Friend told me off

[Samibgton]

My friend exploded at me today for my faults (being chronically late) and basically time blindness. I am generally 5-10 mins late for things and it is probably my key flaw. It is definitely an ADHD thing and is not ok. I am working to address it. I am otherwise I am told a good friend. Caring, generous, a good listener. Very non judgmental and really try hard to be sensitive.

it was humiliating how shes addressed it tho and she knows I would never dare mock her for her faults. This is not the first time I’ve felt her try to exercise superiority towards me.

am I being too hasty in trying to cool the friendship? We are close but sometimes I don’t trust her or like her that much

Abso-blummin-lutely! Especially if it's effecting your own mental well being and making you beat yourself up even more that you likely already are.

Read up on ADHD. It's not the importance of someone or something. It's not that simple. I leave 95% of really important work project until the 11th hour. That criticality, that "emergency" feeling is how my brain works. It's not whether something is important or not. It's that emergency feeling that often for many ADHDers that motivates (oh how I wish I could be motivated to do things BEFORE they become critical!!!)

The ADHD mum (@DucklingDaisy) who suddenly "can" hasn't suddenly found a new method that no other ADHDers have been able to hone. For her the sense of letting her kids down creates the sense of urgency she needs to get motivated to do what needs to be done. That mostly works for me now I have kids. But not always. I still let them down occasionally and feel awful (not downloading a performance video before a deadline for example). I guess the longer an ADHDer has kids the more one realised that even that may not be the fix-all for some of those time blindness challenges.

@Eleganz also I believe anxiety is about the way one responds to situations/external factors and indeed there may be mechanisms (mechanical tools etc) that can help one manage them. ADHD is more about actual chemical pathways in the brain. Medication may work for some. Tools and strategies may work for others. For some it's always an uphill battle and a major challenge to just stay on track with day to day activities. Neither anxiety or ADHD is easier to manage. But to conflate how coping strategies for one issue can be easily transferable to another is simply untrue.

I’m 99% sure she doesn’t have adhd

“So cut someone out of your life for being intolerant?”

@HKM2B Abso-blummin-lutely! Especially if it's effecting your own mental well being and making you beat yourself up even more that you likely already are. and you see no problem with matching intolerance with intolerance? Why is that?

What other option is there, if the OP can't help the way she is, and her friend can't tolerate it??

What other option is there, if the OP can't help the way she is, and her friend can't tolerate it?

I'm pretty certain OP has already cut that friendship off and not because her friend can't tolerate the way she treats her but because the OP cannot cope with any criticism

Wow, this sort of hang-up is worse than someone being 10 mins late!

What do you, The Great Keepers Of Time, do when the bus is 7 mins late? When the GP sees you 36mins past your scheduled appointment time? When the flight takes off 2h 23mins late? When the ads before the movies run for 20minutes? When you have to wait in A&E for 13 hours? When the builder turns up 48 minutes past the agreed time? When the parcel arrives a day late? When someone says "it will only take a minute" but it ends up taking 12 and a half?

Do you blow up, or do you just accept that the world is run by deeply disrespectful ADHD-ers? 😂

And no, I have never heard that saying. Do you eat an apple a day and have never been to the doctors by any chance?

@QueenCamilla

thankyou for the reality check!

im just remembering when we didn’t have mobile phones and arranged to meet someone in n the 1990’s. I remember waiting 1-2 hours at a train station for a friend to turn up. When she arrived lots of kisses and sorties and off we went. Slightly long in some cases but completely normal in 1990’s and no phone to check / text. This used to be normal - ADHD or not! The world is so fast paced now the expectations have changed. I know I have changed too and I’m always on time as I do understand the feelings lateness causes.
I do remember though after first baby not being able to get myself together at all. In fact ive never really been same since. Life got so fast that I ended up constantly late bit hating it as don’t like it. Guess my point is that it’s not intentional.

• sorries not sorties

I have ADHD, being punctual helps me to control my personal space&time.

What helps me to control my personal space&time, is not needing to be anywhere at a particular time.

A timed appointment (particularly when presented by someone else) gives me a sense of "entrapment" and loss of control.

A simple sentence from someone such as "We should leave here by 10" can make me very uneasy particularly when there is no factual need to actually do so. It's usually the same people whose "Day is gone by twelve" 😁
It appears they get less hours in this life than I do. Must be awful 😂

@ginexplorer I actually liked that vintage where the queue was seen more often than an appointment. Turn up whenever you want/can, join the queue, wait. Never late for anything !

My mum disrespected me when she used to come home late from work. I was waiting as a kid, often by the window, thinking what would happen if she never came home, 22mins past the usual time I was sure she's dead. So disrespectful 😂

A friend turning up an hour late = disrespectful

A friend turning up 5-10 mins late = life

5-10 minutes late is really not a big deal, I don't get why people are so neurotic about it. In fact, I think it is the people making such a fuss about it who are the ones with issues. Inflexible in the extreme! I can't actually imagine arranging a meet-up where split second timing is that crucial. Even if you are going to a show with a set start time, you wouldn't actually be meeting at the start time, but enough time before to get a drink etc, and most people would build in a margin so that if either of you is 10 minutes late it doesn't really matter.
I do have friends who are often late, I know that about them, so I make sure we meet somewhere warm and dry, preferably with seating. If they are late, it doesn't affect anything, and if I am sitting there with a coffee and something to read it is not inconveniencing me. Friendship is about tolerance and respect, not about policing timing. I don't think I would want to be friends with someone as uptight and critical as you describe, OP.

I have two friends who are always late. Friend A has done it to me for 50 years. Generally I just make an allowance and aim to arrive 10-15 minutes later than we agreed. I reckon over our lives I've didn't weeks waiting for her no more.

Friend B similar. Friend for 20 years. She has the habit of fitting in one extra visit, stop off, task before or in the way to meet me. Again I take her ETAs with a pinch of salt.

I think it is rude. I've never had a go but Friend A at least is aware and tries a bit more than in the past.

Because work is the same time every day with the same set of tasks to get ready that generally takes the same amount of time with a static commuting distance which makes it much easier to judge and remember the steps. You generally just get up and then start the getting ready process the same every day.

That said i can still manage to be late occasionally as i don't really form habits and routines that well and can also lose anything - house keys, car keys, shoes, forget to brush my teeth, forget to take my medication, forget my uniform.

I am hyper aware of these issues so try and negate them in advance so for example I will leave most of my stuff in front of the front door the night before (not next to it - in front so I will physically trip over it if I try and leave the house). I'll also keep spare meds and toothbrush in my handbag. I have spare makeup at work, spare socks, hairbands, dry shampoo etc. extra uniforms in the car. I also have a backup (very expensive) parking spot I'll use as a last resort.

When meeting a friend however you have to pick out an outfit that's not part of your standard work / officey clothes which is full of sidetrack potential, actively think about what you need to do to get there followed by feelings of overwhelm if there are too many 'steps' which can lead to not really doing anything whilst also panicking, misjudging generally the time things will take ie. thinking a shower will take 5mins even though its actually 10, plan a less familar journey and try to work out how long it will take (I can be a bit too literal with google maps and forget i need time to park and walk over), forget to pay attention to sat nav and go the wrong way. If the meeting is later in the day say 2pm you may get engrossed in something at 10.30am and then look at the clock and suddenly you have 10 mins to leave so then everything is in a panic. Losing things as you are about to head out. Having to go back and check the door because you have no recollection if you locked it beause it's not part of the normal routine. My working memory will also often just glitch so I'll open a cupboard and then stand there stuck trying to work out what on earth I'm doing for several minutes.

There's just so many additional elements that can go 'wrong'. I'm absolutely terrified of getting old as I have no idea how I'll manage if my memory gets any worse.

Neurodivergent, neurotypical.

Define 'normal' please?

For me, I had similar type of experience with a good friend @Samibgton
basically I'm usually around 5 mins late but it was a mix of times as usually I do try to set off on time,

when arriving sometimes we were ready to set straight off and other times the friend themselves would be late by a few mins or still be getting ready as they were the primary driver.

when i was late it was never intentional just me not estimating my route times correctly.

although sometimes I wonder if there were other factors frustrating the friend, and I just happened to get the frustration so to speak.

she seems a lovley person overall, just puzzling at times.

I take it you aren't a mental health professional? Your characterisation of anxiety is really wrong if you believe it is entirely about response to external situations.

There are many causes for the development of GAD including internal and external factors, internal factors include genetics and the alteration of brain chemistry. This is what I have been told by multiple mental health professionals during the course of treatment for over 25 years since I was diagnosed as a teenager.

Living with GAD unmanaged is about constantly having to deal with intrusive thoughts, the worry and anxiety they cause, loss of focus, lack of attention to the world around you often entirely unprompted by the world around you. When I am in an anxiety spiral I can be sat quietly at home and get anxious because of instrusive thoughts and they can become overwhelming if I don't initiate one of my coping mechanisms. There were plenty of times I have let people down for meetings etc when I was struggling with my disorder so I know what it is like I just feel that people saying that people have absolutely no ability to manage their conditions is just wrong and disempowering.

I have never once suggested using any GAD coping strategies to many ADHD, I'd appreciate it if you would not suggest I have. ADHD and GAD presentations can be so similary that misdiagnosis is a regular occurrence. The treatment pathways for both conditions are very different and the wrong treatment can be harmful.

Bless you. When you put it like that 💐

I have a friend who is late all the time, she jokes about it but it's infuriating. She'll keep people waiting for up to 30 minutes, arrive to appointments 10 minutes late, take her daughter to dance class 15 minutes late everytime. She was bringing a Maccies for lunch to my house for 1pm recently and arrived at 3pm with it! But she's an amazing friend and has been by my side all the way when my mum passed away recently.

Diagnosed as a child, all kinds of issues at school and university and work. I certainly do not have a ‘normal’ brain. I just don’t think it’s beyond us to try and build in extra time as a matter of course, and I think that’s also quite a common tactic neurotypical people use to be on time.

If you are late maybe half the time I think you could put that down to ADHD, if it’s literally every time that seems like a combination of ADHD and not thinking it matters enough to make a concerted effort.

Being 5 minutes late every time, fine. 5 minutes is nothing.

10 minutes late every time is starting to get annoying.

15 minutes+ late every time is taking the piss and incredibly rude!

We all understand there are occasions, late buses, traffic jams etc but these dont happen every time. So you should be on time most of the time.

What I'm hearing on this post though "I'm ND therefore you're simply not allowed to get pissed off with me. It's not my fault, and if you do get pissed off with me you're a bad friend". No-one genuinly seems to feel bad for their lateness just giving excuse after excuse "oh I didnt realise a shower takes me more than 5 minutes". Oh, so that's okay then.

My SIL is chronically late, no ND. I'm talking meant to arrive for a meal at 2pm, not turn up till 9pm and be surprised there is no food and our little kids are in bed. No excuse.

It's one thing to be late occasionally and another to be late all the time. And if you're making your kids late for school and things, well, that's just shocking!! Poor kids.

One question I'd ask myself about friends who are always late to meet me. Are they late for everything? - hospital/doctor appointments, plane flights, job interviews, work, hair appointments? Or is it just for social appointments? Or just for me?

My habitually late friends manage to make some of these other appointments on time so it is possible....