What should you not do as a girlfriend until you become a wife? Parameters?

[piddocktrumperiness]

Just that really- I was having a conversation with some friends; none of us are married but some are in relationships; some live together and some don't, and we got talking about what we won't do for our partner unless they committed and got married.

I quickly realised that the concept of gf and wife for me was a little more fluid, as I was married before and only really knew what being a wife meant, and now that I am in a relationship, albeit not married, my behaviour has not really changed that much. This got the debate going and not two ladies could really agree on what the parameters are.

It got me overthinking, as I do not want to be doing too much for someone and being taken advantage of, as I was in my marriage (ironically)

For context, I have been in a relationship with DP for 2 yrs, we don't live together. We have kids from previous relationships, and do not plan on having kids together.
Aside from the financial/security stuff of being married like buying a house or having kids, are there parameters? what are they?

You don't need to spend a fortune and have a big wedding to get married. Your 'posher' relatives have no doubt realised you're financially at risk if you have children without it.

So depressingly true.

I made it clear to DH before we were married that I wouldn't be having children if we weren't married and if we bought a house, as the main earner, I wouldn't be putting the house in joint names.

Post marriage, while I completely agree about wifework, I do think there's a difference in family dynamics. I expect DH to do the bulk of effort and thinking for his family, but we're married now so I consider them my family too and I absolutely expect to be part of that and helping. And it goes the other way too - I might take MIL shopping but Dh will get up at 4am to collect my dad from the airport.

Get married

Anal.

I’m not sure how I’m the one that’s coming across as sexiest here as it wasn’t me that thinks there is a difference 😂. I’m equally baffled. That’s why I posted the question.

The posts on here kind of prove the point that no two really can agree and that there are parameters- I don’t see an issue helping my partner pick out gifts by suggesting them to him. Don’t really see an issue sending a card to his parents nor do I see an issue wrapping presents. They’re things I enjoy anyway, do a much better job at and would probably do if we got married.I’ll work to my strengths and I expect him to too. I might cook an odd meal as again, I enjoy it but I won’t pick up after any man or do chores, silly errands or whatever that weighs me down. Ring or no ring.

I do think the narrative of wife duties is a little toxic as a pp said and it’s worrying that younger woman think like this.

I think it should be 50/50 whether you are living together or married. No one should have more ‘spare’ money or time than the other. Agree to be married before children.

However I think the biggest change is if one partner becomes a STAHP. Things obviously change as that person arguably has more time and opportunities to deal with home keeping and admin.

This is when the STAHP (mostly wives), needs to make sure this is not the slippery slope to an unequal marriage.

In my case when we both retired my ex thought it meant I carry on as before (cooking, cleaning, washing, garden, pets etc), while he solely did his hobby and attended to his social life.

Neither partner should do a bait and switch after marriage.

Work out what works for both of you before marriage. Keep that up upon marrying.

Sudden refusal or withdrawal from an aspect of your partnership, or an expectation of more from a partner once married, is a recipe for a short marriage.

I would not have joint finances. Nor would I buy anything jointly on credit in one person’s name.

I didn't combine finances (everything was 50/50), or have children. Didn't plan to buy a house until after but family circumstances meant our wedding was delayed by almost a year so our house purchase had gone through by then.
I didn't run his errands, organise his family life etc and I wouldn't as a wife either.
Joint names on Christmas cards (which we sat and wrote together) and presents, after we lived in together, although he bought for his family and I bought for mine

I think too many believe it's just a piece of paper until the shit hits the fan. If you separate (even with children) you can be seen as a lodger and effectively made homeless overnight. If he/she dies try arranging a funeral if you're not the next of kin. Their family may now own the home you're living in.
I have a friend who was with her partner for twenty years. Her fiancé died very suddenly two days before the wedding. His adult children made her homeless, banned her from the funeral and wouldn't even tell her where his ashes were scattered.

I wouldn't be obeying a boyfriend. Or having sex with him.

I am similarly baffled by the concept of marriage coming with “wife work”
It doesn’t seem healthy for a relationship for the goal posts to be moved as sons as you are walking down the aisle or into a registry office.

It's not "old-fashioned thinking" or "mercenary". If you've managed to protect yourself financially without marriage then that's great, but many women don't.

They don't realise the implications of going part-time/giving up work when they have dc, or maybe they don't have much earning power, or they don't have supportive partners. You see it all the time on here; women have prioritised bringing up their families, and then realised too late that they don't have a decent career or pension and that they are not entitled to any financial support from their partner in the event of the relationship breaking down(even if he was in favour of them being a SAHM).

Marriage gives legal protection in these cases. Please don't discourage women from seeking that protection by calling them mercenary. 🙄

File for divorce.

Or this case, this woman’s partner (not married) passed away and she wasn’t joint owner of their home. So someone else has inherited their home lock, stock and barrel and her and the four children she had with her partner will be homeless by Christmas.

”A mum-of-four claims she and her children face becoming homeless after being evicted from their home in Tameside following the sudden death of her partner.

Sarah Ryan, 36, has been told to leave the home she'd lived in with her partner of 17 years after he died following a short illness with cancer in August this year.

Ms Ryan, and the couple's four children who range from the ages of 13 to four, have now effectively been left homeless just weeks before Christmas….

Michael passed away on August 23 this year, leaving behind his devastated partner and four young children.

He had previously owned the house they shared in Droylsden, but on the day of his funeral, Sarah claims she received a letter from the joint owner of the property informing her she was being evicted.

After attending a court hearing at Manchester Civil Justice Centre on Monday 21 November, the mum was told she has 28 days to vacate the property - and find somewhere else to live.“
www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/grieving-mum-four-kids-facing-25577239

I had a child out of marriage and two children in. I didn't want to get married before DS1 was born as I didn't want to marry my XP! This should probably in hindsight have been a sign the pregnancy wasn't planned though. Actually maybe I did want to marry him at one point. We were engaged because I remember getting engaged and then immediately finding out I was pregnant and it kind of overshadowed the engagement a bit.

I don't see any difference. I got married because I wanted us to be legally seen as family. I didn't change anything, but it does feel slightly different, more secure. I'd say that security feeling started when we got engaged, though. And even though I'd been engaged to XP, we'd never planned a wedding, it didn't feel like we were actually engaged. I think he just asked me because I told him to I was very young.

DH and I did not TTC until after we were married. When we got engaged it was much more serious, he had a whole thing about the reasons why he felt I was the person he wanted to spend his life with, I didn't immediately reply because it threw me, I had questions, we discussed it, I realised he was also that person for me, so I said yes. That felt meaningful. But the feeling came first. That commitment to each other was there, the marriage was making it official to outsiders/authorities.

Stuff like - before we got engaged, he moved country for work and I said go, don't wait around for us, we would love to join you, but I'll not hold you back. There was some back and forth and I was reluctant to move DS1 over there if we were likely to split up and come back again. Then now-DH said that although he didn't want to come back to the UK, if we moved over and I hated it or was homesick, he'd move with me because we'd be a unit and that's what you'd do. So I think that was the moment where it felt like we were "life partners" whereas previously when I was happy for him to go and chase his dream effectively without me, we were more BF/GF.

Is the holding stuff over the head in return for a ring maybe a hark back to no sex before marriage? Like a way to have influence if you don't feel you have an influence otherwise?

Only thing I do now I am married that I wouldn’t do as GF is all his washing. Now he’s my husband I loveeee doing his washing and putting it away all neatly 😊

I've been with DP 8 years and wouldn't take on booking appointments for him or sending cards to his family even if we were married! The only thing that would change is financial/logistical stuff but I can't see what we're willing to do for each other changing just because we're married. For me it would be more the length and level of investment in a relationship that determined what I would be willing to do for my partner.

I was living with my DH for 10 years before we got married. Our day to day living hasn't changed. He is responsible for Christmas and birthday presents for his side of the family and I am for mine. I will quite often wrap his presents for him as I quite enjoy it - but he will quite often post mine for me so it's swings and roundabouts. We are older and both have grown up children, but I wouldn't have had children without being married - marriages seem to break down very easily nowadays but I think it gives an extra element of security.

Well said! I wasn't married, had no desire to be. I so wish my kids had my surname, their father has barely anything to do with them and doesn't deserve to share a name with them.

Also the gifting, sending cards and making appointments - I took care of all of this (plus worked, plus single handedly took care of the house and the children)

What a mug I was.

I'm now in a long term relationship with a proper functioning, independent man and regret all the years caring for my ex man-child.

Not clear who is the joint owner
She could be joint owner married or not
Is not clear how marriage would protect if the house was anyway half owned by someone else ?

I don’t think a girlfriend (particularly if you don’t live with DP) should be doing ANY of those things. Half of them, I don’t do for my husband.

Does your DP come to yours and do the cooking, help you pick out gifts for family, wrapping and decorating, help organise your home, planning, some admin , that kind of stuff? If not, then what are his ‘boyfriend duties’? Does he have any?

Does he send Christmas cards to your parents from him? Does he organise joint gifts to them?

I don't think I'd behave any differently. I certainly wouldn't be picking up his responsibilities like shopping for his family's presents or doing his admin for him. He's an adult and manages quite well now. Why would I start doing those things for him?