Are those type of money chats strange?

[Furla22]

Please be gentle. I am a late 40s childless woman in a relationship with a man in his early 60s, he has adult children and young grandchildren. He has his property and planning to retire soon. I am happy in my job and work partly abroad. Due to my family arrangements (long story) I bought a large apartment cash and will be soon renovating. I also have other properties. We are not married. DP would like to get married. I don't. My DP is not happy that we keep our finances separate apart from household expenses. He often asks what my plans are with my other properties etc. We live together in a rental - (long story) it is due to work distance and convenience, all outcomes of covid. The apartment I bought I will be refurbishing from my own and my family money, it is in my name only. He wants to contribute to refurbishing (despite not planning to live there). DP also wants us to get back to his house. I don't, because it is his ex marital home, not much has changed there since his divorce over nearly 18 years . I do not feel I need to live there.
I also have an elderly mother (I am the only child) who has a comfortable place and I plan to look after her on a more structured basis. Cutting story short, I do not understand why my DP gets so angry at our finances being separate? Why does he want to contribute to a refurbishment of a property where his name is not on the deeds? Why does he push for marriage his age? There is a lot of 'money chats' around what my plans are. In all honesty I do not have many money plans as I still feel young and with time to make those decisions. DP gets very animated I do not want to consolidate any assets with him etc. Surely he should be happy I am not with him for money (his house/ pension) and take comfort from that rather than getting upset. I welcome your thoughts.

He's trying to bully you into sharing your wealth with him.

He doesn't give up because he's determined to get hold of your money.

Nothing more to say.

Have you got friends or support in real life? You're coming across as very vulnerable to being ripped off/financially abuse and coercive control.
There a million posters on here telling you wants happening and you aren't listening?
Have you ever had therapy before? I think it's time.

You sound lovely OP and that the scales are finally falling from your eyes. However, you need to try and find the courage to take the next step and leave him or you may never know the fun times that could await you. You are in the prime of your life and financially secure. I met my second husband in my 40s, we had a really great time with dates and holidays. You can do it!

@Furla22
You have used the word "powerful" a few times, but in this instance, I think actions are powerful, words are not. I hope you find your power and act.

I suspect it is partly your money (how annoying you won't spend it how he wishes!) but also the status thing. He's actually in a very good position in his own right - close to paying his mortgage, close to retirement etc. I suspect if he found a woman who didn't have a house or much money he would very much be keeping his money to himself.

I would find the whingeing and nagging really off-putting and I would tell him that these are your terms and either he accepts it or you agree to go your separate ways. He may become a lot more distant once he realises you're not going to do as he wants.

If I'm remembering correctly, you say you live together in a rental. I think you need to move back to one of your properties by yourself. Say you need space to think.

Can you give notice on the rental and he move back to his big house? You are still thinking.

Then phase him out because I don’t think he’ll go quietly. In his eyes he will be losing all of his future financial plans so I think he’ll try to cling on.

He's telling you your building a future... Meanwhile the present is feeling rather crap!

Ponder your next move, OP...

I think you're life together doesn't sound like it is bringing you joy.

We are in our 50's and lark about, having fun together. We are both still on the up in our careers and enjoy the stimulation. But also enjoy travel and are planning next adventures. We want a comfortable retirement but don't want to delay living now, we want to enjoy ourselves together.

You are still young, is there enough joy in your life now let alone in his plans for the future?

No joy at all, I actually mentioned here earlier - total kill-joy. No laughter, no romance, no intimacy. I wonder if I will ever feel passion and joy again.
Spending time with my elderly mother is more fun than with my DP. She makes me laugh, we talk for hours, we look at old photos and recall family stories. I love that time.
There could be a beautiful sunny day and DP and I would be out walking enjoying the nature whilst he'd be talking about money and how much so and so paid for fish and chips and how much this or that. I would stop take his face in my hands, try and kiss him, he'd be all distant, I'd smile and say - enjoy this moment just as it is. He can't, he will say I do not listen to him, I don't care about money. He can not enjoy life.
He seems to think you ought to talk and worry about money 24h 365.
Can you imagine this in 10 years him in his 70s me in my mid 50s. How can you not be able to talk about anything else than money. I mean I can not explain to you.

I tried to pin down when did it all start and it was when I bought my property, almost instantly.

Further on kill-joy I remember once we were out and there was live music and an opportunity to dance. I asked him let's dance, he didn't want to and I wasn't allowed to go and dance on my own either. I remember being very upset about it. I love dancing. It was years ago but today I can see it was a big red flag.

I noticed we actually do not do anything fun.
I do not like weekends because he always starts an argument on Friday (every week) that lasts through the weekend and I think this is the controlling manipulative behaviour. If he gets a bee in his bonnet about something then he is in control of the mood for the whole weekend. I will not ask for anything and I am more likely to do what he wants to do, so he gets his way.

I wonder what to do about Christmas presents. I have workflow problems as not much freelance work comes my way at the moment so it can be hard but I always have nice gifts for my DP which some I buy months in advance. This year I left all very late as I have not got money to spend but I have a property so I feel obliged I have to buy something.
I really do feel like a free housekeeper here. He doesn't like housework. I think in his mind I should do entire housework because I earn little. To sort of balance it all. Maybe I am oversensitive but that's how I feel. You know when there is a vibe at home and you can just unpick what is going on.
Because he moans so much about money I actually realised that I go to local hairdressers twice a year only and I do colour my hair at home as I do not want to be frivolous having low income. Mind you he earns a lot and says I can go and treat myself but of course if in the next sentence he will moan about money then I won't treat myself. It's awful.
I do not know how relationships actually look like anymore.

I do think about his ex wife a lot. Wonder what was her story?

I feel sad for you OP. This sounds like a miserable relationship

It sounds like it may be a controlling, emotionally abusive relationship = you are limiting what you do because of what he says or might say, his moods dictate the weekends etc. That's not normal.

Have you thought about talking to a counsellor on your own?

I do not know how relationships actually look like anymore.

I suggest being single for a couple of years to reset your expectations.

Just get him something small for Christmas if you don't want him suspect you're leaving him in the new year. Or don't bother at all. Sounds like he'll be miserable either way! What will he get you?

Oh OP, you sound so unhappy and I’m not surprised given how horrible he is. Please leave and spend some time rebuilding your life and you sense of self. You are so young and have so much going for you.

Please don't give any more of your life to this man. He is not making you happy and soon you will feel it is too late to change anything or he will have a health crises and you'll end up stating by default. You have options to make another life, his family will be more than happy for you to step in to look after him..

I wasn't allowed to go and dance on my own either
(etc)
Erm what?!

This has been an odd thread because on the one hand you can clearly see the issues, and on the other hand you don't do anything about them. For the casual reader on MN, it's like seeing you sitting in a cage with iron bars, and the door wide open, pondering the inside of the cage, when just a few steps would take you outside it into a completely different world.

Now it's becoming clear why: this is much more sinister than some miserable old fucker wanting his hands on your money. This is some miserable old fucker making your life a misery through coercive control. He has eroded your sense of self over the years so that you feel helpless to do anything but dance around his wishes, so that when he is being a supreme arsehole your impulse is to take his face in your hands, and "try and kiss him" instead of telling him to get lost, or better still shooting him in the head.

Please try to put some space between you - literally - as in: go and live in one of your own places and minimise contact with this weirdo who is warping your whole sense of reality. As a PP said, you have everything going for you. There's a world of fun out there, and even perhaps love one day when you have recovered from all this nonsense.

I have to ask what is stopping you from moving out and leaving him?

The more you describe him, the more it sounds like you've been targeted by a con artist. It's like he isn't even pretending to like you anymore.

You sound frozen in place. There's joy in the world. Go chase it instead of withering away and wondering what life will be like with this man in ten years. You have the means. Please go and don't look back.

I really really think you need to see a therapist to help you unpick this.

You seem to be stuck, you know it’s wrong, but you are looking for the ultimate ‘why does he behave this way’. If you could find this elusive answer would it make a difference to whether you leave him or not? If someone posted - oh yes men get to a certain age, see death around the corner and start obsessing about money- would that make you think it’s ok and it’s ok to stay? Maybe you are just looking for a reason to stay (sunk costs), but your head is telling you to leave.

Or do you think if you know the reason why, you can come up with the argument that will stop all his nonsense. For us other posters, looking in and who have been through similar it’s obvious, he doesn’t have your best interests to heart.

It may be that when he divorced he felt cheated that his ex wife got a share of ‘his’ money. She may have married again and had a dozen more children, so he sees the wealth their children would have had, has diminished. Whatever the reason, he thinks his feelings count for more than yours.

You could try saying, yes if we’d had a child I would have wanted to combine assets, but we didn’t, so I don’t.

The ultimate test of having a controlling partner is the feeling that ‘if I could just find the right words, they would understand”. But they understand alright, they just want to get heir own way.

My STBXH is a controlling bully. It took therapy to understand this. Save your Xmas money and pay for a chartered clinical psychologist.

No joy at all, I actually mentioned here earlier - total kill-joy. No laughter, no romance, no intimacy. I wonder if I will ever feel passion and joy again.
Spending time with my elderly mother is more fun than with my DP. She makes me laugh, we talk for hours, we look at old photos and recall family stories. I love that time.

What the actual fuck..... Why are you still with this abusive fuckwit

So many right on point comments here. I am really grateful that strangers come here and post. Feel so lonely and isolated with all this going on. It's been like that for a while and answering why I am still here it is because my earnings are so low. I am doing my best to restructure my work and get additional income but things are not progressing as fast as I'd like. I even wondered why I am struggling financially so much (never did) and I realised that I am so exhausted with all that is going on and feeling so low I have no confidence and self worth and it may actually come across. I don't know.
Yes, I do feel frozen in one place mainly because of money. I think if I could just recover with cashflow I'd be a different person.
Please be gentle but I really do not understand what he wants/ expects from me right now? I committed to have our finances separate, I will not marry him, I suggested we should part. It is clear he will not get his way.
Is he not tired of pushing it so hard?
I could not be more explicit about my 'no'.

He likes his chances of wearing you down and he's used to getting his way.

After all, he can stop you going out dancing, he can ruin every weekend, so why wouldn't he think he just has to keep at you and you'll give in eventually.

Do you girls think mid 40s is young?
I feel so old inside.
Thankfully I still look young and dress youthful so people think I am younger than I am but still inside I feel old.
I ask myself each day - will I ever feel that excitement of being around a nice person, share similar interests, will a nice man cook a nice meal for me and light a candle, put a music on? Kiss me and dance with me? Make me feel like a woman? When I am out and about men would smile or do small talk with me, just a polite exchange and I often wonder 'maybe I am still attractive'.
Beyond sad story but being here helps organise thoughts.

good point

How about you forget men for a while and focus on yourself and your elderly mum. There will be other opportunities for joy in the future - but only if you stop chasing after this useless and controlling man

Yes of course- far too young to be tied to this mean and abusive man.

Get yourself out of there. Thank goodness you are only renting with him so you can walk away quite easily. Spend some time on your own and maybe have some therapy to help you rebuild yourself after what you've been through. The nice man is out there and all these things can happen for you but there's no rush- concentrate on yourself for a bit.

far too young to be tied to this mean and abusive man

(To clarify- no one should be tied to a mean and abusive man, whatever their age.)