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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Married to someone with Asperger's/ASD: support thread 8

984 replies

Daftasabroom · 12/04/2023 11:55

New thread.

This thread is for partners seeking to understand the dynamics of mixed NT/ND partnerships. It is a support thread, and a safe space to have a bit of a rant. Avoid sweeping generalisations if possible, try and keep it specific to you and your partner. (ASD partners welcome to lurk or pop in, but please don't argue with other posters and tell them they are wrong)

Link to previous thread

Page 40 | Married to someone with Asperger's/ASC: support thread 7 | Mumsnet

Mumsnet makes parents' lives easier by pooling knowledge, advice and support on everything from conception to childbirth, from babies to teenagers.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/4681774-married-to-someone-with-aspergersasc-support-thread-7?page=40&reply=125367664

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
Daftasabroom · 09/09/2023 18:00

We're away for an incredibly badly organized (by DW) and fraught family weekend. Me grumbling to DSIL that everyone seems to have preconceived plans, haven't communicated them to each other, but refusing to compromise. Resulting in utter chaos. DSIL tells me that's their whole family, all over, always has been.

Between them they have totally normalized being completely oblivious to those closest to them.

I have ADHD so loitering in a roasting car park for an hour and a half to decide whether the other carpark two minutes up the road is closer to the beach really doesn't make for a good day out.

OP posts:
SquirrelSoShiny · 09/09/2023 18:48

I think the issue is that ND generally is so inheritable that families 'normalise' all sorts of behaviours which are actually anything but. All families do this to some extent but it's enhanced with ND families.

Every single member of my family of birth has ADHD symptoms in varying presentations. Some more impulsive, others more inattentive. All reactive. The biggest issue is when individuals have no self-awareness.

SpecialMangeTout · 09/09/2023 19:53

Thats a good point re normalising sone behaviours.

Ive just had a taste of it recently with DH, MIL, SIL and her ds. I have to say it left me wondering if I was on a different planet…. The carelessness towards other people and assuming they would just fit into their plans was Shock

Ohdostopwafflinggeremy · 12/09/2023 08:50

Dh has been gone for a couple of weeks with work, hence why I haven't needed to be here so much🤫 I can decompress, re-center myself and just breathe again. Its actually always lovely when he's gone, sad to say.
Since me finding out about dh's childhood ADHD diagnosis I have been trying to remember the last 25 years of our life together with that new narrative. I realised that dh has been emotionally unavailable for most of it.
One of the main issues I have always had is dh's lack of interest in the kids. Sadly I seem to have accepted his lack of interest in me.
I found out that dh hadn't really asked ds anything about his new school, so I asked how he felt about that. Both ds & dd said that they just accept that is how dad is, there but not there. They just sort of accept that their dad is not really interested in their lives.😥I feel so sad for them.
When I look back I realise that I have made almost every single decision in our lives. I have lived with comments from my family like: "Oh poor Jeremy""Jeremy just does as he's told""Jeremy has the life of a dog""Oh, you're so lucky Jeremy is so easy-going ""You've always got Jeremy doing things around the house for you"
Dh laps these comments up, thinks its hilarious actually.
The fact is though i do make all the decisions, not because im a tyrannical bitch but because dh will not make decisions, he always defers to me "Whatever you think""If that's what you want""If you think that's a good idea"
I actually think I'd have to be resuscitated if dh made some huge decision on his own. He will even call me 3/4 times from the supermarket to "make sure I'm getting the right thing"🙄
Anyway i have realised I have decided where we live, because dh doesn't mind, our car, because dh doesn't mind, furniture, because dh doesn't mind, vacations, because dh doesn't mind, the kids schools, because I would know best, what to have for dinner, because dh doesn't mind. I could go on but you see the pattern.
It has been hard, but it seems I have painted myself into this corner without even realising it.
I'm in the process of accepting and moving on from it. I'm trying really hard to focus on the good and not dwell on the bad at the moment.

BlueTick · 12/09/2023 09:35

This reply has been withdrawn

The OP has privacy concerns and so we've agreed to take this down.

Ohdostopwafflinggeremy · 12/09/2023 09:40

Being able to come on here and just say exactly how i feel without being judged or shot down in flames is such a relief. Thank you all💐

Ohdostopwafflinggeremy · 13/09/2023 08:44

@BlueTick I spent yesterday pondering what you said about dh not being able to identify or name his feelings. It makes sense.
I know dh loves us, he loves us by doing stuff. Someone once said on here that their partner loved them by 'being of service' to them. I think I understand what that means now.
Dh is very handy, he will do almost anything I ask around the house, putting down decking, making one big room into 2 smaller rooms, putting shelves up....etc. He never complains, just starts at the beginning and does the job. He does these things really well, because he has the right tools for the job and it makes me happy. When he does something like shopping, vacuuming, the dishes, he announces it to me, it always bugs me as I'm thinking 'What do you want, a standing ovation?' When really all of his service actions are his act of love, the flowers and chocolates if you will.
His inability to function on an emotional level is not deliberate or intentional, he just doesn't have the right tools basically.
These last few months have been a bit of a roller coaster for me and I have learned so much from this thread. Dh and I have been together a long time and I still think it will be healthier if we end up living 'together but apart' in the future. At least now I think I'm just beginning to understand his love language. I have also realised that I want to keep learning which actually made me cry happy tears🥹

bunhead1979 · 13/09/2023 11:58

Oh yes nodding along to having to make all the decisions. It is exhausting. I sometimes think that he must be so unhappy, and we also have the narrative that I have "bullied" or "dragged" him in to things all through our lives , but then I make myself remember that I am a very reasonable person and he is, and has been throughout, a full grown man completely free to air his own opinions and make his own decisions, including it being totally possible for him to walk away from everything if he wanted to. But he hasn't, so now I refuse to "take the blame" for where we have ended up. It would almost have been easier, for all of us, for him to just up sticks and leave us all. I would just have made it all work for me and the kids, as I do anyway and have always done.

The decision thing has another viewpoint here as well. He is a bright man, yet will often make the "wrong" decision based on the ease for him. So if the "correct" option is harder work for him, he will just choose the other option, but couch it in that his is genuine opinion, using it as a get out of jail free card. Rather than thinking, I need to choose the "right" thing and accept that it will be the more difficult one. It drives me mental.

Daftasabroom · 13/09/2023 12:53

Thought for the Day on Radio 4 this morning was rather poignant this morning. Well worth a listen, it's only 2 or 3 minutes.

OP posts:
SpecialMangeTout · 13/09/2023 13:30

then I make myself remember that I am a very reasonable person and he is, and has been throughout, a full grown man completely free to air his own opinions and make his own decisions, including it being totally possible for him to walk away from everything if he wanted to. But he hasn't, so now I refuse to "take the blame" for where we have ended up

YY to that.

I think women are made responsible for taking a lot of the big decisions in a marriage. You just have to read all the ‘but if you dint want to have sex/arent happy/whatever other issue, you need to set him free and let him rebuild his life with someone who can give him that’ posts on MN.
As if men couldn’t take a decision themselves and decide tte situation isn’t good for them 🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️

LoveFoolMe · 13/09/2023 14:50

Thanks @Daftasabroom, very apt.

Here's the link for anyone interested
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0gd8r1v

Thought for the Day - Akhandadhi Das - BBC Sounds

13 SEP 23

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0gd8r1v

Questions99 · 15/09/2023 08:59

Can couple counselling work wonders? DH and I are still in decline and just when I think our communication can’t get any worse, after a disagreement last week (about home insurance 🙄). As he stomped out of the room and up the stairs and in full earshot of both DCs, he apparently said “what a useless piece of shit!”.
I didn’t actually hear him, but the kids did and my DD asked why Daddy would say that about me 😪 I had no words.
I confronted him the next morning when DCs were out. I was physically shaking, heart pounding and mouth dry. The physical fear I feel just trying to confront him on anything is real.
He looked ‘caught out’, said “I don’t remember that but I apologise if I said that and will explain to DC”.
He then went on to say he only said it because I frustrated him, because he didn’t understand what I was saying about the insurance.
I said “I need to stop you there. You’re blaming me for what came out of your mouth. Can’t you just say the words I’m sorry?” Then he got really mad, eyes wide, flailing hands and shouted “now you’re just telling me off!”. I left the room. Went to my room and cried.
This is just the latest in an ongoing series of incidents. We are in a perpetual cycle of arguing, silence, tentative politeness.. until the next trigger.
Two days later, after silence and avoiding me, and as if nothing happened he makes me a cup of tea and puts a wildlife show on tv (he knows I love wildlife and usually hogs the remote and watches absolute rubbish he knows I hate).
He is content in this pattern (which was how his parents were), because as another poster said - he doesn’t have the tools to fix anything in a different way.
The problem is I am so wounded now after months of this, with no genuine apologies or sign of change, or even a recognition that arguing twice a week isn’t normal.
I have written him a text (not ideal to text him but talking descends into arguments 99.9% of the time).
Does anyone else try and communicate on text about relationship issues? How does that go?
I am hiding in a coffee shop about to press send because I am scared to be at home when he reads it. I’m also scared of how he will respond but I also know I’ve written it VERY carefully and thoughtfully, not accused him or blamed him. No drama or over-emotive comments (much as the first 1000 drafts did!). I have tried to be clinical.
I have asked for a sign that he agrees we’re headed for separation again if we don’t arrest this pattern, and that he is willing to work with me to stop it.
But I worry as ASD, he will read it and not know what I am actually saying or asking him to do differently.
We have talked about going to marriage counselling but we know it would be ME bringing HIM along. Part of me now feels ‘why the hell should I organise it?’
And would it even work if I could get over my pride and organise it?
I am tired, sick with chronic disease, still working full time, and heart broken. I love this man but feel we’re losing each other.
Thanks for reading. Any insights or advice gratefully appreciated!

LoveFoolMe · 15/09/2023 11:04

😔😢

I think you can only change yourself through counselling. You can learn how to change the way you perceive, respond to, communicate and process thoughts and feelings.

What it can't do is immediately change someone else. So it 'works' in that it improves your outlook on life and gives you more control over your life and emotions. You changing might then indirectly alter how people respond to you.

If your partner is open to the process it can do the same for them but you can't force them to change.

DH and I feel we've each benefitted from individual counselling. We've addressed childhood issues and I think we're both happier in ourselves.

In couple counselling I've learnt to pause, give him more space and to clarify what we each really mean. We seem to argue less often, listen better and we both apologise sooner. He seems more aware of when he's crossed a boundary. Our expectations have shifted slightly.

Neither of us is likely to change character or brain wiring though. He is more confrontational than me. He still thinks happiness only comes from academic/career achievement 😕. He has a very 'all or nothing' approach to education. Either full on intensity or washing his hands of the kids entirely. He likes a lot of isolation and doesn't want to be bothered by what seems to him like trivia. He can't instinctively understand things from someone else's perspective. So our parenting is still frustratingly different. Which makes it harder for all 4 of us.

I guess it depends how much time and money you want to put into slight improvements and whether you think you have fundamentally similar/different outlooks and values.

bunhead1979 · 15/09/2023 12:49

@Questions99 sending lots of love. I find a lot of what you have said very relatable. The constant upset, huff then sweep under the carpet. Never dealing with anything. I tried to get my DH to counselling, he went for one session and it was very "my wife made me" which just wasn't going to work.

With regard to the kids side, whenever my DH is an arse in front of them. Afterwards, I take them aside and explain, making very clear it's not acceptable and I am not excusing him but that this is something that he struggles with. Over time the kids see him for who he is.

I think you need to put you first. So many of us here on this thread are chronically ill, that is no coincidence. You need a break. Did you send the text? Keep talking, we are here for you x

Hairymaclaryfromdonaldsonsdairy · 15/09/2023 16:14

@Questions99 so much of this resonates with me. We go through very similar cycles and it's utterly exhausting. We communicate mostly by text if I'm honest, and especially if it's about something difficult/contentious. DP can cope with about 10-15 minutes of discussion max (unless it's his special interest) after which time he switches off and needs to process. It's pointless continuing beyond that point and enormously frustrating as nothing is ever agreed or resolved.

However we conduct entire arguments via whatsapp on a regular basis. Not ideal but it's the only way I can get him to engage. And has the benefit of being written down so it's much harder for him to twist what I say/deny what he said/what I said (which happens often if we speak directly).

Can't offer much in the way of advice but I really do understand how you feel. Big hugs xxx

BlueTick · 16/09/2023 01:10

This reply has been withdrawn

The OP has privacy concerns and so we've agreed to take this down.

Gatehouse77 · 16/09/2023 08:54

I was discharged by my counsellor - they were only interested in whether I had any ongoing trauma from my childhood and DS’ suicide attempt. And I don’t.

I’ve honed and refined my emotional responses since childhood and am very good at compartmentalising. I can deal with a lot of shit thrown my way (mostly supporting others) and be pragmatic. I can let go of a lot.

The flip side is I have also lost any excitement or joy about anything except when in the moment. I’ll look forward to something but don’t get emotional about it because it might never happen. DH has built up my hopes over the years for various things but they fell by the wayside. Small things like a birthday surprise or an evening out to major stuff like travelling around the world.

And now I’m stuck in neutral. All the years spent rationalising my emotions and controlling them (which mostly meant not showing them because “they” would win if did) has been a great survival technique for dealing with the shit. But it balanced the other end of the scale too.

And DH’s diagnoses mean he’s more likely to bounce between the extremes so I have to stay neutral to balance that.

But it’s not enough. I can’t provide the stability (which is what he wants/needs) and jump for joy at his excitement. And, given the intense parenting of under 18s has passed we are struggling to find common interests.

But he chose a fucking boat. Something I’ve never shown an interest in. I suggested we did a holiday first to see if would work for us but he didn’t organise anything and I didn’t see why I should. (Having organised all the family holidays before.) And then the mania hit and he did what he wanted. And now we’re dealing with the consequences. And he’s not happy - despite getting everything he wanted - because I don’t share his joy for the boat.

SpecialMangeTout · 16/09/2023 09:50

@Gatehouse77 very similar here.
I miss being excited about things. Whereas I don’t, not even when I’m the one organising it and it only involve me…

And yes DH has recently done the same than you with the boat but it was a house move for us.
I think the fact it is not going to happen or nor the way he expected it to has sunk in but now he is looking depressed and unhappy. It was his life dream in a lot of ways. Just not one that is manageable just now.

SpecialMangeTout · 16/09/2023 09:55

@BlueTick why did I stay when I have no doubt this marriage has had a negative impact in my health?

Yes boundaries are a reason - I’ve ‘accepted’ the lack of respect way too much and for way too long.
But also in my case, I hang on the hope we could make it work well for too long and now the barriers for leaving BECAUSE of my chronic illness are extremely high. Leaving when you can still work etc… still easier than when you are too disabled to work, even when you have a chronic illness that is affecting you.

Being ill does throw a spanner in the work and there is no way you can deal with something as big as a divorce in the same way than when you are healthy.
I suspect this is the same reason why the rate of abuse of chronically ill/disabled people is so much higher too.

Boxoftricksanstreats · 16/09/2023 10:39

Hi 👋
to say I’m desperate for advice is an understatement

passed and present marriage counselling
I can see that I am living in a DARVO relationship - which the marriage counsellor explores every element of, yet refuses to ‘ label’ it as DARVO abuse.
mostly get on well, similar ways of living and fun… but the toxic level when anything is ‘ criticised ‘ is outrageous
also the absolute never ending jaw droopingly shit responses to anything considered a ‘ mild / moderate or severe crisis is relentless. I often come out worse off for expecting or asking for any support… left feeling annoying, unreasonable, or an argument happens that side tracks away from my original ‘ need’
Yet when life is calm he can be the kindest.
I am never supported consistently. I’m burnt out … can’t keep trying and forgiving.
I need practical advice.
Im seriously contemplating that this is the end for the sake of my mental health.
I need to plan my exit, ducks in a row…

please advise

Daftasabroom · 16/09/2023 10:47

Hi @Boxoftricksanstreats

jaw dropingly shit responses to anything considered a ‘ mild / moderate or severe crisis is relentless

No real advice I'm afraid, but I can add "any family event" to the crisis responses.

You're not alone.

OP posts:
Boxoftricksanstreats · 16/09/2023 10:49

Thank you ….
its bizarre it is like living with two personalities .
kind and caring … until there is an ‘ ask’
and then hideous when he is called out .

Daftasabroom · 16/09/2023 11:07

Yep

OP posts:
Boxoftricksanstreats · 16/09/2023 11:13

What can I do ?
why do you stay?…. Sorry that’s so personal …. I just can not work out of this is normal/ toxic / abusive/ standard/ am I too sensitive/ too demanding

Daftasabroom · 16/09/2023 12:17

Why do I stay? I really don't know how to answer that. I think we're codependent. I have ADHD and recognize that I am emotionally over sensitive. Finances make things difficult. Last DS just off to Uni next weekend, it will be the first time we've spent a normal, rather than special, couple of nights alone together in over 20 years. Watch this space!

I tend to use the term damaging. I know there is no intent, and if she was aware of the damage, she would be mortified. But she is completely oblivious to the effect her behavior has on me.

OP posts:
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