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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Was Any one on here the OW?

211 replies

Mindovermatter247 · 13/04/2023 22:37

I always see a woman go nuts at the other women when obviously it takes 2 to tango and the men are defo not blameless, in fact sometime the Ow is a victim too, especially if they had no idea about man’s real or other life.
live always wanted to h3ar the experiences of the other woman…
did you know he was married/in a relationship? If so why did you continue affair?
how many didn’t know bloke had another life?
we always hear the males point of view, Hardly the point of view of the other person..

OP posts:
monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 08:58

@MadeForFun

Getting regular tests does zero to prevent you getting an STD, some of which are lifelong and not entirely treatable. It just means you know you have them once you already have them.

Sex with this man is honestly worth risking your sexual health?

I mean this genuinely, I think it's really sad that your self worth is so low you're risking that to shag someone.

Let alone someone who is such an arsehole they have unprotected sex without their wife's knowledge.

And that you hope he's 'decent' enough to get tested regularly when the one thing you know about him for sure is that he's capable of violating women's right to full sexual informed consent.

Susieb2023 · 15/04/2023 09:00

DuesExMachina · 15/04/2023 08:54

Not my problem. (Have been the OW)

I threw my ex out for cheating. Did I blame the people he slept with? Hell no! That's silly and taking the blame off my ex.

Show quote history

Hard to violate someone’s right to informed sexual consent without a willing partner.

DuesExMachina · 15/04/2023 09:01

@Susieb2023

Your comment doesn't relate to mine?

MaJolie · 15/04/2023 09:04

I don’t know why there’s so much surprise on these threads at women saying they had affairs with married/partnered men, when accounts by posters of their husbands and male partners being unfaithful are regarded as absolutely par for the course and are viewed as a likely cause for any kind of mildly ‘off’ male behaviour. Who is it you think these men are sleeping with?

Susieb2023 · 15/04/2023 09:05

Yes it does. @letthatmango made a point about right to informed sexual consent. Your position is that it’s not your problem as it’s the cheats responsibility, agreed.

My point is it’s hard for a cheat to violate someone’s right to consent without a willing partner.

I really struggle to understand how anyone could find someone who does that attractive. I personally couldn’t assist in the abuse of another person.

DuesExMachina · 15/04/2023 09:08

Susieb2023 · 15/04/2023 09:05

Yes it does. @letthatmango made a point about right to informed sexual consent. Your position is that it’s not your problem as it’s the cheats responsibility, agreed.

My point is it’s hard for a cheat to violate someone’s right to consent without a willing partner.

I really struggle to understand how anyone could find someone who does that attractive. I personally couldn’t assist in the abuse of another person.

Have a medal.

Honestly, life is messy and complicated. People fuck up.

There are worse things than being cheated on. It's a shitty thing to do and a bad way to end a relationship (and it is the end) but people dwell on it too much as opposed to get ruin on with their lives.

Bearpawk · 15/04/2023 09:09

Yes, me. I was 16 years younger than him, his marriage was already on the rocks and I was leaving a desperately unhealthy toxic relationship. Paid me attention I was craving, made me feel good about myself etc. total love bombing. Started as EA and became sexual. He was making plans with me for the future etc. and moved out of the family home.

Then they reconciled and he told her about his affair - she took him back and he cut me off citing a breakdown. I think I knew even at the time I'd dodged a bullet. But I'm not proud of myself and I absolutely wouldn't do the same thing with the benefit of age and self esteem again, I knew It was wrong at the time though.

I feel very bad for the wife but I was too selfish and swept up to care at the time.

MadeForFun · 15/04/2023 09:11

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 08:56

@MadeForFun

So, in my mind, he is the one violating her right to informed consent.

I agree his vows are his responsibility.

But you are actively facilitating him violating her right to informed consent.

If I was a bystander to someone violating violating their partner's rights, I would at minimum disengage from them and walk away. Not facilitate it let alone want to have sex with them.

If you knew he was stealing money from her hard earned savings (for example) to pay for some travel / hotels to meet you and have sex, would you still meet him and have sex? Knowing he was violating her trust in that way?

No, I wouldn't continue with the affair if I knew he was stealing from her to facilitate it.

I know how hypocritical it sounds but I don't want to cause her any pain or suffering, she doesn't deserve that.

I've known him for over 10 years and, maybe more fool me, but I genuinely believe he is a decent guy and isn't out to cause his wife suffering either.

I suppose its as the saying goes - ignorance is bliss. We don't talk about his wife or his relationship with her, so it doesn't factor into my decision to continue sleeping with him.

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 09:15

@MadeForFun

No, I wouldn't continue with the affair if I knew he was stealing from her to facilitate it.

I know how hypocritical it sounds but I don't want to cause her any pain or suffering, she doesn't deserve that.

Yeah I can't get my head around the cognitive dissonance required to say this and yet not at the very least use protection when shagging her husband.

You don't want to cause her any pain and suffering but are already actively facilitating her right to informed consent being entirely removed (when you wouldn't facilitate him stealing money from her, which is arguably less violating) and actively choose not to use protection therefore increasing that violation.

And as I said, getting regular tests does zero to prevent you getting an STD, some of which are lifelong and not entirely treatable. It just means you know you have them once you already have them.

Sex with this man is honestly worth risking your sexual health?

I mean this genuinely, I think it's really sad that your self worth is so low you're risking that to shag someone.

Maybe83 · 15/04/2023 09:19

I honestly think the line 'life is messy & complicated' is one of the most weak over used drivil ever. No life is full of choices. Choices driven by the type of person you are and the character and internal belief system you have about yourself and others.

@MadeForFun you are an absolute fool to put your own sexual health at risk by having unprotected sex with someone you know is engaging in infidelity and willing to do it unprotected. Sexual diseases have risen massively in people in their 40s and older. His wife thinks she is in a monogamous relationship. You at least have the knowledge you aren't. While you were still with your partner were you having sex with out protection with them at the same time?

DuesExMachina · 15/04/2023 09:22

Maybe83 · 15/04/2023 09:19

I honestly think the line 'life is messy & complicated' is one of the most weak over used drivil ever. No life is full of choices. Choices driven by the type of person you are and the character and internal belief system you have about yourself and others.

@MadeForFun you are an absolute fool to put your own sexual health at risk by having unprotected sex with someone you know is engaging in infidelity and willing to do it unprotected. Sexual diseases have risen massively in people in their 40s and older. His wife thinks she is in a monogamous relationship. You at least have the knowledge you aren't. While you were still with your partner were you having sex with out protection with them at the same time?

Weak or not, it's true.

People fuck up. Even normally decent people fuck up.

This is why we have concepts like forgiveness and second chances.

I'm too old for the moral absolutism you're preaching

Foxontherun · 15/04/2023 09:23

I've been both the OW and on the receiving end. The circumstances for both were complicated (and downright fucking stupid).

For all of those blamers and shamers life isn't simple despite what you think.

DuesExMachina · 15/04/2023 09:24

Foxontherun · 15/04/2023 09:23

I've been both the OW and on the receiving end. The circumstances for both were complicated (and downright fucking stupid).

For all of those blamers and shamers life isn't simple despite what you think.

Exactly!

MadeForFun · 15/04/2023 09:27

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 09:15

@MadeForFun

No, I wouldn't continue with the affair if I knew he was stealing from her to facilitate it.

I know how hypocritical it sounds but I don't want to cause her any pain or suffering, she doesn't deserve that.

Yeah I can't get my head around the cognitive dissonance required to say this and yet not at the very least use protection when shagging her husband.

You don't want to cause her any pain and suffering but are already actively facilitating her right to informed consent being entirely removed (when you wouldn't facilitate him stealing money from her, which is arguably less violating) and actively choose not to use protection therefore increasing that violation.

And as I said, getting regular tests does zero to prevent you getting an STD, some of which are lifelong and not entirely treatable. It just means you know you have them once you already have them.

Sex with this man is honestly worth risking your sexual health?

I mean this genuinely, I think it's really sad that your self worth is so low you're risking that to shag someone.

As DuesExMachina alluded to earlier, life isn't as black and white as that.

I've known this man over 10 years and I trust him. I trust him to tell me if he were sleeping with all and sundry. Like I said, I don't believe he wants to cause his wife pain any more than I do.

MadeForFun · 15/04/2023 09:31

Maybe83 · 15/04/2023 09:19

I honestly think the line 'life is messy & complicated' is one of the most weak over used drivil ever. No life is full of choices. Choices driven by the type of person you are and the character and internal belief system you have about yourself and others.

@MadeForFun you are an absolute fool to put your own sexual health at risk by having unprotected sex with someone you know is engaging in infidelity and willing to do it unprotected. Sexual diseases have risen massively in people in their 40s and older. His wife thinks she is in a monogamous relationship. You at least have the knowledge you aren't. While you were still with your partner were you having sex with out protection with them at the same time?

My sex life with my ex dwindled years before I started this arrangement with my AP.

Ex and I slept together (forced on me by him) maybe only 5 times in the 3 and a half years between me starting the affair and eventually leaving him.

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 09:33

@MadeForFun

I honestly understand life isn't simple or black and white. I don't think I've said otherwise and I believe I've been respectful in my dialogue with you.

But you're actively making a choice to do something that puts your sexual health at risk. That is self destructive and indicative of a lack of self worth that is worth you working on IMO.

I've known this man over 10 years and I trust him. I trust him to tell me if he were sleeping with all and sundry.

You trust someone you know is capable of convincingly lying even to someone he shares a home and life with.

Even with that aside, you said elsewhere on here (I remembered as last time there was a bit of a pile on directed at you, so I double checked) that you're 80% certain he's sleeping with other people as well as you and her.

Maybe not 'all and sundry' but if he's shagging one other person and they have an STD, you'll likely get it too.

Deceiving yourself isn't going to change the fact you're risking your sexual health.

Please think about reconsidering and at least using condoms.

MadeForFun · 15/04/2023 09:40

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 09:33

@MadeForFun

I honestly understand life isn't simple or black and white. I don't think I've said otherwise and I believe I've been respectful in my dialogue with you.

But you're actively making a choice to do something that puts your sexual health at risk. That is self destructive and indicative of a lack of self worth that is worth you working on IMO.

I've known this man over 10 years and I trust him. I trust him to tell me if he were sleeping with all and sundry.

You trust someone you know is capable of convincingly lying even to someone he shares a home and life with.

Even with that aside, you said elsewhere on here (I remembered as last time there was a bit of a pile on directed at you, so I double checked) that you're 80% certain he's sleeping with other people as well as you and her.

Maybe not 'all and sundry' but if he's shagging one other person and they have an STD, you'll likely get it too.

Deceiving yourself isn't going to change the fact you're risking your sexual health.

Please think about reconsidering and at least using condoms.

You have been very respectful in your dialogue, thank you. It makes a change from some of the responses I've had on here!

I agree with you about the self destructive behaviour and self-worth. I've been shafted by my parents, and my fiance so yes my self-esteem has been on the floor for many years. AP is going some way to fixing that "gap" for me i suppose, and selfishly I'm taking it.

I now no longer think he's sleeping with anyone else as we've discussed it and he's made his assurances- which I know amounts to nothing really.

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 09:46

@MadeForFun

I agree with you about the self destructive behaviour and self-worth. I've been shafted by my parents, and my fiance so yes my self-esteem has been on the floor for many years. AP is going some way to fixing that "gap" for me i suppose, and selfishly I'm taking it.

Sorry to hear your parents did a number on you.

But your affair isn't fixing that gap, it's reinforcing it.

If as an adult your daughter has self-esteem on the floor (not due to you, but just hypothetically) and she told you she had started sleeping with a married man and she believed it was fixing her self esteem, would you agree with her that it was doing that?

If my daughter said it, I would gently tell her that accepting the advances of a married man and having unprotected sex with them, based on their word only that they weren't shagging anyone else, it was indicative of very low self worth - lower self worth than rejecting his advances or at the very least respecting herself enough to protect her sexual health.

Short term dopamine hits and ego boosts are not the same as increased self worth / self esteem.

I now no longer think he's sleeping with anyone else as we've discussed it and he's made his assurances- which I know amounts to nothing really.

😞

If you were my friend I would shake you. I think (and may be wrong of course) that the reality is you know full well he can and would shag other people, but you want to continue getting reinforcement for him more than you want to protect yourself.

Which is your prerogative but makes me really sad.

Life isn't simple, no. But to get perspective on a situation you're in the thick of, ask yourself if your daughter was doing this and describing it all the way you do, would you believe she was correct and level headed, or would you think she was kidding herself?

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 09:47

'Reinforcement from him' that was meant to say.

Maybe83 · 15/04/2023 09:48

@Foxontherun why do you assume people who think cheating is wrong and pretty low example of the character of a person think life is simple?

Do you think that only people who have crossed the line to infidelity are they only ones to experience attraction to someone other than their partner? Been in relationships that have periods of low intimacy? Suffer bordem in LTR? Highly stressful situations like death illness, infertility? Depression, anxiety, mismatched libido s? Periods of questioning their relationship, stress with smalls kids, feeling unappreciated in a relationship?

Most people that have passed the honeymoon stage of a relationship know having a adult relationship and all the baggage that goes along with it make life anything but simple. They just make different choices to deal with it.

@DuesExMachina Despite what I would like to think I'm officially middle aged. Not sure how being 'old' enough is an excuse to believe morals is a bad thing.

If anything I'm old enough to have seen many times over the damage caused by infidelity on all sides and don't have the luxury and inexperiencance of youth to fall back on to excuse. Considering the topic of discussion I don't take that as a mad thing.

A mistake is a drunken one night stand. A mistake is not months of lying to your partners face to sneak of to have sex with someone else. It isn't taking time money and attention away from your family for an orgasm. It isn't changing your relationship from monogamous to non monogamous without your partner knowing. Its hundreds and in years long affairs its thousands of choices.

MadeForFun · 15/04/2023 09:59

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 09:46

@MadeForFun

I agree with you about the self destructive behaviour and self-worth. I've been shafted by my parents, and my fiance so yes my self-esteem has been on the floor for many years. AP is going some way to fixing that "gap" for me i suppose, and selfishly I'm taking it.

Sorry to hear your parents did a number on you.

But your affair isn't fixing that gap, it's reinforcing it.

If as an adult your daughter has self-esteem on the floor (not due to you, but just hypothetically) and she told you she had started sleeping with a married man and she believed it was fixing her self esteem, would you agree with her that it was doing that?

If my daughter said it, I would gently tell her that accepting the advances of a married man and having unprotected sex with them, based on their word only that they weren't shagging anyone else, it was indicative of very low self worth - lower self worth than rejecting his advances or at the very least respecting herself enough to protect her sexual health.

Short term dopamine hits and ego boosts are not the same as increased self worth / self esteem.

I now no longer think he's sleeping with anyone else as we've discussed it and he's made his assurances- which I know amounts to nothing really.

😞

If you were my friend I would shake you. I think (and may be wrong of course) that the reality is you know full well he can and would shag other people, but you want to continue getting reinforcement for him more than you want to protect yourself.

Which is your prerogative but makes me really sad.

Life isn't simple, no. But to get perspective on a situation you're in the thick of, ask yourself if your daughter was doing this and describing it all the way you do, would you believe she was correct and level headed, or would you think she was kidding herself?

I totally agree with everything you're saying. I shouldn't have said "fixing", that wasn't the right word. More like just a temporary plaster over the unhappiness!

I've actually been feeling myself distancing from him as time has gone on since separating from my ex so what you're saying makes a lot of sense to me.

Thank you for your honest opinion and for not just immediately jumping on the "what a heartless bitch!" bandwagon.

DuesExMachina · 15/04/2023 10:02

@Maybe83

Of course cheating is wrong. Nobody is denying that, however you seem to want to condem people forever for it. Seeing things in black and white is usually a feature of inexperience.

The ex I cheated on deserved it really, it was a bad way to end the relationship but the violent, controlling, rapist (on our wedding night too) twat deserved a far worse punishment.

Someone cheated on me. He was a tedious waste of space and it gave me the wake up call to get rid.

When I was the other woman (not the same man as above), he actually helped me escape the rapist twat above.

It was all a long time ago and I'm now happily married to someone entirely different.

monsteramunch · 15/04/2023 10:04

@MadeForFun

I really hope you can break end this affair, especially as it sounds like you know it would be best for you but due to your self esteem issues you're prioritising the short term dopamine hit over your long term wellbeing.

If you don't feel able to do so anytime soon, please try to use protection in the meantime. Your self esteem will take an almost unbearable hit if you were to get an STD from this man when deep down you know it's foolish, reckless and self destructive to be shagging him unprotected.

You'd be so angry and disappointed in yourself if that was to happen, regardless of however you feel about moral responsibilities / accountability when it comes to his wife. Especially if the STD wasn't easily treatable.

Don't sabotage your wellness for a short term fix to a long term issue. Be the woman you'd love your daughter to grow up to be, let that fuel you.

I hope you decide to stop seeing him ASAP.

Foxontherun · 15/04/2023 10:14

Maybe83 · 15/04/2023 09:48

@Foxontherun why do you assume people who think cheating is wrong and pretty low example of the character of a person think life is simple?

Do you think that only people who have crossed the line to infidelity are they only ones to experience attraction to someone other than their partner? Been in relationships that have periods of low intimacy? Suffer bordem in LTR? Highly stressful situations like death illness, infertility? Depression, anxiety, mismatched libido s? Periods of questioning their relationship, stress with smalls kids, feeling unappreciated in a relationship?

Most people that have passed the honeymoon stage of a relationship know having a adult relationship and all the baggage that goes along with it make life anything but simple. They just make different choices to deal with it.

@DuesExMachina Despite what I would like to think I'm officially middle aged. Not sure how being 'old' enough is an excuse to believe morals is a bad thing.

If anything I'm old enough to have seen many times over the damage caused by infidelity on all sides and don't have the luxury and inexperiencance of youth to fall back on to excuse. Considering the topic of discussion I don't take that as a mad thing.

A mistake is a drunken one night stand. A mistake is not months of lying to your partners face to sneak of to have sex with someone else. It isn't taking time money and attention away from your family for an orgasm. It isn't changing your relationship from monogamous to non monogamous without your partner knowing. Its hundreds and in years long affairs its thousands of choices.

All I said was that life isnt as clear cut as it seems sometimes. You're right about choices. Look at how many people make the wrong ones...

IME, you can't turn back the clock, you can't change them, only learn from that wonderful thing called hindsight.

DuesExMachina · 15/04/2023 10:18

@Foxontherun

Exactly! I learned a lot about myself and human nature from all of that.

The only thing I regret, is marrying the twat and shacking up with the tedious waste of space. Even the later provided a window into how utterly limited some people are.

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