Ignorance is no longer bliss

[WhereAreYouKeir]

I'm pretty confused about what is the best thing to do next and I'd like the sanity of strangers to help give my head a wobble.
DH started to withdraw from family life 17 months ago, it was very gradual and I guess I didn't see how bad it was until this Christmas.
Our boys are 7.5 and 5.5. DH is constantly irritated by the children and me.

To the extent the 7 year old says he's just mean or try to be extra quiet, (no bothering him in the morning).

There's no family time together, he actively avoids us. Hours at the gym, hours on his phone or doing some work project that is not needed (and doesn't warrant extra pay/time off/ recognition.) Basically avoiding us for hours.
He doesn't eat with us but will come in mid-meal and have toast leaving the boys to ask why isn't dad eating with us.

DH teaches in a primary school and has refused to look after the boys outside of term time. Just blank refused. He's doing things I'd expect someone to be doing who has no family commitments. London concerts, hours at the gym, hours on his phone. The bloody phone.

I'm the breadwinner and there's no bloody respite.
Work, children, housework, school admin.

Every time I bring something up, he says he wants to leave, says I'm a nightmare and don't make ANYONE happy. He shouts, raises his voice, slams doors, slams plates around, and of course, we all shut up.

He can go days without speaking to me at all.
I've tried to get him help for several months now. He has refused therapy and the GP. I've tried to get him to go to the GP for something else . His parents say they don't want to get involved. They tell me that I need therapy, I must have upset him.

His friends don't see the behaviour. He is super charming, affable, smooth with everyone else very nice. Helps the neighbours . And yet participates in absolutely nothing at home. No chores, no admin, nothing school related.
The boys and me see a very different side to everyone else.

He's ignored me now since Saturday because I pulled him up on shouting at the kids at bedtime. I'm still being cheerful with our boys but I'm ignoring his sulking for now.

Do I give him a deadline for seeing the GP or therapy? Every time I go out with the boys, I see parents working as a team to manage their kids and I get angry, with myself for not being able to change this shitshow that my kids are seeing.

First things first, he's pretty obviously cheating...I've never known a man to be avoidant from family and on his phone or laptop constantly that isn't cheating. Secondly, as above has said the behaviours towards both you and your sons are emotionally abusive and you need to leave the situation for the sake of your children. Continuing to raise them in such a toxic environment will only cause significant harm and need for therapy long-term.

Every time I bring something up, he says he wants to leave

This is it really. Why are you trying to make him stay, talking about therapy etc. He wants out. Trying to force him to stay is not working!

Sit down with him and go through an exit plan. I’m guessing he will be relieved and you and your kids will then get a better quality of life also.

How can you want to stay with someone who talks to/about your children like that? They are picking up on it and will grow up with a firm belief that there's something wrong with them.

Rather painful question following...Have you considered why you are desperately clinging on to someone* who no longer loves you (and possibly your children)?

*And who is also being a dick rather than an adult/husband/father.

@WhereAreYouKeir, you and the children are victims of domestic violence. This bullying abuser shouts and slams doors and slams plates, despising and terrorizing all of you.

Please stop clinging to this train wreck. You must face the truth that your little boys are being severely abused and neglected, and this trauma will have
far-reaching ramifications in their lives.

Take control and tell this brute to leave.

Please consider contacting women's aid for practical support and advice.

Make an appointment with a decent solicitor asap;you don't have to act on any advice they give if you don't want to but being aware of your legal rights here is a powerful tool.

As for his parents;they are awful people;if I knew my son was abusing my DIL and grandchildren I wouldn't stand by and let it happen.

OP, I'm so sorry. You have obviously been amazingly loving and patient but unless he can change his behaviour and cooperate, there is no point in subjecting yourself, and more importantly you children to his awful behaviour. They need to grow up in an environment where they are valued and loved, not disregarded and dismissed. And so do you.

I would be giving him an ultimatum. Either he agrees to work on his depression and behaviour, comes to mediation/couples/family therapy or he leaves the home, and if he refuses to, then you might have to leave the house yourself. Although you might want to stay, in my view it's more important to remove your children from such negative behaviours which can be so damaging for them.

Perhaps you can make a list of all the bad behaviour he needs to amend/work on, such as doing child care and housework during the holidays, sharing the housework during the term time, joining you all for meals, not shouting at the children, not giving you the silent treatment, reducing time at the gym, not going to London on his own for concerts (why doesn't he take the kids with him?) Repairing and re-evaluating his role within the family, spending his leisure time with you and the kids and reducing his screen time. He needs to make improvements in all these areas and you need to hold him to that. There need to be clear steps towards these goals if you are to stay together as a family.

He has strayed very, very far from what his role as partner and father should be and you need to be honest with him about this and ideally he needs to recognise this and be honest with you about why this has happened. It doesn't sound like he's able to talk to you about what's going on without just shouting or blaming you or giving you the silent treatment, so couples therapy seems to be a good option at this point, if he will cooperate. If he refuses to cooperate, you know what you will have to do.

It might help if you confide further in this friend, or some of your other friends. It's a good start to come on here but I think you also need to acknowledge in RL the situation you are in and work out what to do in the event he a) cooperates or b) doesn't cooperate. At the moment you are allowing yourself to be victimised, abused and be made helpless. This is a terrible life lesson for your children to see. Not only that, but by staying in this situation, you are allowing your kids to be victimised and abused by your husband and if you do not change the situation, they may grow up to see this as a failure to protect them and a betrayal.

You sound like a lovely caring and sensible mum who is caught up in a horrible situation and I hope you can find your way through it. Good luck OP.

These are pretty classic signs of an affair, OP. But he will want to have you be the bad guy by throwing him out, as he won't want to face up to the social disapproval of him leaving.

Then sure as night follows day, he will "meet" someone else extremely fast.

Time to put your children and yourself first.

Never mind if it’s an affair/depression…. He’s abusive and wants you to end it. (Then he will blame you for breaking up the family to all his friends and family so be aware).

Its horrible living a life walking on eggshells but particularly for your poor boys.

Get rid. (And the usual MN thing of you sorting out your legal/paperwork behind his back. See a solicitor etc).

You and your sons deserve so much better and will be happier without him. 💐

This happened to my cousin, she was with her ex partner around 7 years they had 2 kids, we had always noticed he was abit egotistical but his family thought he could do no wrong. It turned out he was emotionally abusive to her for years always avoiding family interactions, being nasty and spiteful. She ended things and within about 2 weeks he had moved another woman in also who had just left a relationship and also had kids. My cousin is now a manager within her job and has moved her kids into a really nice house and area and he's been on and off with his mistress. Her children have also stopped the aggressive behaviours they were displaying that made her end the relationship in the first place.

Agree you should ask him to leave. His behaviour towards your children is damaging for them.. I had one parent who we had to walk on eggshells around and it was awful - took me a long time as an adult to see that you don’t need to live life quietly and meekly.

You sound like a brilliant mum. He’s selfish beyond belief and not good enough for you or your boys. Stay strong xxxx

If he feels ashamed if DS's reading level, then he could be putting hours into reading to the boys & having them read to him instead of hours on his bloody phone.

If you're the breadwinner, he's the golden boy & they think you're the one who needs therapy, TWAT can go & live with his parents. Or one the friends who think he's such a great guy.

Do this FOR your kids, living with him is messing them up no end.

you deserve so much better for yourself, but you have choices, your poor boys do not.

Sometimes, who they really are is not fully apparent for years. That was my experience. But as Oprah said “when they (do) show you who they are, believe them.”

It sounds like he's having an affair?

My lovely, he doesn't want to be there with you and the children.
He's checked out mentally from being a husband and father.
Please tell him it's time to separate for all your sakes.
You will be a lot happier without him destroying your confidence.

I would record his behaviour.

Sounds like a pretty toxic environment for everyone. It's awful when a child feels they have to be quiet or can't express themselves because of an adults behaviours. You said he says he wants to leave.. Why hasn't he? What's making him stay?

It sounds like your more trying to fix him by speaking of therapy rather than accepting the situation as it sounds like it is, which is he wants out of the relationship.
Has he had mental health issues before which have resulted in these situations but been helped with therapy?

It's important to remember that your children are watching and absorbing so what you allow or accept is what they will see as 'normal' or they will end up resenting you both for the situations they know are not.
That's not to scare you or feel bad but just a gentle reminder as I have no doubt you will do and do do what you think is best for them.

Have you thought about therapy for you, you sound concerned over his mental health but what about yours? If your putting up with being treated this way maybe it would help with your self esteem and value as it sounds like he doesn't treat you with any respect.

There’s is absolutely nothing positive for you in this. He sounds like a complete waste of space. I think you need to accept the marriage is over and file for divorce. Your boys will really be damaged by his behaviour apart from anything else. Do it for them if not for yourself.

This there is marriage ending. A pp suggested getting a private Tutor for your 7 yo. I would do this. It will both help your ds and give credence to claims that your husband has checked out of parenting. I would gather any information you have to support that he breached the agreement including childcare bills over the holidays, any chats you may have in writing that he agreed to have the kids…

Sorry about the bold. Idk how to remove and my iPad isn’t working properly so don’t want to redo.

He isn’t invested in the marriage nor his role as a father. Being on the phone so much probably means he is chatting/texting another woman who is very interested in (hence why he is sulky with you).

💐

He’s not a depressive. He’s an arsehole. For the sake of your boys and your sanity you need to get a divorce. From the way you’ve told it,forget any therapy or marriage guidance. That ship has sailed. He needs to go

Yup, definitely another woman somewhere on the scene.

OP I'm in a difficult relationship myself and understand your hesitation to kick him out. Ignore the guilt trippers going on about 'facilitating abuse'. It's not as if separation in itself would stop him hurting the kids, and you aren't the guilty party here.

That said, he sounds like a grade a bastard - blaming you for not making ppl happy on top of everything else, the cheek - and kicking him out does sound like the way forward to me. I'm sorry.

see a solicitor now …. He needs to go.

I personally doubt anything you’d do would make much difference, he’s checked out of your marriage. I would be asking him to leave.

A GP can’t fix what’s wrong with this man. He’s been an absolute prick. You need a divorce, and the kids do too.