I give my DH the ick

[200miles]

Two young kids (pre school). Both me and DH work full time.

Pretty happy and settled. DH is very good with the kids. So hands on (rubbish at admin etc but v present and always playing).

But he's a grumpy git. Just like my dad is. And the grumpiness is almost entirely towards me. Nothing major, I'm not scared of him. But he just acts like he's got the ick around me. For example if he notices I'm on my period (tampax box out in the loo) he might grimace. We were just away and he made a comment about how big my bikini bottoms were, always "joking" but I'm not an idiot...I'm late 30s, size 12, and admittedly don't make a huge amount of effort with my looks at home. But also he often doesn't respond to what I'm saying and if I pick him on it he will say "don't know what you want me to say". He talks to me about practical stuff like the price of petrol or the bins but often seems totally bored by anything else I have to contribute. He doesn't kiss me and sex is very infrequent and brief. I see him roll his eyes a lot. He is also worse when we are out. He does have days of being fine with me and we get on but I just feel he doesn't like me that much anymore.

I have tried talking to him and he makes a joke. If I push it he will call me sensitive or I'm being mad. If I keep pushing it he can get v angry "get over yourself" "you're talking absolute shit" etc.

We both earn similar amounts and work similar jobs. I really don't know if I can stand shared custody and losing my home. The kids really are v happy as we rarely argue and we are both happy and present with them. But there is such a sadness in me.

I'm considering staying but just building a thicker skin and finding my fun elsewhere. Not an affair but just increasing my social life and hobbies now my kids are getting closer to school age.

Can that ever work as a strategy?

Yes that it how it was when I was a kid. It hurt me so much seeing my dad disrespect my mum and show his contempt.

it could be when you tell him you don’t see a way forward, he may wake up. But without action, this will just be a long drawn out car crash.

@200miles
You say that you don't feel loved, and it is quite possible that he no longer loves you. Just as people " fall in love " they may just as reasonably " fall out of love. " So you may not be loved by him but you have an absolute right to expect to be treated with respect in your home.

Maybe like you he has decided that he will stay with you even though he no longer loves you. No one owes us love that do not feel, but if you are going to continue living together, you may need help in learning how to navigate this reality.

Staying together for the benefit of your children or for financial convenience is not the same as staying with a loving partner. You and your husband should seek counseling to help the both of you to articulate and structure your expectations under the existing reality.

Abusive, disrespectful and has checked out already.

Think about what you need to do. You may not want to do it, but I think you absolutely need to do it and quite soon actually.

Great that you have the financial security to change things for yourself. Everything else will improve when you do.

I'm sure we could all come up with alternative reasons for his behaviour but the most obvious is that you're right and he has gone off you.
Its horrible, but at some point in our lives it happens to most of us, even in a very high proportion of committed relationships, and we know the signs, don't we?
There is nothing wrong with you, just unfortunately people can change with time, and often that change means they're no longer right for each other. I'm sure if you're honest, given his awful treatment of you, you must have gone off him too.
What to do about it? Well I suppose first you need to know if you follow what youre proposing, whether you can remain around him, or will it simply be an endless cycle of you feeling hurt? Would things change if he started seeing someone else, as people often do when they reach this point?
What chances are you passing up for yourself by remaining in the situation? Would you be open to another relationship? Is that possible while remaining in the marriage?

I agree. That's how I'm reading this too. Have we misunderstood OP?

This sounds like he is frustrated with you taking on everything and sidelining him. My DH does this. Takes on everything, doesn't ask for help, doesn't accept support and is then overwhelmed or feels "put upon" or resentful! He is martyring. My friend first noticed this behaviour before I did but it's very annoying and creates distance and conflict between us.

Why did you end up in the park after going to the loo?

If you did do this perhaps you are doing this in response to his behaviour though....distancing yourself?

These situations get so complicated. A partner's behaviour can be insidious. You respond emotionally without really understanding why and then you can't see the wood for the trees about who is in the "wrong". Clarity can be so hard to get to when you are in the thick of it.

Have you had other relationships, op, or is he your first? It just struck me that you say your dad acts like this too and maybe you haven't experienced another way of being?

What a disgusting prick he is. You deserve MUCH better than this. Please, when you can get things in order, consider leaving him.
Your children will not be happy being around a man who treats their mother (and subsequently them) this way.
Best of luck OP.

He sounds unhappy. Possibly not knowing why and taking it out on you.
When you said he says "what I am supposed to say" perhaps tell him You dont have to say anything but listen what I am saying and think about why I am saying this to you. You denying what I say about how I feel doesnt make me stop feeling like that.

He is minimising your feelings by telling you that you are oversensitive. The reality is that he is an arse, and your feelings are valid.

Your best bet would be to bite the bullet and divorce him. It will be difficult at first, dealing with everything, but when the dust settles, you and your kids will have a far happier life than you do now.

There is nothing worse than living with a man who knocks your confidence and makes you feel like shit. You deserve better.

I’m inclined to agree. It might just give him enough of a shock to behave better.

@200miles

Having read your mom recent update. It sounds as though your relationship may be doomed.

It is hard to say who is at fault when there is only one perspective given. How would your husband describe the same events !Would his description and perspective be the same as yours?

Actually, it does not really matter where if any fault lies; it is obvious that you are 2 people who seem to bring out the worse in each other.

Oh god. Fuck him, FUCK.HIM. Prick. Wanker. He can go fuck himself.

In a word OP, no. This kind of thing chips away at your soul until you are so beaten down. There was a research project on micro expressions that said if there was contempt present in newly weds (and you noticed disdain) the relationships failed 100% of the time. Any other emotion could be worked with, but contempt was always a deal breaker.

It’s all very well and good saying leave but that is a huge decision, with its own implications which is often dished out as the solution on here but very rarely implicated.

More practical, less dramatic ways to deal with this would be firstly to talk to him. Tell him you’re a human being and feel his resentment/ick and it’s incredibly sad for you to be living like this.

Secondly absolutely get something for you, a hobbie, interest, treat yourself! Buy yourself something new to make yourself feel good. Build your own confidence so if and when he acts like this you have the strength to let it eat into you.

Know on your own self worth op, you really do deserve better.

How did you end up on the floor in the park op? Bit confused by that.

I agree with pp, he seems abusive. You keep saying you're not scared of him, but you are scared of his reactions and that's pretty much the same thing. You seem to be walking on eggshells. What do you want your children to learn from the two of you about relationships?

Fuck him. FUCK. HIM.

Urgh, a grown man grimacing at a Tampax box. Never mind you giving him the ick, he's given me the ick and I haven't even met him.

This sounds doomed, OP, and you sound really unhappy. Trying to convince yourself/us that it's not that bad because you're not scared of him physically assaulting you- this is not how this stuff is meant to be. By all means get a hobby- that's not going to make up for his mistreatment of you but it might give you the confidence to understand that you deserve better.

He's vile OP, truly vile. He'd get the boot from me.

Do not think for one minute you have to stay with an abuser like this, sucking the joy and life out of you.

When kids are not around you need to tell him quite firmly, it either stops of you divorce. Life is too short to be a martyr for the sake of keeping your family 'together' and putting up with his toxic behaviour towards you. It will only get worse as the years go on.

Big hugs x

Agree with others that contempt is a deal breaker. My DH takes the piss out of me pretty relentlessly (and it’s very much reciprocated) and will sometimes do the “oh, it’s Wimpole again…..” thing. But it’s fine and it’s in the spirit of huge affection with underlying respect. It’s never done to upset or belittle me. And that’s what’s so awful about this. I absolutely agree that your best strategy is to go on the front foot. Be calm and clear and factual. “I now have the distinct impression that you don’t like me very much and have little interest in what I have to say. That is not the basis of an acceptable relationship for me and I don’t like the idea of our children growing up in that context. We need to consider the future of our marriage.” It will either give him a shock and you’ll effect some change - or you’ll realise that you’re right and it’s not a good situation for you to stay in.

Does he admit it op? The eye rolling etc? Have you raised things with him out of the heat of the moment? Because him admitting it and being prepared to talk about it is surely the first thing.

My h and I aren't all that close and I've done the build up my own hobbies and things. I sometimes think it'll depend on if we grow closer or further apart when the kids are older. We're getting on OK generally and dh has picked up some hobbies too which has improved his happiness. And mood.

The kids really are v happy as we rarely argue...I know it sounds like I'm some abused woman in denial but honestly I don't call him out on the eye rolls because I don't want to argue in front of the kids

So you rarely argue but that's only because you put up with his behaviour to avoid arguing? Children see all this and internalise it, whether that's as how they should be treating their future partner or how that should expect to be treated (don't know whether you have girls or boys).

I agree that the contempt starts after marriage or commitment or children.

My x used to be all in awe of how easy I found it to talk to people, how much I genuinely enjoyed talking to people, how I was friendly to the neighbours, his family, he valued all of those sides in me before I was financially dependant on him. Then later, he seemed to forget that he had valued that side in me, and began to have contempt for me that my earning potential didn't match his. It never had. I hadn't changed. He hadn't changed. But what he valued changed.

I'd leave him @200miles it is the gottman study referred to above and it's worth a google for sure.

I left not because I thought I deserved better from another partner, I left because I knew I would be happier alone. I could earn, I did have some earning potential, I wasn't the value-less entity my x seemed to view me as, and I knew that with the emotional intelligence my x had ceased to value, I would always be able to connect with other people, whether I was earning a lot or a little.

As it's turned out, I'm earning a middling amount and I don't seem to need to be as sociable as I once believed. I think that when you're being SAPPED by the vortex that lives in your house, it's natural to strategise that you need connection outside of the home. I had a problem with daydreaming limerence, I fantasised about people I'd known in the past who'd shown me kindness. I may not have seen them for years, but I fantasised that I was bumping in to various people and we were so glad to reconnect. I recognise now that it was a symptom of living with somebody who stubbornly refused to connect.

I see him roll his eyes a lot. He is also worse when we are out. He does have days of being fine with me and we get on but I just feel he doesn't like me that much anymore. I have tried talking to him and he makes a joke. If I push it he will call me sensitive or I'm being mad. If I keep pushing it he can get v angry "get over yourself" "you're talking absolute shit" etc

Ah yes......the old 'My wife is crazy because she has the audacity to be unhappy in our relationship / has a different opinion to me' trick.

On an unintentional level, it's a man who is so convinced that he is so fantastic that he is truly puzzled as to why you wouldn't be happy with your lot, and therefore you must be actually mad.

On an intentional level, which I think it often is, it's a way of shutting down a woman by making her out like she is insane. They do it to destabalise your confidence, your sense that you know your own mind and what's going on. It's a very old trick and is how some Victorian men used to be able to commit to their poor wives to asylums.

https://warwick.ac.uk/fac/arts/history/chm/outreach/trade_in_lunacy/research/womenandmadness/

https://www.theatlantic.com/sponsored/netflix-2017/how-victorian-women-were-oppressed-through-the-use-of-psychiatry/1607/

It's unlikely he's going to admit his disdain for you I'm afraid. He knows that if he does, there will be some kind of expectation on him to change his behaviour or work on your marriage, and he doesn't want to do either. When people lose respect for another person, when they're totally checked out emotionally and even developed disgust for their partner, they're not going to want to improve the situation and repair that bond, because they don't want to bond with you anymore.

My ex tried the whole 'sensitive' thing on me too.....when in fact, the problem was that I was too thick skin. Men like that wouldn't tolerate being treated like this themselves btw, and they know it. It's just another sign of disrespect when they try to make you believe that, that they think you'll actually fall for it, and that you will settle for less than they would.

He clearly want to stay in this marriage for reasons that lie outside a genuine, positive, emotional bond. On some level, it works for him and that's why he won't want to give you the discussion that you need.

Leave him. My ex H used to sigh if I asked him a question while he had his headphones on. It's fucking soul destroying. You are worth so so much more than this.