etc

he is definitely hanging with the wrong people his best friend has an older brother who is already involved in crime and he is 15 and I definitely don’t want my son going down that path and nor do I really want him around 15 year olds but what can I actually do anymore. School have told me he is really well behaved in classes where none of his “friends” are and even supported moving his class for the things he was with them and not done in sets like RE and ICT which has just made ds behaviour worse at home as he blames everyone for not being allowed in classes with his friends and he purposely causes issues in these classes just so he gets sent out to isolation.

I know he is only 12 but it’s extremely hard to do anything I can take his phone away and he just sits there goading the whole night to us if I send him to his room with no phone he just refuses and tells us to “make him” we feel lucky he doesn’t do anything violent himself which is not how it should feel. School referred to the counsellor who said he doesn’t engage

if DH had hit me after me being exactly how ds was then honestly yes I would still be here asking the same question

OP posts:
AngryGreasedSantaCatcus · 09/08/2023 12:48

Dany8 · 09/08/2023 11:35

Going through eldest son isn’t a good idea. He hates coming home because of ds12. He’s only nice to his sisters which has always been surprising as it’s not necessarily a male/female thing as he’s pretty bad to me but then to me it’s not comments like it is with DH it’s more just refusal and little respect for rules etc

he is definitely hanging with the wrong people his best friend has an older brother who is already involved in crime and he is 15 and I definitely don’t want my son going down that path and nor do I really want him around 15 year olds but what can I actually do anymore. School have told me he is really well behaved in classes where none of his “friends” are and even supported moving his class for the things he was with them and not done in sets like RE and ICT which has just made ds behaviour worse at home as he blames everyone for not being allowed in classes with his friends and he purposely causes issues in these classes just so he gets sent out to isolation.

I know he is only 12 but it’s extremely hard to do anything I can take his phone away and he just sits there goading the whole night to us if I send him to his room with no phone he just refuses and tells us to “make him” we feel lucky he doesn’t do anything violent himself which is not how it should feel. School referred to the counsellor who said he doesn’t engage

if DH had hit me after me being exactly how ds was then honestly yes I would still be here asking the same question

You need to stop being this passive, otherwise your family will be torn apart and he will follow the same path as his "mates". You need to take control and instil and maintain rules,boundaries and consequences. Yes he will kick off, but he is doing that anyways. Something is obviously going on. Something very wrong, and he is only 12. He can't be in control, he can't do whatever he wants. Otherwise you'll just find yourself in the same spot of angry,frustrated,resentful violence over and over again. Next time it might be you, or his brother, or a random stranger,or a friend or even his dad again. And then you will have to leave .

Seaweed42 · 09/08/2023 12:56

Have you considered that your son has ADHD?
Please look into that.

What you describe are some of the signs, impulsivity, not able to follow instructions, attention-seeking behaviour in class. etc
Excessive talking, talking 'at you' rather than to you, not able to concentrate on anything for very long, rushing from one task to another.
Doing the lego set to 'get it over with' but not interested in rebuilding stuff.
Can't manage on his own, needs constant input from others, so will constantly seek attention from other people.
Rarely sits down and does an activity on his own.
Any disapproval from another causes major upset or retaliation or a ranting outburst/goes on the defensive the other person is such a 'bad person'
Easily led by others because he craves approval.

JibbaJab · 09/08/2023 13:03

I may be wrong so don't hold me to it but I would hazard a guess your son is navigating the pecking order at school with the boys and this is the result and it's bled out into your home life.

I can say from my experience at school from the moment secondary started there was a never ending power struggle within the boys and there were almost like factions of popularity and dominance between them. It was very much a case of you were being consistently tested by others to how far you would go, how strong you were and what you could deal with, which then in a way determined where you stood in that pecking order.

If you didn't bend you were generally bullied and attacked, some like me stood their ground and were left alone in the end and just coexisted between them all. Others didn't stand their ground and were the punching bags for the remainder of the time. The rest joined and became the same. The only way I can describe it is like gang mentality or an animal hierarchy of dominance. The behavior sounds the same, a total disregard to authority, goading it was the same then.

Bare in mind also my school won awards year after year for being an anti bullying school. They did nothing there was no support they only did on oftsed days. My school at least was like a prison without rules even the teachers were assaulted often, but to parents it was amazing school. It was not.

So, I would say he's acting this way because he's been made to believe that's how he should and depending on his makeup maybe that's gone further. At my school, someone who was so defiant they would do stuff like that to adults and own parents were nearer the top, don't push that one he's a live wire none can control him.

No way would he talk to a counselor at school, not even I would, you would be asking for it and that would throw you in a shit storm. What he's doing is pushing back against it, can't control me and that image then goes back to the friends.

Unfortunately I don't know what the answer is but I would say look at school, some like mine made up all kinds of shit to save their own record. You could move schools but he may fall into it again or may still have contact.

All I know is boys on that path need to see consequence before they go too deep and shouting and smacking isn't it because they are already likely witnessesing that, it won't phase them. Needs consequence as in where his life will be if he continues that route into adulthood, I dunno show him where people like that end up in life or worse prison. Show him what he has that others do not, make him live a life without luxury for a while see what he has lost from the behavior. Make him do things to help it will be hard but it's a battle of wills don't back down, you back down it's lost.

If you need counseling don't do it through school do it so others don't know because they will know at school gossip and eyes everywhere.

Hope that helps, as say could be wrong just another perspective on it.

ValerieDoonican · 09/08/2023 14:17

Interesting post from @JibbaJab

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