If you think your partner doesn’t have time for an affair, think again

[toooldforthisshite]

They will find a way. Even the most seemingly gentle, respectable guy, you know, the one who everyone says ‘he would never’. They do.
They will invite their side bit to their work during work hours if necessary to avoid having to make excuses as to why they are late home. They will wait for you to fall asleep then start chatting to her. They will delete every message they receive or send.

its adolescent to think that everyone in a relationship would cheat given the opportunity.

I don't think this.

It's very naive and adolescent to think that love makes a flawless human. And our flaws show in different ways.

Perfectly put and I agree 100%

*But because of the choices those people made, not because of a romanticised version of 'true love'.

People who were 'truely in love' have affairs too. It happens all the
time. People change, things happen, emotions change and you can 'truely
love someone' and 'truely love' someone else at the same time.

It's not always exclusive.*

Of course true love is because of the choices they make, they make decisions to not harm or hinder the relationship they are in, they create boundaries with others.
They make decisions to be fiercely loyal and respect their partner, to protect and nuture the relationship, to connect and be connected.

To make safety a feature just as a parent would with a child, people who truly love do not abandon their care, they do not put their own selfish wants above another, it is entirely preventable to not harm another. With affairs it is a choice to transfer feelings or share feelings with another. It is not written in the stars.

How could you possibly love someone outside of marriage and not recognise that you are hurting a betrayed partner, that's not love, it's not kind, it's one of the most hurtful things you could do to another.

No most of the time when cheaters say they still love their wives/partners, what they mean is I'm doing what I want but I really believe true love means you should still love and forgive me for whatever I do.

No, thats not love, that's love for yourself.

If it's proper love; it should run so deep so as to hurt the other person is not even a consideration.

Few people who cheat intend to hurt their partner. Isn't "we never meant to hurt anyone" the calling card of uncovered affairs?

I don't know if there's any litmus test that can determine "love" and "not love". People are flawed and even when in love, can do things they shouldn't; doesn't mean it isn't love. Some marriages last until death with no infidelity, but the people don't actually love each other. Some abusers genuinely love their partners as much as they're able to love anyone, but they're weak, damaged or stupid people and their love is toxic and destructive. Some men never stop philandering but also never stop loving their wives.

The idea that there's a litmus test for love or not love is simplistic. If it were that easy to determine, human relationships wouldn't be as messy and complex as they are.

Just excuses.

Never should have been married, there are many reasons other than an endurance test staying within a marriage.

Some people just don't have the capacity to understand that catering to one's own needs at varying times of life can harm others, that's ok there are plenty of people with the same views, that some things are not a constant.

People change, people can be selfish, ambitious, greedy, intolerant of others needs and yes I agree their are many people who are not marriage material or parent material.

What's so hard to understand some people are more reliable and talk truths when entering relationships, others view love as a passing phase.

We are all different, some people are serious with their words, others are not.

@DarrellRiversCriminalBehaviourOrder totally agree with all that. Someone said that decent faithful men- it wouldn't cross their minds- not in my experience or my friends- all of whom would I'm sure have said their menfolk were decent faithful men - until they were not and were caught out. Mumsnet is full of decent family guys of all ages (their wife genuinely believed this) caught out texting hookers, webcamming with sex workers, having secretive liaisons with colleagues etc. it's actually very bloody depressing , but sadly the reality for many these days.

" I never meant to hurt anyone" is a very primitive way of thinking,
because you DID hurt everyone, it doesn't matter if you MEANT to!
You might 'not have meant to hurt anyone' but you absolutely did mean to be selfish, careless and reckless !

I think these are the worst kind of people in life because everyone in their vicinity becomes collateral damage,
they just go through life doing whatever they want breaking all the rules and hurting people along the way
they don't have any empathy or problem solving skills
and its such a dangerous mindset to have

A drunk driver can crash into and kill people then say " I never meant to hurt anybody, I only wanted to drive home"
There is a disconnect between their actions and the consequences!

A drug addict can steal from their own grandmother and say " I didnt mean to hurt her, I just really needed money for my drugs"

And a cheater can say "I never meant to hurt my wife and kids , I Just really wanted to have sex with the neighbour "

What they really mean is that they regret being caught because now they have to deal with the consequences of their actions,
but they will absolutely do it all again if it means they wont be caught.

So the statement "I never meant to hurt anyone" will always be a cop out , because they DO hurt people with their actions, they hurt everyone around them
and they are taking zero accountability,
what a cheater should be saying is, " I didnt think about anyone but myself and I am sorry for hurting you"

Selfish intentions will always hurt other people, directly or indirectly
We are taught these simple rules in primary school " be kind , treat others how you want to be treated , dont be selfish"
seems like some people need to go back to year 1

@Asuitcase

Some people just don't have the capacity to understand that catering to one's own needs at varying times of life can harm others, that's ok there are plenty of people with the same views, that some things are not a constant.

I guess we just have different perspectives on this. I don't equate love with endlessly having to put your needs below someone else's. To me that's not love, it's martyrdom.

The only person for whom I would constantly and reliably downgrade my own needs is my child. I don't love anyone else enough (and I will never love anyone enough) to do this for them.

I have been married and I'll never get married again, partly because I didn't like the way I felt I got lost within my marriage. So I'm definitely not marriage material. I'm quite capable of love though: I have loved many people and I love my current partner and have no plans to leave him. But if his needs started to interfere with mine I would move on. There are no prizes in life for doggedly putting someone else's needs ahead of your own at the cost of your own happiness.

Love is a wonderful thing and can massively enhance your life but when it starts becoming an exercise in fulfilling someone else's needs it's not worth it.

"I never meant to hurt anyone" is a very primitive way of thinking,because you DID hurt everyone, it doesn't matter if you MEANT to!

It's not an excuse. But some people are saying you don't hurt people if you love them. The thinking behind some affairs is that it'll be OK because nobody will get hurt.

Daft and stupid, sure. Proof that a person's pain isn't important to them, not so much. In their thought process, it's not an outcome that'll happen.

With all that said, nobody has to forgive an affair if they don't want to. I don't know if I could. It's a lot to get past and the circumstances around it would matter. But it isn't, on its own, proof that someone doesn't love their spouse, although of course the spouse may well decide the love isn't worth having and maybe it's not.

You're being insufferably smug and insulting the vast numbers of women (and men) who have been hurt by cheating partners. Are you really saying that those partners never loved them?

It seems to me that you really don't understand the premise of the OP at all but, you're not on your own there, looking at the number of posters rushing in to defend their precious Nigels...

I wonder how many of those Nigels have played away, or are continuing an affair safe in the knowledge that their partner firmly believes that their love is of higher standard than anybody else's...? Or, the Nigel concerned keeps on trying but nobody will go there so the partner has married the 'perfect' specimen... faithful until death parts them?

To me , it is all the things that cheating involves..

. Risking your partners sexual health
.Gaslighting and lying to your partner, to avoid being caught
.Giving away your time and finances to your affair partner (spending less time with your wife or kids , so you can have an affair)
. Risking pregnancy
. Putting your partner and kids in danger, if the affair partner is unstable and starts stalking or harassing

Those are things that I can think at the top of my head , and that is not loving someone
Love cant exist without respect ,honesty, empathy, kindness, what is love without those things??

Alot of people don't know what love really is , and that is why they can forgive being cheated on

Some people were never shown healthy examples of what love is when they were growing up ,
so they tend to be the ones who accept things like cheating in their relationships
I was the same and I had to learn the hard way, what love is and what love is not,

If you have children , it should be giving you a new perspective of what healthy love looks like ,
You would never accept someone lying to, abusing or cheating on your children , you would want your child to leave that relationship immediately
so why would you accept that yourself ?

i meant to tag you on my previous comment @DarrellRiversCriminalBehaviourOrder x

Agreed. Erudite, to the point and extremely articulate on a subject that isn't so easy to define.

Kudos, Thelaughingtonepoliceman 👏

Proof that a person's pain isn't important to them, not so much

No. I dont buy this at all. Cheating behind your partner's back and constantly lying to them (and lying to your own kids if they are old enough to ask where you've been) and potentially putting them at risk of an STD shows a distinct lack of care about their partner's pain to me. I honestly dont know how you could interpret it any other way. Yes, they may think noone will find out but to say their partner's pain is important to them is just nonsense. It clearly isnt, or if it is, it is very easily outweighed by the attraction of a shag.

Alot of people don't know what love really is , and that is why they can forgive being cheated on

I've never cheated and as far as I know, my husband has never cheated on me. But for some reason, I find this sentence very presumptuous and also very prescriptive. "If you can get over an affair, you don't know what love is."

I suppose I ought to leave it for someone who's been in that situation to respond. It strikes a bad note with me, personally.

As someone who has been in this situation, I completely agree with you. I think this article by Cheryl Strayed (as a Dear Sugar column responding to someone asking about forgiveness after infidelity) sums it up better than I ever could.

https://therumpus.net/2011/08/12/dear-sugar-the-rumpus-advice-column-81-a-bit-of-sully-in-your-sweet/

That is a tremendous article, booksandbrews, thanks for posting the link.

If I understand the purpose of this thread correctly, then people that believe that they are in stable and trusting relationships should take on the message from the following OP quotes:

“Don’t kid yourself. If it’s on offer they will take it.”

“100% of the time if right/circumstances in life etc and they think they can get away with it, even if it’s a quick one time thing.”

“All I’m saying is, don’t be naive to think it would never happen to you. You probably just don’t realise it probably already has.”

“It’s reality, however grim.”

I for one can’t readily accept this as my reality.

@booksandbrews. What a totally tremendous piece- I've kind of been there and I could feel my heart in my mouth. There is so much honesty and truth in it too. I think everyone should read this.

Also I think that if someone forgives cheating straight away and then carries in as normal , then they have done it themselves. It must be a relief and a weight off their back .

@mydogisthebest I meant what I said... to many people its like this - if you been with the same partner for a very long time, and there is a chance to have a grope, a kiss, a shag maybe with someone you like to make yourself feel desired and attractive - some people would take this chance, if they think their partner will not find out. some people I know had affairs when their relationship was going through a rough patch. some had flings with colleagues for no reason at all, just because the offer was there. they all would not leave their partners.
why I said if they are attractive - come on, its much easier for attractive people to get someone, that's just life.

@fryanddry
’Love cant exist without respect ,honesty, empathy, kindness, what is love without those things??

Alot of people don't know what love really is , and that is why they can forgive being cheated on’

I am reconciled, I showed respect, honesty, empathy, kindness and grace and a whole lot more in my reconciliation process, your view of love exceeded.

It’s not a question of my understanding of love, it’s a question of his at the time. In that conversation we can go round in circles, personally I believe he was incapable of loving anyone at that point not me, not the AP, not our family. He was too wrapped up in himself.

But don’t question my love. How utterly ludicrous.

And again with the assumptions reconciled women are self esteem less, wall flowers. I have made a few friends on this journey and they have had to fight to move forward, battle societies view of them, some read the bs that appears on here regularly. Believe you and me they’re amazing.

@GoodNightsSleep sadly it is reality. Another sad reality is that there is a high probability that a few of the posters on this thread fighting against my original post is in the exact situation I’m talking about. She just hasn’t found out yet.

Yup! Spot on!

I personally never cheated on anyone, I would like to say because I have high morals - but probably also to do with the fact that I'm not adventurous, have low sex drive and generally is not very "sexy". But I was cheated on quite a few times.