Should I tell daughter about her abusive dad?

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I’m in two minds what to do about this. Daughter who is 8 has started seeing her dad after court ordered no contact due to abuse and having to complete courses.

He has moved on and has another relationship and a baby very quickly. Daughter says and it appears he’s a changed man and not treating his partner how he did me. To be honest I don’t care, I’m just happy to no longer be with him.

What is getting me is he is behaving like Disney dad on steroids. When we were together he did nothing with our daughter. He has had a personality replacement. The thing is he is re-writing history. He is telling our daughter lies about our relationship. He was extremely cruel and abusive towards me (and every women before me). Instead of being truthful he is literally making it all up. Do I tell her the truth in an age appropriate way? He is so Disney that he looks like an angel and his girlfriend is also doing a lot for him. He tells her it was me who stopped him seeing her when it was a court, he says to her how he is a hero and he fought so hard. The truth was he drank and smoked drugs and had to pass tests. If he is a changed person then that’s really great for her going forward. But why lie about the past and make me out to be to blame? He was so so cruel. Why not be honest and say I was cruel but I’ve done a lot of soul searching etc…. Or is he still abusing me as he knows she will come home and tell me his lies. It’s like that decade just didn’t happen to him, he was awful and aggressive, threw things at me, threatened me. I ended up with life long health issues from the stress and the fear.

Or do I say nothing and let her think her dad is everything he says he is, but then he is blaming me and lying and looking like a hero???

I used to say the judge made this decision because he thought it was best.

All the Daddy says you did x,y,z. Id say what do you think? It's the best tool you can give her.

Sounds good @Wallywobbles and takes it away from what I think. I think amongst the mess of my reply when she asked me why I was cruel and stopped daddy sending her gifts I did manage that a little. I said it was the judge who stopped the gifts. He was asked to post gifts but he didn’t do as the judge asked. She said she would have loved the big pink car he sent her. She said daddy didn’t mean to scare mummy by banging the door he just wanted her to have the gift. I asked if she thought it was ok to scare mummy so she could have a gift? She said no and did give me a hug and said she didn’t want mummy to be scared. I didn’t want that because it’s not for her to be worried about me. I shouldn’t have used the example. I wanted her to understand that it’s not ok to scare a person, we are given rules to follow for a reason, our safety is more important then gifts and that was my boundary and he crossed it.

Finally, someone like @BePatient arrives and says what we (most of us) wanted to say, eloquently. Applause. 👏

So is a narcissist only happy if you make them look good? Does he like to look a hero to his daughter? I suppose it is admiration. Does his girlfriend and child just make him look good to the world?

He clearly has Narcissistic personailty disorder.
It is a vile thing and fairly rare.

He will have suffered some sort of abuse in his childhood.
Look it up,it will help you.

Se3k help ftom a family therapist
Focus on her job to be a child that it is not tobe responsible for adults

I’m the one who is making her life have bad in it even if it’s the truth. He’s just going to get away with all the lies.

Can you see that you’re making up a fear-based story here about “what’s going to happen”? And that the reality is that you don’t know what’s going to happen?

It’s not helpful to do this. You have to remember that if he is playing games, then you are in a long game. You have to be patient, focus on just being the best mum you can be and on teaching your daughter solid principles in life.

What is actually more likely is that she will work out for herself that Daddy doesn’t actually live up to the big hero story he tells about himself. I mean, she already has started to see the basics, that at Daddy’s house everyone has to act like they’re having the best time constantly.

You have to just be patient and trust the process, and be a safe place for her disappointment to land if it comes to that, which it may well do. People reveal their true character over time.

@adriftabroad yes his father was abusive. In court he blamed his behaviour on his childhood.

@CheekyHobson I remember my IDVA many years ago telling me I was in for a long game as he has a long fuse. I think once those stroppy teenager years start it may change. Well she certainly stroppy at my house…an angel at his!

I think that is fine, you are putting things into a context she understands. When she comes up with these questions it is because she is trying to make sense of them in her head, they don’t add up and fit into her child’s understanding of the world, possibly because deep down she remembers feelings and emotions that she picked up on at the time but couldn’t articulate. You are giving her the language to explain the things that are puzzling her, it is helping her to develop emotional intelligence. She will need to hear these things many times as she grows, but in the end she will understand the truth of what happened, and see how even now her father is trying to manipulate situations.

Op does your daughter's school have a counselling programme?

I get very much why you want to talk to her about it. However, unless this is handled really well it can make her VERY conflicted and you can actually make her feel like she cant talk to you about dad or to dad about mum.

So if there is a counsellor who can support you and dd as you together talk about this you can get support and guidance in how to get this done in a manner so dd knows she can always always come to mum with anything. plus she will know she can love Mum and Dad and that's ok.

If handled well this could really teach her how to apply critical thinking.

A counsellor is an excellent idea, not just for you daughters well being but also to flag the issue to authorities. He shouldn't be trying to manipulate her and its a good idea to get outside help.

I think it would be a better idea coming from another person. She gets a bit of help at school but purely about dealing with emotions. She doesn’t know who to believe and I don’t blame her. Half the time I find it difficult so she must very much so.

What Cheeky has said is spot on! You do have to step away from it all a bit and become a little detached. Or you will just get so wrapped up in it all.
I took the exact approach Cheeky talks about and it was the best thing for my children (and for me).
You carn't allow yourself to be pulled in to the game, you don't have to ensure your child knows the truth. You just have to keep on being the best parent possible. Your child will work it out, as my children have. You need to be careful that your responding in the best way and that your not just correcting things as your irritated that he's now pretending to be the Disney dad. Stay true to being the best parent you can be, it will show dividends in the long run.

It’s less the Disney dad and more the lies that I don’t like. Why he needs to make sure she knows he’s 100% clean and spinning it so he looks like the victim and the hero. There is no need. I hate the manipulation. Just be a normal dad.

Why he needs to make sure she knows he’s 100% clean and spinning it so he looks like the victim and the hero.

'Victim' and 'hero' are story-telling elements. Telling ourselves (and others) stories about why things happened and what they mean for the future is part of how all humans tend to make sense of life.

Stories may be solidly based on facts (true stories) or may be invented (fictions). Sometimes it's a bit of both.

Your ex is telling himself (and your daughter) a story about how he was a 'victim' of mummy and the judge conspiring against him to deny him contact and a 'hero' for doing the courses so he could regain contact because he missed her. From the outside, this is obviously all a bit grandiose, and while he deserves some credit for doing the courses instead of ditching his daughter forever (it happens), he's hardly the hero he's making himself out to be, and you're not the witch he's making you out to be.

The relevant facts in this matter are that

• You did take him to court to restrict contact because you felt unsafe with the way he was behaving
• The judge decided that your ex needed to take time out to learn some new behaviours
• Daddy did what he was ordered to do and now he can have contact again

You can feel confident reiterating these facts to your daughter, and correcting any outright distortions on your ex's part, but don't be tempted to stray into storytelling of your own.

Because you are also telling yourself a story, which is that your ex's new 'Disney Dad' persona is a complete put-on, that your daughter is going to be taken in by his version of events, he's going to steal her away and you will lose her forever. In this way you are actually also telling yourself a 'victim' story, with you and her the 'victims' and him some kind of all-powerful sorcerer who can bewitch your daughter with his words and cheat you of your relationship with her.

You're giving him a lot of power with this story! Yes, your daughter may seem sorry for her dad now; all people feel sorry for victims. But she also seems sharp enough to spot some of the distortions and 'fake rules' in his home. She's only little now and she will learn to see things clearly over time. Give your own daughter some more credit for being capable of learning how to discern fact from fiction!

And in the meantime if you want a good story to enjoy and talk about with your daughter, try The Wizard of Oz. It's all about how we find our own strengths inside us when we have to face scary challenges, and that sometimes people who pretend to be Great and Powerful are actually just scared ordinary people who have created a big impressive illusion to hide behind.

@CheekyHobson yes he did do what he was asked, in his own way. Got away with loads as it was over lockdown. Eg they asked for a hair sample test to check for weed and on the time of the test he admitted to shaving his head and his body because he took up cycling. He got away with an awful lot. Anyway why does he feel the need to tell stories that are untrue, is it just so he can get the reactions he is looking for? I don’t want to say anything to change the way our daughter feels about her dad. All the way through court the judge “praised” me for not talking negatively about her dad as it happens so often. The transition from no contact for years to contact was quite smooth as there were no “stories” from me. But now he is doing to me. Is it narcissistic like a pp said?

He was very giving as a partner but it all came at a cost. No one was allowed to question him. He didn’t take sarcastic jokes well at all. I wasn’t allowed to have opinions on his family without him screaming at me. If I made food which wasn’t good enough he was mad. He wanted me to be “one of those wife’s that gym for their parters” etc etc. I used to walk on such eggshells worried he would react at the slightest thing. There were no arguments there was raging explosions. If somethings went bad like health or a death my side he couldn’t care less.

OP did you have any therapy after the relationship? Did you have any contact with Women's Aid or the Freedom Programme?
Your responses to posters' good suggestions are full of emotion around your own relationship with him. I'd gently suggest it would be worth investing time and if you can $, on working through the trauma of your own relationship with him.
You have an 8 year old so unfortunately you've got another decade of him being in your life, you understandably will need some support coming to terms with that and developing some coping strategies for yourself, before you even think about your DD.
Put your own oxygen mask on first.

@Cavagirl i did have some and did the freedom programme but it was mostly over covid so wasn’t what it should.
I couldn’t care less what he says to girlfriends friends etc but it does upset me what he says to our daughter. I absolutely expect him to lie and use it manipulate but I do struggle how to react when she tells me what he has said. I just think why can’t you just not say anything and build the relationship on real life happening now. I feel helpless letting him do this to her. Why does she need someone to be the winner and someone the looser. Both of us contributed, her mum should have never let someone treat her so badly. I should have had better boundaries.

I worry because I think of the impact he had on me as an adult. My mental and physical health were damaged by him. I want to protect her it’s hard to ignore that desire and let it play out.

I could do with some ways to calm my own thoughts when I hear about him and the lies. Any ideas? I’m happy just to say we share different options but these facts happen, then list those about stopping contact and court and a judge etc. I already say it’s good dad did those courses.

Sometimes I get overwhelmed by the thought he literally every other weekend is brainwashing her. In return when she is here we don’t don’t speak about him really. I think should I be more, will eventually everything he says become the truth to her if I say nothing and he keeps on with this your mum was cruel and I am the hero. He says so much to her, she asks me questions sometimes but other times she just talking in general and she knows so much, non of it is true or factual.

Honestly OP from what you've said it doesn't sound like you are doing anything "wrong" in how you are explaining it to her.

But you explaining it to her in a neutral way isn't going to change how you feel about it all, and fundamentally that's what you are asking for help with. Either you want a magic wand to stop him being a twat (impossible sadly) or some way to feel better about the fact that he's being a twat and feel confident that he's not going to ruin you or your daughters' lives despite you having left.

The latter point you can get to, with help. It's great you had some therapy after leaving. Why did you stop? I would start exploring it again, for yourself, as a priority. You're going round in circles in your head on this, and it's not getting you anywhere

On your time with your DD spend it making your bond with your DD closet.

if your DD brings up ex or asks why you were cruel or mean or anything negative. Ask your DD if she thinks you’d be cruel or mean? Then laugh and say I think daddy is getting things mixed up.

don’t let him have a space in your lives when she’s not with him. Make your item together strengthening your bond and enjoying your lives together, meeting friends having happy times, and calm times.

right now your abusive ex is living full time in your DD’s life because your allowing his behaviour to creep into your everyday life even in his absence.

I made it my business to ensure my dc had a calm happy balanced life at home with me. I’d answer their questions but make them think about the answers. My dc have really happy memories of their childhood. I remember utter trauma culminating in my hair falling out from the sheer stress.

m you’re going to have to play it super clever here and not be on the defensive otherwise your ex will drive a wedge in your relationship between you and your child. And that is what you want to avoid at all times. I’d also not emphasise mummy being wrong, bring her into it too, we all get upset sometimes and sometimes we don’t want to do the same thing you didn’t want to go to bed mummy was tired and we fell out. Mummy doesn’t think you were cruel and mummy wasn’t being cruel. We were just tired.

don’t go too deep into explaining and taking blame for everything. Allow your dd to understand that sometimes you’ll both react because you’re tired/hungry/don’t understand. That doesn’t make you mean or cruel.

my DC had excellent support from the school SENCO, they both got CBT, and a safe place to talk about their feelings. Which I felt helped tremendously

Will she believe him though. Will she think less of me because he is telling her that I’m cruel? She now barely talks to my partner. They used to have such a nice relationship. Her dad has told her that she has one dad and mustn’t listen to any other man. one dad one hero all the time. She says I don’t like “kevin” because dad can be my only hero. I have said nothing but good things about his girlfriend as she practically doing it all and she is looked after. He is causing a divide at home. She often says she no longer likes it here as we have rules and at daddy’s she can do what she likes. The school has helped and said there are rules at school, we all must follow rules. At home she is just rebelling against us all. At daddies he sleeps in her bed with her and not the girlfriends, at mummies she sleeps on her own. She never used to have a problem but now every night we have tears, I want daddy in my bed etc etc.

Laugh it off, ask her if she likes superman and Batman and other superhero’s take it down to her level. Change the subject so your talking about super hero’s.

right now you’re playing right into his hands. You’ve got to make him utterly unimportant in your house. And teach her to think widely not just according to her fathers narrow rules.